Author Topic: Marriages between British citizens and foreign nationals 1907-8  (Read 947 times)

Offline Turtle Dove

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Marriages between British citizens and foreign nationals 1907-8
« on: Wednesday 20 April 22 10:38 BST (UK) »
Hello, can anyone shed any light on the possible marriage of my ancestor to a German citizen in about 1907? I can find no record of a marriage in FreeBMD and have checked various spellings of their names. I would think that they were simply living together and not married but a few things lead me to think that they thought they were legally married. I have found a document about a 1907 change in the law which suggests that it was the responsibility of the couple to notify the authorities if they married in a German church. I wonder if it's possible they didn't do this and I would find records at a local church but have not been able to find a likely one. Their address was Little Goodge Street in Fitzrovia, London in 1909, and Sudeley Street, South Islington in 1907. Can anyone suggest a German church that was operating in the area at the time? My ancestor was C of E and her husband's father was RC so any church would be a helpful lead. My ancestor, Elizabeth seems to have been honest and open. Although not required to, she mentioned on the 1911 census that she was supported by her husband, who was working away and declared she had been married 3 years. Her husband was interned in WW1 and then repatriated, not to return. Elizabeth and the children kept his surname, Fliege. She travelled to Canada in 1930 under this name to live in a hostel, which I'm not sure she would have been able to do without some record to prove her name. Elizabeth died in 1933 and her husband married again in Berlin shortly afterwards, in 1934. I hope someone can help explain why I can't find a marriage record and other avenues to try. Thank you.

Offline CaroleW

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Re: Marriages between British citizens and foreign nationals 1907-8
« Reply #1 on: Wednesday 20 April 22 21:19 BST (UK) »
Was her maiden name Farrer - per childrens birth reg?

Born in Wootton Bedfordshire 1884
Lizzie in 1901 - living Northants
Lizzie in 1911 living in London
Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
Carlin (Ireland & Liverpool) Doughty & Wright (Liverpool) Dick & Park (Scotland & Liverpool)

Offline Annette7

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Re: Marriages between British citizens and foreign nationals 1907-8
« Reply #2 on: Wednesday 20 April 22 22:12 BST (UK) »
What was the christian name/s of her 'husband'?   His occupation?

Annette
Scopes (One-Name Study - Worldwide)
Suffolk - Grist, Knights, Bullenthorpe, Watcham
Scotland - Spence, Horne, Cowan, Moffat
London -  Monk

Don't walk behind me, I may not lead.   Don't walk in front of me, I may not follow.   Just walk beside me and be my friend.

Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline Annette7

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Re: Marriages between British citizens and foreign nationals 1907-8
« Reply #3 on: Wednesday 20 April 22 22:28 BST (UK) »
She seems to have followed her son Ernest there who went to Canada in 1929 (same UK address for both).

Annette
Scopes (One-Name Study - Worldwide)
Suffolk - Grist, Knights, Bullenthorpe, Watcham
Scotland - Spence, Horne, Cowan, Moffat
London -  Monk

Don't walk behind me, I may not lead.   Don't walk in front of me, I may not follow.   Just walk beside me and be my friend.

Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk


Offline Turtle Dove

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Re: Marriages between British citizens and foreign nationals 1907-8
« Reply #4 on: Thursday 21 April 22 09:17 BST (UK) »
Hello, Yes Elizabeth Farrer, born in Wootton in 1883. The 1901 census return you have isn't her though. I haven't been able to find her on that census at all. I have a gap between 1898 and 1907. Max Fliege was born in 1889 in Berlin, so he wouldn't have been in England in 1901 (18 in 1907). Son Ernest went to Canada with the Church Army. Elizabeth went to live in the women's hostel. They were poor. I have found, in a newspaper, reference to St Marien's Church in 1907, which was a German church in the area. I shall follow that up! Thank you for looking Elizabeth up.

Online spendlove

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Re: Marriages between British citizens and foreign nationals 1907-8
« Reply #5 on: Thursday 21 April 22 10:42 BST (UK) »
Hi,

Is this her

1901 Census, Highham Ferrers,
Piece:   1441
Folio:   59
Page Number:   18

Lizzie Farrer aged 16, servant born Bedfordshire.

As she was born 10th April 1883, not yet reached her 17th birthday when census was taken.


Christian name/s for Mr. Fliege would assist.

Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Spendlove, Strutt in London & Middlesex.

Offline CaroleW

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Re: Marriages between British citizens and foreign nationals 1907-8
« Reply #6 on: Thursday 21 April 22 10:55 BST (UK) »
That is the 1901 I found but see reply above

Quote
Born in Wootton Bedfordshire 1884
Lizzie in 1901 - living Northants
Lizzie in 1911 living in London


Quote
The 1901 census return you have isn't her though. I haven't been able to find her on that census at all.
Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
Carlin (Ireland & Liverpool) Doughty & Wright (Liverpool) Dick & Park (Scotland & Liverpool)

Online spendlove

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Re: Marriages between British citizens and foreign nationals 1907-8
« Reply #7 on: Thursday 21 April 22 11:07 BST (UK) »
Hi,

Sorry CaroleW,  did see your post but failed to acknowledge.

Decided to add her birth date to explain age of 16, so this entry could be reconsidered by Turtle Dove.

Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Spendlove, Strutt in London & Middlesex.

Offline Turtle Dove

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Re: Marriages between British citizens and foreign nationals 1907-8
« Reply #8 on: Thursday 21 April 22 13:14 BST (UK) »
Hello,
That Higham Ferrars Lizzie is definitely another one. I researched her too, to be sure. Elizabeth's husband was Max Hermann Rudolf Fliege. I have lots of detail on them, everything really except a wedding certificate. At the moment I can only think that if they did marry it was outside of the English church and they didn't tell the authorities to have it registered. Perhaps being married in the eyes of God was enough, or in the eyes of the German Church, or perhaps there was a fee to have the wedding registered and they couldn't afford it. If anyone has any experience or knowledge of whether that is possible, it would be great to know, as I might have to doubt that there ever was a wedding!