Author Topic: James Venemore and Harriet Pike/Venemore  (Read 2180 times)

Offline bbart

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Re: James Venemore and Harriet Pike/Venemore
« Reply #36 on: Thursday 07 October 21 06:32 BST (UK) »
As Harriet is not my direct line, I have to stop somewhere when it comes to certificates.

I absolutely understand!

I believe this 1910 death of James Croxmore Venemore to be Harriett's husband.
I thought the GRO would send a link I could pass on, but it doesn't work that way! I have downloaded it, so if any of you is interested in seeing the original, pm me your email.

District of Leighton Buzzard  Sub District: Leighton Buzzard

When and Where Died
19 Jan 1910 at Thomas Street, Heath and Reach, RD Beds

Name and Surname (as they wrote it, with a space, as if it were a dual surname)

James 

Croxford
Venemore

Male
29 years

Baker, journeyman

Cause of death
tubercular phthisis haemorrage certified by (Reg S ?) Pearson

Signature, Description, and Residence of Informant
S. Kempster, mother, present at the death
Thomas Street, Heath and Reach

Registered 20 Jan 1910


James' father, George, died age 36 Q4 1890 Leighton Buzzard  (b. 1853)
James' mother, Sarah, remarried to George Kempster, a widowed boot/shoe maker in 1894.  He lived on Thomas St. well before he married Sarah, and you can see them both there in the 1901.

George Kempster died in 1907,

I believe James returned to England before the birth of Percy.  If you look at Percy's birth reg, an occupation of housewife was entered for Harriet.  This line was only to be filled out if the mother was single/ widowed, or in Harriet's case, with no support.  I looked well back and forward in the birth regs. to see if it could have been a slip, and I don't believe it was.

I read the entire 1906 new Immigration Laws looking for anything to help.  The 1906 laws came in because at least 10 large charities in England were sending tens of thousands of people to Canada, most of which were not employable, and at that time there was an economic depression in Canada, and massive unemployment.  Canada could not stop them from sending these people, so in the new laws, Canada could deport them for up to 2 years after arrival, and it was the shipping company that brought them over that would have to take them back to the port they left from.
If James had arrived sick, he would be DETAINED in the ship logs, not TO BE DEPORTED.  So his "fyle" number, as it was called, could have been written on his passenger list anywhere up to 2 years after arrival. However, unlike a the zillion other passengers that were to be deported that I tried to trace, they all had dates on them.  There was no date on James'.

Looking again at Harriett's return, she was on a mail/cargo ship, that could handle a small number of passengers.  3 of those other passengers listed were being deported.  Harriet and children were not listed as such.

This leads to me to ponder if James fell into the small group of immigrants that ASKED to be deported.  There was a small number of, in normal times, highly employable men that immigrated, could not find work, ran out of money while they looked for jobs, and by asking to be sent back, they could get passage home on the promise of repaying the government at a later date.  The idea was, they would return to England, make some money, and either send for their family, or return and try again.  It is the only thing that makes sense when the whole family was not sent back.

We will never know for sure, unless we can find his return passenger list with something helpful, but he may have gone back on some mail steamer that lost its passenger list, or is not transcribed.  Or his name is just so badly spelled it is beyond the search engine's ability to find him.

Somehow, Harriet got word of James' death, and somehow she was able to get tickets home.

Sarah Kempster died later in the year of 1910, which is why I suppose Harriet had to resort to the Workhouse for a while.

Harriett certainly had a hard time right from the get-go.  Very sad story.

I am sure I had some other minor tidbits that tied all this together, but this is enough for now!







 


Offline Rishile

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Re: James Venemore and Harriet Pike/Venemore
« Reply #37 on: Thursday 07 October 21 08:35 BST (UK) »
Oh Wow bbart - that is amazing.  The level of research you have done has blown me away.  Thank you so, so much.  I just wish James was in my direct line. 

There are some very interesting stories in this family - mostly unearthed by Pennines - hence how she is so well-informed.  I know she will appreciate your input.

Thank you again
Rishile
Stoneham - Kent / Essex / Herts / Bucks / Devon
Pike - Kent
Pay - Kent
Swan/Swaine - Herts / London
Bissenden - Kent
Chappell - Herts
Hammond - Essex

Offline Pennines

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Re: James Venemore and Harriet Pike/Venemore
« Reply #38 on: Thursday 07 October 21 08:39 BST (UK) »
Oh bbart -- what fantastic information you have uncovered with this case. So much research you have done also.

Poor Harriet. What a nightmare she went through.

Thank you so much for your very informative post. I know it's not my 'case' - but I was fascinated by the mystery.

It does make you wonder how she managed in Canada with 2 babies and no husband present to support her.

bbart you are an absolute star for doing this and kindly sharing the information you have found.
Places of interest;
Lancashire, West Yorkshire, Southern Ireland, Scotland.

Offline bbart

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Re: James Venemore and Harriet Pike/Venemore
« Reply #39 on: Thursday 07 October 21 09:45 BST (UK) »
No thanks needed;  my curiosity about James led to a need to know more about what Harriet was going through. And as always, this was a group effort!

I'm going from memory here, but those Goodwin children that Harriet was with in the 1911 census appear to be the children of Captain William Goodwin (mariner; captain of a barque) and Ann Wildish.  From memory, Ann died 1907ish, so it could be that Harriet was hired to take on the household/child care as he would have been at sea.  What a handful for her.... I can't even imagine.  Perhaps it was just too much for her, as again from memory, I think it was 1912 for the workhouse records.


Offline Pennines

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Re: James Venemore and Harriet Pike/Venemore
« Reply #40 on: Thursday 07 October 21 10:03 BST (UK) »
Hi bbart -- I know how you feel about being curious regarding a case.

As Rishile mentioned, I had been looking at her enormous Pike family with her, off this site. I had wondered who the Goodwin children were in 1911.

Harriet did go on to remarry and have children with her second husband. Her second husband Frederick C Clark became a Railway Crossing Keeper and in 1939 - Harriet, now a widow for the second time -- clearly took over from him and is shown as a Railway Crossing Keeper living at Gatehouse Cottage, Bridge Blean, near Canterbury. Her married daughter and family are living with her.

It really is a fascinating story and it's great that you have discovered all those additional pieces of information.

This amused me -- it was the first time I had seen a Female Railway Crossing Keeper on records.
Places of interest;
Lancashire, West Yorkshire, Southern Ireland, Scotland.

Offline *Sandra*

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Re: James Venemore and Harriet Pike/Venemore
« Reply #41 on: Tuesday 12 October 21 20:13 BST (UK) »
Just popped in for a few minutes.  Well done bbart that was very generous of you and great research

Regards
Sandra  :)
"We search for information, but the burden of proof is always with the thread owner"

Census information is Crown Copyright  http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

British Census copyright The National Archives; Canadian Census copyright Library and Archives Canada

Offline Pennines

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Re: James Venemore and Harriet Pike/Venemore
« Reply #42 on: Wednesday 13 October 21 16:21 BST (UK) »
Just popped in for a few minutes.  Well done bbart that was very generous of you and great research

Regards
Sandra  :)

Sandra - I SO agree with you. Amazing generosity and research from bbart.
Places of interest;
Lancashire, West Yorkshire, Southern Ireland, Scotland.