Author Topic: William Ellison b. 1831 Enniskillen Ireland - Royal Artillery  (Read 356 times)

Offline janjim

  • RootsChat Aristocrat
  • ******
  • Posts: 1,771
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
William Ellison b. 1831 Enniskillen Ireland - Royal Artillery
« on: Sunday 05 December 21 06:00 GMT (UK) »
Hi, I have placed postings previously in regard to a Lawrence Ellison, Father of William Ellison who served as a Private in the 59th Regiment of Foot.   His son William Ellison was born in Ireland, but it seems that the family then returned to Manchester, Lancashire.    Lawrence died of TB at Portsmouth Garrison in 1845 and we have had much difficulty in tracing the whereabouts of the family, until just of late.

We have found William Ellison in 1871 census where his marriage in 1863 shows his Father as Lawrence Ellison, Sergeant in the 59th Regiment. 

We are having difficulty finding where William was living between his birth and 1871 census.  We believe we have found him with his sister Hannah or Harriett living at the Manchester Union Workhouse Prestwich aged 9 years, Hannah 11 years.  This all ties in with the family, and his mother Judith Ellison working in another Workhouse in the area.   

We think it is possible that William Ellison may have joined the 85th Regiment in 1851 which was based at Fulwood, Lancashire.   We would like to get more information on this particular regiment, to see if he is listed therein.    Also he was missing in 1861 Census information.   On his marriage in 1863, his occupation is shown as Acting Trumpeter in the Royal Horse Artillery Regiment, living in the Artillery Barracks.

Would appreciate any assistance please.

Best regards Jan
New, Thorn, Bird, Ruffey, Bosley, Belcher- Newbury Berkshire
Haynes/Haines - Much Birch Herefordshire, Monmouth Wales
Kearn/Watkins- Llanllwchaiarn/Newtown, Wales, Tyberton, Herefordshire
Gwilliam - Monmouth Wales, Herefordshire
Collier, Jackson - Salford, Manchester Lancashire
Saunders - Middlesex, Devon
Benson - Edinburgh, Scotland
Callander - Falkirk, Scotland
Ambrose - Liverpool, Manchester Lancashire, Canada
Timms, Elliman - Oxfordshire, Warwickshire
Ellison - Manchester/Portsmouth Hampshir

Online ShaunJ

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 21,018
    • View Profile
Re: William Ellison b. 1831 Enniskillen Ireland - Royal Artillery
« Reply #1 on: Sunday 05 December 21 12:07 GMT (UK) »
Perhaps consider the possibility that Judith and the youngest children were in Antigua with Lawrence at the time of the 1841 census, and that the people you have found in workhouses were not his family. It would be very unusual for children to be in one Union's workhouse and the mother to be in another Union's workhouse.   
UK Census info. Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Online ShaunJ

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 21,018
    • View Profile
Re: William Ellison b. 1831 Enniskillen Ireland - Royal Artillery
« Reply #2 on: Sunday 05 December 21 12:41 GMT (UK) »
I couldn't find a William Ellison at Fulwood in the 1851 census  - can you post a link?

The 1851 "worldwide army index" (compiled from muster rolls and paylists ) lists 5 soldiers named William Ellison:

- one with the Royal Artillery at Woolwich but per the census he was born in Northumberland (age 22)
- 1007 5th Dragoon Guards (he was born in Yorkshire)
- 40, Royal Canadian Rifles (born in Ireland but way too old)
- 1327 Coldstream Guards (born Sicily, way too old)
- 355 2nd Dragoon Guards (born Cheshire, way too old)

UK Census info. Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk


Offline aghadowey

  • RootsChat Honorary
  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 49,527
    • View Profile
Re: William Ellison b. 1831 Enniskillen Ireland - Royal Artillery
« Reply #3 on: Sunday 05 December 21 17:06 GMT (UK) »
Links to previous threads (not sure if I found them all)-
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=563724.msg4161655 (Ellison, Lawrence - look up for census 1841)
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=565509.msg4179409 (Lawrence Ellison, Soldier d. 1845)
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=567474.msg4196241 (Re: Cambridge Barracks, Portsmouth)
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=569844.msg4220872 (Look ups census info Ellison family)
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=573452.msg4257688 (Look up request 1845 Portsmouth)
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=575015.msg4273161 (Lawrence Ellison - looking for birth)
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=576661.msg4288239 (Manchester Union Workhouse 1841)
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=577823.msg4298391 (59th Regiment of Foot - Grave of Private Ellison)
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=578053.msg4300636 (Cemetery for Portsmouth, Soldiers 1845)
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=591715.msg4423620 (William Ellison of Enniskillen b. 1831)
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=679309.msg5238949 (Parish Records - Maria Ellison - 1929)
Away sorting out DNA matches... I may be gone for some time many years!

Online ShaunJ

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 21,018
    • View Profile
Re: William Ellison b. 1831 Enniskillen Ireland - Royal Artillery
« Reply #4 on: Sunday 05 December 21 19:37 GMT (UK) »
I reckon these signatures are by the same man. The top one is from William Ellison's marriage to Elizabeth Gailey in 1863. The middle one is from the 1874 discharge papers of 37786 Driver William Ellison, Royal Artillery. The bottom one is from his 1874 marriage to Florence Goodwin.

He joined the army (Royal Artillery) in 1853, served nearly 21 years including nearly 4 years in India.  Says he was born in Manchester which  is consistent with his 1871, 1881, and 1891 census records. 

Possibly born in Manchester and baptised in Enniskillen?

UK Census info. Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline janjim

  • RootsChat Aristocrat
  • ******
  • Posts: 1,771
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: William Ellison b. 1831 Enniskillen Ireland - Royal Artillery
« Reply #5 on: Sunday 05 December 21 20:29 GMT (UK) »
ShaunJ

Yes we have looked at all possibilities in that regard, thanks so much for your thoughts, it seems that it is possible that Lawrence Ellison had another relationship as well.  Judith his wife was definitely in a Workhouse in 1841 census.  We are trying to fill in the blanks for those missing years for William Ellison from his birth in Enniskillen till he married Elizabeth Gailey.

Lawrence's wife Judith is shown in one Census living a few doors away from her daughter (my GG Grandmother) Sarah Ellison who married John Ambrose, in Ancoats, Manchester.   

best regards Jan




Perhaps consider the possibility that Judith and the youngest children were in Antigua with Lawrence at the time of the 1841 census, and that the people you have found in workhouses were not his family. It would be very unusual for children to be in one Union's workhouse and the mother to be in another Union's workhouse.
New, Thorn, Bird, Ruffey, Bosley, Belcher- Newbury Berkshire
Haynes/Haines - Much Birch Herefordshire, Monmouth Wales
Kearn/Watkins- Llanllwchaiarn/Newtown, Wales, Tyberton, Herefordshire
Gwilliam - Monmouth Wales, Herefordshire
Collier, Jackson - Salford, Manchester Lancashire
Saunders - Middlesex, Devon
Benson - Edinburgh, Scotland
Callander - Falkirk, Scotland
Ambrose - Liverpool, Manchester Lancashire, Canada
Timms, Elliman - Oxfordshire, Warwickshire
Ellison - Manchester/Portsmouth Hampshir

Offline janjim

  • RootsChat Aristocrat
  • ******
  • Posts: 1,771
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: William Ellison b. 1831 Enniskillen Ireland - Royal Artillery
« Reply #6 on: Sunday 05 December 21 20:39 GMT (UK) »
Shaun,
Sure looks like our man, thanks so much, seeing the signatures looks fairly good.   I do have a copy of William's birth certificate, showing birth 25th October, 1831, at Enniskillen - baptised 20th November 1831, parents Laurence & Judith Ellison - Private 59th Regiment of Foot.

Would love to see any further information during those early years from enlistment, if you have this available for me, wondering what years he was in India and what his occupation was then.

After this, another child Maria was born in Portsmouth in 1836.

All documentation for marriages of Laurence Ellison's descendants seem to connect up to Father's occupation as Private in the 59th Regiment of Foot.

I am pretty sure we have him now, just a blank still for 1851 census, (when 20 years of age) maybe he was in transit from Manchester to Woolwich, London or nearby.

Thanking you, Jan

I reckon these signatures are by the same man. The top one is from William Ellison's marriage to Elizabeth Gailey in 1863. The middle one is from the 1874 discharge papers of 37786 Driver William Ellison, Royal Artillery. The bottom one is from his 1874 marriage to Florence Goodwin.

He joined the army (Royal Artillery) in 1853, served nearly 21 years including nearly 4 years in India.  Says he was born in Manchester which  is consistent with his 1871, 1881, and 1891 census records. 

Possibly born in Manchester and baptised in Enniskillen?
New, Thorn, Bird, Ruffey, Bosley, Belcher- Newbury Berkshire
Haynes/Haines - Much Birch Herefordshire, Monmouth Wales
Kearn/Watkins- Llanllwchaiarn/Newtown, Wales, Tyberton, Herefordshire
Gwilliam - Monmouth Wales, Herefordshire
Collier, Jackson - Salford, Manchester Lancashire
Saunders - Middlesex, Devon
Benson - Edinburgh, Scotland
Callander - Falkirk, Scotland
Ambrose - Liverpool, Manchester Lancashire, Canada
Timms, Elliman - Oxfordshire, Warwickshire
Ellison - Manchester/Portsmouth Hampshir

Online ShaunJ

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 21,018
    • View Profile
Re: William Ellison b. 1831 Enniskillen Ireland - Royal Artillery
« Reply #7 on: Sunday 05 December 21 23:14 GMT (UK) »
I've seen the army "birth" record but it certifies only the place of baptism, not the place of birth

https://www.ancestry.co.uk/mediaui-viewer/tree/746468/person/420077514208/media/3849e5c5-4f7f-46eb-abc4-beabeffd9a1a?_phsrc=VFV5853&_phstart=successSource

Not much of his army file has survived so we don't know the dates of his service in India. His occupation prior to joining the army was "clog & patten maker". 

UK Census info. Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline janjim

  • RootsChat Aristocrat
  • ******
  • Posts: 1,771
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: William Ellison b. 1831 Enniskillen Ireland - Royal Artillery
« Reply #8 on: Sunday 05 December 21 23:35 GMT (UK) »
Thanks Shaun,
So it would seem that he was most likely born in Manchester, as shown.   Clog & Patten maker, sounds interesting !
Haven't been able to open that site you have listed yet.
Jan
New, Thorn, Bird, Ruffey, Bosley, Belcher- Newbury Berkshire
Haynes/Haines - Much Birch Herefordshire, Monmouth Wales
Kearn/Watkins- Llanllwchaiarn/Newtown, Wales, Tyberton, Herefordshire
Gwilliam - Monmouth Wales, Herefordshire
Collier, Jackson - Salford, Manchester Lancashire
Saunders - Middlesex, Devon
Benson - Edinburgh, Scotland
Callander - Falkirk, Scotland
Ambrose - Liverpool, Manchester Lancashire, Canada
Timms, Elliman - Oxfordshire, Warwickshire
Ellison - Manchester/Portsmouth Hampshir