Merchant Navy records CR1 CR2 CR10

[HMac]

Each Crew Agreement has a seperate column dedicated to recording the names of Young Persons  under the age of 18 years of age, and account of all Apprentices employed on board during the voyage.
If previously coasting or fishing or apprenticed then they would not be in possession of a Continuous Certificate of Discharge.

Regards
Hugh

[Stirrick]

Thank you again, Hugh.

I feel like I almost know what I'm talking about now. ;-)

[Ray T]

Am I correct in thinking that the only way to inspect many/most of the crew agreements is still to visit some archive in Newfoundland?

[seaweed]

No. The collection of Crew Agreements stored in the Maritime History Archive at the Memorial University of Newfoundland amount to approx 70% of Crew Agreements of British and Empire Ships from 1863 until 1976 . Not Indexed 1951 -1976.
 Approx 10% are at TNA Kew, including all from 1939 -1950.
Approx 10% are in NMM Greenwich including 1861, 1862 and years ending in five.up to 1995
Most before 1860 are at Kew.
Some are in local record offices.
Most after 1977 except the ones at NMM Greenwich have been destroyed.
Crew Agreements are online for the years 1881 (MHA) and 1915 (NMM)

Can you tell us the name and if possible the official number, together with dates, of the vessels you are concerned with?

[Ray T]

Thanks but I’m not looking for any at the moment. It’s just that people are advising Stirrick to search out crew lists and I remembered that, in the days when I was looking, it seemed quite a task as many of the records I wanted weren’t easily available in the UK.

[Andy J2022]

Apologies for  bumping this thread one year on, but it seems sensible to keep all the queries about merchant seaman records in one place.
My question relates to the accuracy of the personal data recorded on a CR2, specifically the man's date of birth. My understanding is that the CR2 was filled in by an onshore clerk, and he would have copied some of the information from an earlier CR2 if necessary. My query relates to a man named Edgar James Jackson. My starting point was his 1939 register entry which gives his date of birth as 24 Nov 1901 and under occupation it says he was an assistant pantryman on the RMS Carinthia with the date 14 Sep 39 which I take to be the date he signed off the crew. On FindMyPast there are 3 CR2s for an Edgar James Jackson Plate Pantry Steward, but with a slightly different dob, namely 29/11/02. The CR2 dated 1937 records him on the Carinthia, so I think it's too much of a coincidence that there might have been two separate pantry stewards with the same name on the same ship. Clearly I want to follow up on the crew agreements but I would like to be sure that I am not following the wrong trail. Should I just ignore the dodgy date of birth?
Incidentally the enumerator has added what appears to be a ship's registration number on the 1939 register entry after RMS Carinthia of 158637, but this is not the same number as recorded on the CR2 for Carinthia (147318 - which is the correct number according to CLIP).
Thanks in advance for any help.

[HMac]

Andy,
Firstly, in the Central Index Register (Fourth Register of Seamen) those cards do contain mistakes and omissions, that is a given. Discrepancies over dates of birth are common so don’t be too strict there.

I have looked at the records and this is what I think based on many years looking at them.

On 12.4.1922 he is serving on the Liverpool registered, DAKOTIAN and has a CR1 card [which were filled in on issue of a Discharge Book, continuation or replacement]. It shows his Dis. A number is noted as 1072182. It is also noted that he does not appear to have been issued with his book so he is to be allocated a new Dis. A which is R158639. On issue with the new number his old one should be cancelled.

Unfortunately, for some reason, I cannot see the image of his 1939 Register but that number is clearly incorrect, if it refers to a ship number.

So, in conclusion then, all three cards – well, four actually, if you include the one with the cancelled number - are actually for the same man.

He appears to have served as follows but this list is probably not complete and you would need to look at Crew Agreements to back track his history from 1939. Any questions please feel free.

145923 – SAMARIA – 8.9.1925
133648 – AKAROA – 20.2.1931
145943 – LANCASTRIA – 28.4.1937
145943 – LANCASTRIA – 18.9.1937
147318 – CARINTHIA – 8.5.1937
145934 – ANDANIA – 8.4.1938
145934 – ANDANIA – 24.2.1939

Regards
Hugh

[Ray T]

DoB? That’s exactly the same problem I had. The date on my Grandfather’s CR2 turned out to be exactly a year and a day out.

[Andy J2022]

Hi Hugh,

Many thanks for your reply. The 1939R entry is shown below. The top of the entry was cut off by the redacted entry on the line above.
There is a hint from FindMyPast that an EJ Jackson died when the SS Tia Juana was torpedoed off the Gulf of Maracaibo in Feb 1942  (second image below).
I'm assuming she was still in civilian ownership at the time so there may be a crew agreement for him. There is also the death of a Gunner EJ Jackson RA in 1942 which if it was him, could mean he was a DEMS gunner. Both lines of inquiry need lots more work. But thanks for the advice not to get too distracted by the inaccurate date of birth.