Author Topic: Joseph Lister's earlier life  (Read 382 times)

Offline rosie99

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Re: Joseph Lister's earlier life
« Reply #9 on: Wednesday 13 October 21 17:39 BST (UK) »
I presumed it was from the GRO  :-\

I was expecting it to say widower when I ordered it.
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Offline ShaunJ

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Re: Joseph Lister's earlier life
« Reply #10 on: Wednesday 13 October 21 19:44 BST (UK) »
Quote
1840: Son William was born

!839 Q4 William Lister - mothers maiden name Holdroyd, Dewsbury vol 22 page 52

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Offline Parmenion

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Re: Joseph Lister's earlier life
« Reply #11 on: Wednesday 13 October 21 22:07 BST (UK) »
Thanks for the replies everyone. :)

Have you managed to find a death of his wife Sarah between the time  of birth of son and his second marriage to Mary?,

Louisa Maud

added
Baptism 06/12/1818 Batley, father Samuel mother Hannah

I found around 5 possible death indexes for a Sarah Lister that died in Dewsbury (Sarahs without a middle name) but not real proof that it's her. :(

Quote
Why would he be shown as a bachelor on the 1850 marriage certificate if he'd been married before?

Well it shouldn't do.  Have you seen the first marriage certificate to see if details match?**

As Louisa Maud suggests have you found a death for Sarah?

It could be they simply separated but of course he shouldn't have married again. 

**marriage has Joseph 20 clothier residence Morley father Samuel clothier

Yes, I had found that marriage certificate. It certainly seems to link him to the Samuel Lister I had been assuming to be his father.

Does his signature on the 1850 marriage record match the 1838 signature?

I have attached the signatures for the 1850 and 1865 marriages. Tbh, they all look different to me lol. Maybe he didn't stick with just one?! ??? If indeed he even signed it himself.

Quote
1840: Son William was born

!839 Q4 William Lister - mothers maiden name Holdroyd, Dewsbury vol 22 page 52



Interesting. I had found a baptism record in Morley for April 1840 that seems to be correct. I found a birth index for 1840 that I thought to be the right one but it looks like you might have found the right one. Thanks!


Offline ShaunJ

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Re: Joseph Lister's earlier life
« Reply #12 on: Wednesday 13 October 21 23:24 BST (UK) »
The 1865 signature and the 1838 signature are very similar (look at the "t" in Lister). The 1850 snip looks like a handwritten copy so perhaps seek out the original register.
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Offline Parmenion

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Re: Joseph Lister's earlier life
« Reply #13 on: Thursday 14 October 21 12:25 BST (UK) »
Both certificates were purchases through the GRO so I think it's the best I can do really. :-\

Even if I can confirm the signatures are the same or that Sarah did indeed die it still won't explain why he said he was a bachelor when marrying Mary Whiley. Either he didn't know to say 'widower' or it's not the right guy.

I think I will see how many Samuel Listers are on the census records for 1851 as a farmer to see if there are other possible matches. I'm wondering if perhaps the correct baptism records just aren't available for whatever reason.

Offline louisa maud

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Re: Joseph Lister's earlier life
« Reply #14 on: Thursday 14 October 21 14:57 BST (UK) »
Did you find them on 1841, also what about looking for his first wife living with her parents on 1851, she might have left him, also perhaps he didn't want his second wife to know he had been married before, all sorts of unanswered questions, shouldn't be to may Zachariahs around, should there?

LM
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Offline Comberton

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Re: Joseph Lister's earlier life
« Reply #15 on: Thursday 14 October 21 15:08 BST (UK) »
I have been following the trail of a Sarah Lister and think she may be your Sarah.
There are births and baptisms for more children of Joseph and Sarah, Edwin 1842 and Elizabeth 1849 and baptisms 1849 and 1850, father a clothier as on Williams baptism 1840.
This is Sarah after the 1850 baptism in Batley.

1851 Dewsbury
Joseph Sowden head widower shop keeper   1787 Halifax, Yorkshire
Sarah Lister --- married housekeeper   1818 Gildersome, Yorkshire
Elizabeth Lister daughter 1850 Morley, Yorkshire
2322/10/13
1861 Dewsbury
same people as above plus
Emma Lister daughter 1852 Bruntcliffe  (which is where they are living)
Sarah  now listed as servant and widow
3397/8/10
Births in Dewsbury for Elizabeth Lister 1849 mmn Holdroyd and Emma Lister 1852 no mmn, also Edwin Lister 1842 mmn Oldred
1871 Dewsbury
Sarah Lister annuitant
Thomas Smith son in law
Elizabeth Smith daughter 1849
William Ed Smith grandson 1869
4577/9/11

Marriage of Thomas Smith and Elizabeth Lister has her father filled in as Joseph Smith and crossed through and one of the witnesses was Edwin Lister.
1851-1871 Edwin is nephew of Sarah Nicholson 1791 Heckmondwike and Edwin is an Executor for the will of Joseph Sowden in 1867. He is listed as great nephew.
Emma Lister marriage to James Hardesty has father as Joseph Lister shopkeeper and witnesses Thomas Smith and Charles Akeroyd. A Luke Akeroyd was an executor in 1867 with Edwin Lister.
Marriage of Edwin to Sarah Ann Jowett has father as Joseph Lister clothier with witnesses James Marshall and Emma Chew.

This may be the connection to the Akeroyd family.
Gildersome baptisms include
1814 Harriot Holroyd
1817 Sarah Holroyd
1821 Samuel Holroyd
Zechariah and Elizabeth
1835 Birstall  Luke Akeroyd married Harriet Holdroyd and 1843/46 sons Luke and Charles could be the ones mentioned.



Offline Parmenion

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Re: Joseph Lister's earlier life
« Reply #16 on: Thursday 14 October 21 21:18 BST (UK) »
Did you find them on 1841, also what about looking for his first wife living with her parents on 1851, she might have left him, also perhaps he didn't want his second wife to know he had been married before, all sorts of unanswered questions, shouldn't be to may Zachariahs around, should there?

LM

I didn't see a 1851 census record showing that but it looks like Comberton has tracked it through.

Thanks for the work you've put in, Comberton. If that all relates to the Sarah Holroyd from the marriage certificate then it would seem that it's a different Joseph Lister. My Joseph married Mary Whiley in September 1850 and was a time keeper from at least 1851 so that would prove it really.

Sorry for the slow replies and such. I'm having problems with brain fog lately so having trouble concentrating.

So, I need to find the correct birth details for my Joseph now.

Offline Parmenion

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Re: Joseph Lister's earlier life
« Reply #17 on: Thursday 14 October 21 21:32 BST (UK) »
Of course, from searching again I remember that there are no other baptism records that match. I don't know. Maybe there are records that were destroyed or something.