Author Topic: Russian latvia : are these babies born 1887 cousins  (Read 217 times)

Offline brigidmac

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Russian latvia : are these babies born 1887 cousins
« on: Wednesday 22 September 21 11:54 BST (UK) »
Im looking at birth records from jacobstadt
In 1987
3 LANDMAN children were born

Im trying to work out how /if they connect to my direct ancestor Mottel Marcus LANDSMAN b 1816.( Also known as Mordecai Markus)

11july 1887
Tevia LANDMAN
father Tzalel
Owner of a matches factory
 patronym Morduch
 mother Hinda

13 th Aug 1887
LANDSMAN Risa
 father Gershon  shopkeeper
Patronym Yonte .
Mothers given name sheva

18 aug itsak LANDMAN.
Father Ruva
Patronym morduch
Mother Muse.

Im sure Tzalel is son of my ancestor
He has a brother Ruban
So Tevia and Itzik could be cousins

The other known  children Seina/jane + anna were born abt  17 years earlier  mothers name not Muse

Gershon with wife sheva is down as petty bourgeois on another childs birth
Wifes name could be basheva or sheina
If he is also father of  rokhel 1883 .
abe b 1884+ kaya 1888

There is also a gershon-hirsh with patronym Yonte wifes name Khana. Having children from 1877- 1885
Which im fairly sure is a different person

It will take some unraveling
Roberts,Fellman.Macdermid smith jones,Bloch,Irvine,Hallis Stevenson

Offline brigidmac

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Re: Russian latvia are babies born 1887 cousins
« Reply #1 on: Wednesday 22 September 21 12:55 BST (UK) »
I have researched the LANDMAN. Family before with lots of help from rootschatter Justin and others

+ Using the data from christine usdine
Jacobstadt birth marriage and death transcript s

Also i used a site called RADURAKSTI
Information was in russian and ive lost my notes
Some details are on my thread about anglicised names landsman are mentioned on page 5

https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=708410.msg6282575#msg6282575

Main notes are on thread about LANDSMAN  ffrom Manchester to USA i see the spelling LANDMAN was used in Jacobstadt

 https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=736802.msg5826971#msg5826971
Roberts,Fellman.Macdermid smith jones,Bloch,Irvine,Hallis Stevenson

Offline brigidmac

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Re: Russian latvia are babies born 1887 cousins
« Reply #2 on: Wednesday 22 September 21 13:30 BST (UK) »
I will ask admin to merge with the last thread when i have unraveled these children

DNA matches indicate 14 links to mottel landsman via his potential children
My cousins dna links to a jonte LANDSMANN as a son so i will check that line out



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Offline brigidmac

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Re: Russia/ latvia : are babies born 1887 in Jacobstadt cousins
« Reply #3 on: Wednesday 22 September 21 17:16 BST (UK) »
well Ive looked at Jacobstadt lists all day  bmd + divorces

+ have unravelled a tiny knot

also come across some interesting connections on other lines

the marriage records give age of both parties and mothers first names
 and patronym of grooms father which can be the grandfathers firsrt name

divorces give origin of bride and groom

and its all free to access


 
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Offline brigidmac

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Re: Russia/ latvia : arethese babies born 1887 Jacobstadt cousins ?
« Reply #4 on: Wednesday 22 September 21 23:16 BST (UK) »
 I have not confirmed whether these babies are cousins 

The father Gershon Landsman is giving me the most trouble

id really like to pin his details down as dna macthes have variations of that name but differing dates

im not sure if Gershon-hirsh is the same man with two wives or if  its two different men
or one wife with two names !

 gershon -hirsh LANDMAN with patronym yonte + wife khana  on following birth records
1880 moses
1883 rockel

LANDMAN births in Jacobstadt

 1889 rivka no patronym given
1885 gertz-ber is born to gershon patronyn listed as hirsh   mother khana
possible siblings
there is also Soloman born 1877 father Hirsh  mother Khana 
he died age 9 and father is named as Gershon Hersh but no patronym given

 # the shopkeeper is plain  GErshon  patronym Yonte  wifes name basheva  in 1888 for birth of kaya  sheva in 1887 =1886 for risa and yuda 7 1891 for geis eida

there is a marriage for a bas schewa kapkewittsch to gersho landmann in riga 1884 so these births are all probable . 1  tree has her as bessie kaplin


this couple are on a family group i holocaust survivor interviews as paternal grandparents to jascha + jonny landman  son of misha b 1897 with another son adolf b 1885 = other relatives but i cant connect them  their death dates are all 1941 apart from jashka the survivor

# confirmed by LATVIA archives using their alternative spellings given
Gerson s wife Bassheva ( Sheva .Shewe Basse)
Nee Kapewitz(Kapkevitch) born around 1862
Had  children all born jacobstadt/ jacobschtadt 1884- 1887
Sons

 Abe  dec 18 1884
Jude born mar 1 1886
Marcus b 1 jan 1893 d. May 5 1894
Jonte-mordche 17 jan 1897

Daughters
Risa(Rosa) aug 13 1887
Chaie oct 8 1888
Golde mar 26 1890 ((not registered on family composition 1895 so may have died beforr)
Geis eda dec 7 1891
Ente 29 sep 1895
All dates according to julian calendar
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Offline JustinL

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Re: Russian latvia : are these babies born 1887 cousins
« Reply #5 on: Thursday 23 September 21 08:01 BST (UK) »
Hi there,

I have inserted the three additional Landmann cousins into their correct places in my family tree file as attached.

Justin

Offline brigidmac

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Re: Russian latvia : are these babies born 1887 cousins
« Reply #6 on: Thursday 23 September 21 10:15 BST (UK) »
Thanks justin
Just had a mail with letter from son of jascha with pdf from

Latvijas valts vestures archives

Lots of extra info ...street addresses etc
I will forward to you ( can you pls  pm reminder of email address) as ive changed mine)

It would be good to find
Roberts,Fellman.Macdermid smith jones,Bloch,Irvine,Hallis Stevenson