Author Topic: Does Anyone Know Anything About Boats?  (Read 649 times)

Offline peakoverload

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Does Anyone Know Anything About Boats?
« on: Tuesday 18 January 22 14:52 GMT (UK) »
A bit random but I've just found that my 3x GG who lived in Leigh-On-Sea, Essex had a boat/ship that was registered in the Mercantile Navy List 1848. Whilst he lived by the Thames Estuary he didn't really have anything to do with shipping but he was a seriously wealthy man who owned a lot of land and many businesses. The Mercantile Navy List doesn't give a lot of information but I'm wondering if anyone can shed some light on the little it does?

It says that the vessel had the name Eleanor and was registered in the port of Maldon. It was 72 tonnes but no horse power is registered so must have been powered by sail. The only other information is that it had the Commercial Code Signals (whatever they are) J.P.F.C.

72 tonnes seems a tad large for a rowing boat ;) but equally its not a few hundred tonnes or more of larger ship.

I can't figure out why he would own a boat at a port some 20+ miles away unless it was to do with one of his many businesses. In 1848 he would have been a Victualler and a Coal Merchant. There is a family story that one day he came home and put a lump of coal on the table and said "that's from my coal mine". Obviously there are no coal mines in Essex but later he did build a house called Pittington House and the sister of his first wife moved up to very near Pittington, County Durham. Whilst he is not recorded as having anything to do with Pittington Colliery, I wonder if, as a coal merchant, he bought coal from the colliery and shipped it down to Essex on boats like this (Leigh didn't have a railway at this time, that didn't come until 1855 which my 3x GG campaigned for)? Probably clutching at straws and that a 72 tonne vessel is too small for this kind of thing but just curious if anyone knows anything that might shed some more light on the matter.
Johnson: London & Maidstone
Foster: Essex
Leach: London
Jennings, Camberwell, London
Gray: South London
Dashwood: London
Mason: Maidstone & London
Neville/Stiff: Hampshire & USA

Online KGarrad

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Re: Does Anyone Know Anything About Boats?
« Reply #1 on: Tuesday 18 January 22 15:29 GMT (UK) »
The Commercial Code of Signals was used from 1857 until 1902, when it was superceded by the International Code of signals.

Four-flag combinations with B (red burgee) uppermost were geographical signals; with the pendants C, D, or F uppermost they were vocabulary (phrases, words or spelled-out words) signals; with G uppermost they identified warships; and with any square flag uppermost they identified merchant vessels.

Quoted from https://tmg110.tripod.com/sigf_2.htm
Garrad (Suffolk, Essex, Somerset), Crocker (Somerset), Vanstone (Devon, Jersey), Sims (Wiltshire), Bridger (Kent)

Offline tonepad

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Aucock/Aukett~Kent/Sussex, Broadway~Oxfordshire, Danks~Warwickshire, Fenn~Kent/Norfolk, Goatham~Kent, Hunt~Kent, Parker~Middlesex, Perry~Kent, Sellers~Kent/Yorkshire, Sladden~Kent, Wright~Kent/Essex

Online AlanBoyd

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Re: Does Anyone Know Anything About Boats?
« Reply #3 on: Tuesday 18 January 22 15:42 GMT (UK) »
Looking at BNA, there are many reports of this vessel arriving and departing ports in the North East so I suspect your idea of it being a collier may be correct. (I searched for eleanor and maldon).

EDIT
However most of the reports relate to Shields, so I don’t think that Pittington Colliery would be directly involved. Pittington was a Londonderry pit and the coal would have gone via Seaham Harbour I believe.
Boyd, Dove, Blakey, Burdon


Offline seaweed

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Re: Does Anyone Know Anything About Boats?
« Reply #4 on: Wednesday 19 January 22 00:59 GMT (UK) »
Hi peakoverload
 Seems there is a misleading google page out there. https://www.google.co.uk/books/edition/The_Mercantile_navy_list_1848_4_issues_4/oecNAAAAQAAJ?hl=en&gbpv=1&dq=%22mercantile+navy+list%22&pg=PA303&printsec=frontcover#v=onepage&q=%22mercantile%20navy%20list%22&f=false

I found her in the MNL from 1861 until 1870. in 1865 (owners were not recorded before 1865) she was registered to the owner William Foster. Who seems to be your ancestor.
https://www.crewlist.org.uk/data/viewimages?year=1864&name=ELEANORE&steamsail=Steam&year=1865+&submit=enter
She was sold to various owners after 1866 and I cannot find her after 1870 but it seems she was still sailing until 1872
( Addition) https://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=mdp.35112203984325&view=1up&seq=812

 The Official number of the your ELEANOR is 6527. Her 1865 Crew Agreement and Logbook should be at NMM Greenwich. At least it should give you details of her employment together with details of her owner and crew.

You should be able to register  for the "AEON" system and get  downloadable details of the Crew Agreements and Logbooks. Don't forget to give the official number.

Her 1864 Crew Agreements are available from TNA Kew
https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/C2477532

Her sale to West Hartlepool would suggest to me that she was employed in the East Coast coal trade, but ????
(Addition) She was a Schooner, not a Thames Sailing Barge.


regards
SW
Dim ateb yn well nag ateb anghywir. Nid oes dim yn ddall fel rhai nad ydynt yn dymuno gweld

RIP Roger 10 August 2022

Offline peakoverload

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Re: Does Anyone Know Anything About Boats?
« Reply #5 on: Wednesday 19 January 22 10:11 GMT (UK) »
WOW! You guys are amazing. Thank you all so much, you have all helped me massively. I know absolutely nothing about boats and didn't think I was going to be able to get much info but this, combined with some research I've been doing myself, has allowed me to draw up a working theory.

My 3xGG was William Foster. His first wife was Elizabeth Shaw whom he married in 1839. Elizabeth had a sister called Harriet Adelaide Shaw. The Shaw's were a well known family of Mariners in Leigh at the time and there were 3 cottages called Shaw Cottages where some of them still lived.

The first time I've found William Foster listed as a coal merchant appears to be 1849 but he continued to be one, as well as many other things, until 1881.

In 1851 Harriet marries a Lewis Lennard who is a Master Marina from Whitby. The two are recorded as being in Middlesbrough in 1851

In 1856 Harriet and Lewis have a son who they name Lewis William Foster Lennard! Interestingly the son never appears to live with his parents but instead lives with William Foster.

In 1861 William Foster and Lewis William Foster Lennard are living in Shaw Cottages in Leigh. At the same time Harriet is back in Leigh herself, living less than 1/2 mile from William and her son and is recorded as being a Mariners Wife

In 1863 William builds Pittington House in Leigh and he and Lewis William Foster are living there in 1871 with Williams second wife (Elizabeth died in 1868)

In 1865 he is recorded as owning the boat (possible Thames Barge) Eleanor which we now know sailed up and down the east coast quite probably transporting coal.

In 1871 Harriets husband Lewis, is recorded as a boarder in Sculcoats, Yorkshire. Whether this was because he was just staying there the night whilst sailing up/down the coast I don't know but Harriet is still recorded as being married but now living in Witham and working as a glass, china and fancy good repository and has three more children with her, the oldest being 13.

In 1881 William retires as a coal merchant

In 1882 Harriets husband Lewis Lennard drowns in the old harbour, Hull. The inscription on his grave stone implies he may have been drunk or have been known to drink a lot.

So my working theory is that William owned the Eleanor quite possibly from as early as 1849 when he set up as a coal merchant and that he employed Lewis Lennard to sail the Eleanor up to Middlesborough (or somewhere close by) where coal, possibly from Pittington Colliery 20 miles away, was loaded on and sailed back to Leigh. As this would mean Lewis being away from his wife for long periods of time, William agreed to raise their son Lewis William Foster Lennard and hence why he has that name. This would also perhaps explain why William left Lewis William Foster Lennard £200 in his will when he died in 1900, the equivalent of £15,500 today.

Possibly when William retired from coal in 1881 the loss of business turned Lewis Lennard to drink and how he ended up drowning in 1882, but I'm less sure about that as by this time trains had arrived in Leigh and I can't help but think that William would have used them instead of slow barges.

I can't prove any of this yet and it's just a working theory to explain why he would call his house Pittington House but hopefully the records of the Eleanor might shed some further light on the matter.

Thank you all again, I really do very much appreciate it.
Johnson: London & Maidstone
Foster: Essex
Leach: London
Jennings, Camberwell, London
Gray: South London
Dashwood: London
Mason: Maidstone & London
Neville/Stiff: Hampshire & USA

Offline seaweed

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Re: Does Anyone Know Anything About Boats?
« Reply #6 on: Wednesday 19 January 22 15:45 GMT (UK) »
Just to add.
Note my additions to my previous post.
 ELEANOR 6527 was registered at Maldon from 1861 until 1866. Wether your ancestor was her owner for the entire time, I don't know. Before 1861 she was registered in Wells.
https://www.crewlist.org.uk/data/viewimages?year=1861&name=ELEANOR&steamsail=Sail&year=1860+&submit=enter
 Gleaning information on a small ship from a small port is sometimes best achieved by local sources. I would get in touch with the The Maeldune Heritage Centre info@maelduneheritagecentre.co.uk to see if they can put you in touch with a local maritime historian who may be able to tell you the entire Maldon history of ELEANOR.


SW
Dim ateb yn well nag ateb anghywir. Nid oes dim yn ddall fel rhai nad ydynt yn dymuno gweld

RIP Roger 10 August 2022

Offline coombs

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Re: Does Anyone Know Anything About Boats?
« Reply #7 on: Wednesday 19 January 22 20:33 GMT (UK) »
Leigh On Sea is interesting as my Quilter and Plumb ancestors came from there, and some of them also ended up in County Durham.
Researching:

LONDON, Coombs, Roberts, Auber, Helsdon, Fradine, Morin, Goodacre
DORSET Coombs, Munday
NORFOLK Helsdon, Riches, Harbord, Budery
KENT Roberts, Goodacre
SUSSEX Walder, Boniface, Dinnage, Standen, Lee, Botten, Wickham, Jupp
SUFFOLK Titshall, Frost, Fairweather, Mayhew, Archer, Eade, Scarfe
DURHAM Stewart, Musgrave, Wilson, Forster
SCOTLAND Stewart in Selkirk
USA Musgrave, Saix
ESSEX Cornwell, Stock, Quilter, Lawrence, Whale, Clift
OXON Edgington, Smith, Inkpen, Snell, Batten, Brain