Author Topic: Winifred Emma Knell  (Read 423 times)

Offline Maid of Kent

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Re: Winifred Emma Knell
« Reply #18 on: Tuesday 28 September 21 23:37 BST (UK) »
thank you everyone, this story has certainly given me a lot to think about.
Kidney,Kitney Detling Stockbury Chatham. Wenham Biddenden. Waltham.  Pemble Birchington/St Peters. Sibun Medway Chatham/Gravesend

Offline jaywit

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Re: Winifred Emma Knell
« Reply #19 on: Wednesday 29 September 21 08:55 BST (UK) »
I still think there are 2 Winifred E Knells

So lets work backwards.

Winifed Emma Knell died as Pollard
21/10/1983 address Barton Manor birth given as c 1895
That DOB ties up with our original information.

Henry Graham Pollard died 15/11/1976 address given as Barton Manor dob 7/3/1903

H G Pollard married Kay Beauchamp in 1924, plenty online about this marriage and they didn't divorce until 1972.

  Kay later remarried but only 4 years to H G's death so it looks as though him and Winifred  didn't marry, or married abroad. He did travel abroad a lot so that is a possibility.

Problem I can see is the time period Winifred's surname was changed on the 1939 register, would these changes have been made as late as the middle 1970s?

So is the Clarke / Ayres Winifred a red herring? If so where does the Pollard on the marriage register come from?

I think the more we dig the more confused we become.
Cross Steeple Claydon Bucks,  Jennings Steeple Claydon Bucks,  Steel Byfield Northants,  Rogers Northants,  Wheeler Oxon,  Roberts Oxon,  Bonham Oxon/ Middleton Cheney Northants,  Maycock Northants,  Abbott Northants , Newman Northants, Buckingham Bucks, Hart Warks, Newth Gloucs.

UK Census information is Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline Maid of Kent

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Re: Winifred Emma Knell
« Reply #20 on: Wednesday 29 September 21 09:07 BST (UK) »
Jaywit. I agree I have been going round in circles with this too. The Winifred Ellen is a redherring.

At first I thought Winifred Emma married Clarke who died in 1939 and then married Pollard, but I couldnt find any Clarke/Pollard wedding anymore than Knell/Pollard. Her sister Dieudonne married under the first name Pansy so you can imagine how long it took me to find that. I am now looking into the death  of Dieudonne (Donnie in the cencus). What webs they weave.
Kidney,Kitney Detling Stockbury Chatham. Wenham Biddenden. Waltham.  Pemble Birchington/St Peters. Sibun Medway Chatham/Gravesend


Offline Girl Guide

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Re: Winifred Emma Knell
« Reply #21 on: Wednesday 29 September 21 09:14 BST (UK) »
Just for the sake of it I looked to see how many Winifred E Knell births there were between 1890 and 1925 and three appear.

KNELL, WINIFRED  ETHELWYNNE     FLENDERS 
GRO Reference: 1894  J Quarter in HENDON  Volume 03A  Page 181

KNELL, WINIFRED  EMMA     SWAN 
GRO Reference: 1895  S Quarter in THANET  Volume 02A  Page 928

KNELL, WINIFRED  ELLEN     GREGORY 
GRO Reference: 1920  D Quarter in WEST ASHFORD  Volume 02A  Page 1725

Ashford: Somerset, London
England: Devon, London, New Zealand
Holdway: Wiltshire
Hooper: Bristol, Somerset
Knowling: Devon, London
Southcott: Devon, China
Strong: Wiltshire
Watson: Cambridgeshire
White: Bristol
Windo - Gloucestershire, Somerset, Wiltshire

Offline jaywit

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Re: Winifred Emma Knell
« Reply #22 on: Wednesday 29 September 21 09:16 BST (UK) »
Diew ( spelling)donne Woodward
Death June qtr 1989 Oxford 20/2422
Cross Steeple Claydon Bucks,  Jennings Steeple Claydon Bucks,  Steel Byfield Northants,  Rogers Northants,  Wheeler Oxon,  Roberts Oxon,  Bonham Oxon/ Middleton Cheney Northants,  Maycock Northants,  Abbott Northants , Newman Northants, Buckingham Bucks, Hart Warks, Newth Gloucs.

UK Census information is Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline Maid of Kent

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Re: Winifred Emma Knell
« Reply #23 on: Wednesday 29 September 21 09:18 BST (UK) »
Thank you Girlguide,  'ours' is the middle one. Her mother Ada Mary Swan was one of my grt grandmother sisters.
Kidney,Kitney Detling Stockbury Chatham. Wenham Biddenden. Waltham.  Pemble Birchington/St Peters. Sibun Medway Chatham/Gravesend

Offline bbart

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Re: Winifred Emma Knell
« Reply #24 on: Wednesday 29 September 21 09:55 BST (UK) »
Problem I can see is the time period Winifred's surname was changed on the 1939 register, would these changes have been made as late as the middle 1970s?

It was updated until around 1991.
There SHOULD have been a date in the same colour ink as the new name, put in the left hand column to signify the date of marriage/name change.  (That is why on women that have married several times, you will see green, blue, or red ink pairings of dates and names).  From memory, there was no date on Winifred's.

I'm thinking they never got married as he was still married.   Maybe after the first marriage was "dissolved"  they got married if it was important to them by then, perhaps in another country,  However, Winifred would have been 77ish by then; they may not have bothered.

Offline Girl Guide

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Re: Winifred Emma Knell
« Reply #25 on: Wednesday 29 September 21 10:26 BST (UK) »
I'm inclined to agree with bbart in that they never married and Winifred just called herself Pollard.

She died after Henry so the informant may not have known her exact birth date hence the about 1895 on the death record.  The informant may also not have known about her second name.

You may like to consider getting the 1983 death certificate although it is not obtainable as a pdf.

We can certainly discount the 1894 Winifred, she died in 1912

KNELL, WINIFRED  ETHELWYNNE     18 
GRO Reference: 1912  S Quarter in WHITECHAPEL  Volume 01C  Page 282







Ashford: Somerset, London
England: Devon, London, New Zealand
Holdway: Wiltshire
Hooper: Bristol, Somerset
Knowling: Devon, London
Southcott: Devon, China
Strong: Wiltshire
Watson: Cambridgeshire
White: Bristol
Windo - Gloucestershire, Somerset, Wiltshire

Offline Maid of Kent

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Re: Winifred Emma Knell
« Reply #26 on: Wednesday 29 September 21 11:16 BST (UK) »
1939  her name was crossed out in Red, what does that exactly mean please? no date.
Kidney,Kitney Detling Stockbury Chatham. Wenham Biddenden. Waltham.  Pemble Birchington/St Peters. Sibun Medway Chatham/Gravesend