Author Topic: The wandering soldier - John Robinson  (Read 298 times)

Offline NevilleTB

  • RootsChat Extra
  • **
  • Posts: 36
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
The wandering soldier - John Robinson
« on: Tuesday 21 September 21 09:55 BST (UK) »
I am researching a soldier John Robinson (1770-1852). I found lots of references to him in family trees and a few sites but something does not add up. He enlisted in the NSW corp in 1791 in England, and came to Australia on the Royal Admiral arriving 1792. He married a convict Mary Hughes in 1794. She died in 1810. I can find no children.

He then became involved with another convict Eleanor McIntire around 1811 but I have not been able to find a marriage record. Eleanor arrived on the Lady Cornwallis in 1800.

In 1810 he was transferred from the 110th Regiment, New South Wales Corp, to 73rd Regiment on 24 Apr 1810. This information comes from another site but seems reasonable. The 73rd relieved the 110th.

John and Eleanor had a child John who was born in 1811 (19/1811    2662/1812) and died in 1813 (3080/1813)

A daughter Eleanor Elllen was born in 1812 (142/1813    2956/1813). Many trees list her birth before John but I can find no earlier record.

This is where it starts to get weird. The 73rd fought at the battle of Waterloo in 1812. I can find no record of him being there. He is then supposed to have gone to Ceylon in 1814/15 although I can find no records again.

Next piece of information is 1816 when an Eleanor McIntire is listed in the convict  muster. The boat is correct for the entry - Earl Cornwallis.

Next piece of the timeline is a reference to John applying to settle in Australia on 6 Sep 1819  Chelsea, Middlesex, England. This came from another tree but I have not been able to verify the source.

The final piece of the puzzle is another reference that he arrived on the Prince Regent on 27 Jan 1820 - He returned with a wife and child after he had been granted permission to settle in the colony. When I checked the passenger list, there was only one Robinson. A convict named John Robinson.

To summarise I have no evidence as to what happened to John Robinson between 1810 and 1820. He may have been at Waterloo, Ceylon or Middlesex and I have exhausted my sources. I would appreciate some guidance from someone more knowledgeable. 

Offline Dundee

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 6,620
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: The wandering soldier - John Robinson
« Reply #1 on: Tuesday 21 September 21 14:28 BST (UK) »

Next piece of the timeline is a reference to John applying to settle in Australia on 6 Sep 1819  Chelsea, Middlesex, England. This came from another tree but I have not been able to verify the source.


There are three items in the Colonial Secretary's Papers

https://colsec.records.nsw.gov.au/

They are available on microfilm in many libraries, via copy service from the State Records, and they are digitized on Ancestry.

He arrived as a free person on the Prince Regent so you are unlikely to find any record of that.  He was an army pensioner so was probably part of the convict guard.

There is a John ROBINSON on the 1828 census, aged 60, a sawyer, came free on the Prince Regent 1820, residence is William CARBESS at Portland Head.  William was a farmer with 20 cleared acres at Mangrove Creek, Lower Portland Head.

John ROBINSON's memorial applying for a land grant in 1820 states that he has a daughter and son-in-law settled on the Hawkesbury River.


He then became involved with another convict Eleanor McIntire around 1811 but I have not been able to find a marriage record. Eleanor arrived on the Lady Cornwallis in 1800.


The 1828 census at Pitt Town has John ROBINSON, conditional pardon, arrived on the Ganges in 1797 and Eleanor ROBINSON, free by servitude, Earl Cornwallis.

Debra  :)

Offline Dundee

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 6,620
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: The wandering soldier - John Robinson
« Reply #2 on: Tuesday 21 September 21 15:08 BST (UK) »
1825 Muster

John ROBINSON, came free, Prince Regent, 1822, Pensioner, Wilberforce
Eleanor ROBINSON, came free, Prince Regent, 1822
Eleanor ROBINSON, 13, came free, Prince Regent, 1822

Debra  :)


Offline majm

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 24,461
  • NSW 1806 Bowman Flag Ecce signum.
    • View Profile
Re: The wandering soldier - John Robinson
« Reply #3 on: Wednesday 22 September 21 01:03 BST (UK) »
OOPS .... I typed up in word - copy paste has missed several lines... see next post.

Likely that burial matches up to the NSW BDM Early Church Record reference 1824, Volume 2B, Line 6206.
…………………………..
St Philips C of E church registers recorded baptisms, burials, marriages transmitted to the NSW Chaplains as per the General Orders issued by Governor Lachlan Macquarie.  So there are events recorded at St Philips that were NOT conducted at St Philips (so at other settlements, not just Sydney Penal colony) and not just Church of England ceremonies.   Volume 2B of the NSW BDM set of Early Church Records does include a broad range,  VDL,  Newcastle, Wellington (NSW),  and other localities, and at least some transmitted by Wesleyans and by lay Catholics.
…………….. 
I am not sure which clergyman conducted the two baptisms listed below, but they are both from the St Philips register, as is the Churching.  I suggest the Churching supports the baby girl born 4 January 1813 and thus she is younger than her brother John born 5 March 1811 and the Churching ceremony also supports the family being C of E.   

John, son of John and his wife Eleanor ROBINSON, born 5 March 1811, baptised 29 March 1812.
Eleanor, daughter of John and Eleanor ROBINSON, born 4 January 1813, baptised 14 February 1813.
Eleanor ROBINSON, Churching ceremony 14 February 1813, St Philips C of E, Sydney. 
(link to a thread that I contributed to re Churchings of women in NSW in the 1810s https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=804886.msg6633579#msg6633579 )

JM

The information in my posts is provided for academic and non-commercial research purposes. 
Random Acts of Kindness Given Freely are never Worthless for they are Priceless.
Qui scit et non docet.    Qui docet et non vivit.    Qui nescit et non interrogat.   
All Census Look Ups Are Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
I do not have a face book or a twitter account.

Offline majm

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 24,461
  • NSW 1806 Bowman Flag Ecce signum.
    • View Profile
Re: The wandering soldier - John Robinson
« Reply #4 on: Wednesday 22 September 21 01:08 BST (UK) »
 ::)  ::)  :-[  :-[

Here's the first paragraph that umm.... missed the post !  so to write...  ::)  ::)  Can I 'blame' the lockdown .... no,  I can blame my specs,  they were NOT on.   ;D 

St Matthew’s C of E, Windsor, burial register
Died 7 October 1824, Eleanor ROBINSON, at Wilberforce,  aged 63.  Buried by Rev John Cross, 9 October 1824 at St Matthews, arrived per ship Prince Regent. 

Likely that burial matches up to the NSW BDM Early Church Record reference 1824, Volume 2B, Line 6206.

JM
The information in my posts is provided for academic and non-commercial research purposes. 
Random Acts of Kindness Given Freely are never Worthless for they are Priceless.
Qui scit et non docet.    Qui docet et non vivit.    Qui nescit et non interrogat.   
All Census Look Ups Are Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
I do not have a face book or a twitter account.

Offline NevilleTB

  • RootsChat Extra
  • **
  • Posts: 36
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: The wandering soldier - John Robinson
« Reply #5 on: Wednesday 22 September 21 09:12 BST (UK) »
Firstly thanks for the work to flesh out John Robinson and his past. Here are some comments on what you have discovered.
  • The source using the Colonial Secretary index is one I had not seen before. Very useful.
  • The three references in the Colonial Secretary document would indicate he applied for land but was knocked back.
  • The daughter Eleanor Ellen married Thomas Crumpton in 1820. I have not investigated this couple as yet.
  • I found the 1828 census where he is a sawyer. Thanks for that tip
  • I could not find the 1825 census information. I searched through Ancestry Library. Is there somewhere else I can look online? Eleanor died in 1824 so I assume the 1825 census was based on information collected before she died in October 1824.
  • I am confused by the reference to the 1828 census having John arriving on the Ganges. That was a convict of the same name. In any case Eleanor died in 1824. I could not track down the source of this Debra. Can you point me to the document? I only found the reference above as a sawyer.
  • The birth and death information is useful and confirms what I suspected. John born 1811 and Eleanor in 1813. I will add your details to my records.
  • In looking at the memorial, and trying to decipher the document, I saw reference to serving in Ceylon. As a separate reply, I will post as much of the document as I was able to translate. There are still gaps in words that I could not understand
  • I found Windsor Stock and Population records that indicate John had 10 acres under cultivation. He has 37 acres in his property and all is cleared. He has 1 horse, 55 cattle and 19 hogs. He had some Maize and Oats and something else which I could not decipher.
    https://www.ancestrylibrary.com.au/imageviewer/collections/8813/images/41720_329549-00270?treeid=&personid=&hintid=&queryId=1593ab82e453d48943f1eab2fb30edb4&usePUB=true&_phsrc=LxO106&_phstart=successSource&usePUBJs=true&pId=17420

So I now know the birth years of the children are correct. John did go to Ceylon. John, Eleanor and daughter returned in 1820 and applied for land but were rejected. Somehow he ended up with 37 acres by 1825.

What I am missing is:
  • What happened to Eleanor when John went to Ceylon? He would have gone 1814/15 and the death of the infant John was in 1815. Since it was registered here, Eleanor must have been in Australia.
    I assume soldiers wives did not travel with them on a campaign. In 1816 there is an Eleanor McIntire listed. Is that Eleanor Robinson using her maiden name? She returned with John in 1820, but I cannot find any record of her leaving Australia in the period 1815 to 1819
  • Did John fight in the Battle of Waterloo with the 73rd? I think not as he was sent to Ceylon in 1815. Waterloo was in 1815. In any case he mentions Ceylon but not Waterloo in his memorial
  • I would have thought there would be some record of his discharge from the army but I have been unable to find anything.
  • What happened to John after his memorial was rejected?
The story is coming together and thanks again for the help. I am still leaning the where to go looking for information and it is great that others with more experience can help.
Neville

Offline NevilleTB

  • RootsChat Extra
  • **
  • Posts: 36
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: The wandering soldier - John Robinson
« Reply #6 on: Wednesday 22 September 21 09:15 BST (UK) »
This is what I have been able to decipher from the memorial. See previous post.

To his Excellency Governor Macquarie
… humble …. John Robinson
….
That your humble petitioner was a soldier in the
 73rd Regiment and went with them to Ceylon from whence
he was discharged commended and ….. the ….
came out to this colony a free settler under the sanction
of Government and … his … here.
That your humble petitioner has a Wife and

Family and …. He is industrious and of rigorous
Habit of …. He fears it will be out of his power to
…. This in comfort with annual exertion.
That your Humble Petitioner therefore is desirous
Of becoming farmer for which he is not unqualified at
Being a …  …. Of providing for himself and
Family and having a …. Daughter and son in law
Already settled on the first branch of the river
Hawkesbury would be desirous if it made Your Excellency
To grant your Humble Petitioner a portion of
Land for cultivation at the first branch of the
River Hawkesbury or elsewhere as may suit
And .. will in daily bound will ….
John Robinson

This is recommended this ....

https://www.ancestrylibrary.com.au/imageviewer/collections/1905/images/32086_228290__0004-00200?treeid=&personid=&hintid=&queryId=e7306b7a00a6fab85da764d586534d8c&usePUB=true&_phsrc=LxO77&_phstart=successSource&usePUBJs=true&pId=94423

Online ShaunJ

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 20,577
    • View Profile
Re: The wandering soldier - John Robinson
« Reply #7 on: Wednesday 22 September 21 09:29 BST (UK) »
The 73rd Regiment had two battalions.

1st Battalion was in NSW in 1810, absorbed a draft of men from the NSW Corps, and went to Ceylon in 1814.

It was the 2nd Battalion that remained in Europe and served at Waterloo.

See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/73rd_(Perthshire)_Regiment_of_Foot

UK Census info. Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Online ShaunJ

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 20,577
    • View Profile
Re: The wandering soldier - John Robinson
« Reply #8 on: Wednesday 22 September 21 09:52 BST (UK) »
I can't find his army discharge papers but there are some pension records of a soldier or soldiers named John Robinson who served in 73rd regiment.

Here's one who resided in NSW and was pensioned from 25 March 1823: https://search.findmypast.co.uk/record?id=GBM%2FWO121%2F0207%2F001_212&parentid=GBM%2FWO121%2F121072960

A pension increase in 1824: https://search.findmypast.co.uk/record?id=GBM%2FWO121%2F0219%2F001_170&parentid=GBM%2FWO121%2F121080769

Also see https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/C10355443

https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/C10364877


UK Census info. Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk