Henry Watson

[smithy]

Lu, thankyou,

[Lucy2]

.... I discovered that Henry George Watson died in 1923 in Melbourne! and buried at Burwood Cemetery Victoria along with Frances
 ......  Henry George Watson is buried in same grave aged 50yrs.!
...... I then bought his death certificate and gives his birth as Timaru New Zealand  .... 
and had been married to Frances Rowntree when he was 31yrs old.

 .... On checking the New Zealand BDM for about 1872 I can find two George Henry births but no Henry George.

Hi Carol

Haven't been able to find a birth in NZ for a "Henry George WATSON" which is near in birth year to the man who died 1923 in Melbourne.

But there were two births of a "George Henry WATSON"  --  one in 1872 and other in 1874.

Both these males came from large families and it was difficult going through various records, to get a handle on just which of them belonged to what family.  [Ancestry has a great many trees for each of these WATSON families ... and I generally do my own searching first before resorting to looking at  online "trees".    But have to say the trees I did browse were error-ridden (mostly dates and mistakenly identifying with others of the same name) and these errors had been repeated over and over (in about 100 trees in all  ) ]

Sorry to say, that neither of the New Zealand-born 1872 and 1874 "George Henry's", are not the man who died 1923 in Melbourne.
[I'll put details in a following post in case they're of help to researchers of these other WATSON men.]

 *    On Gordon's 1913 Birth Certificate, the places of birth of his father and mother should be stated ... and that information given by Henry WATSON himself when he registered the birth, will be the most reliable you'll get.     

*     Was Frances (wife) the informant to Henry WATSON's death  ??

I do have some further information for another "person of interest" - just awaiting more info on that one.

   ~    Lu

[Lucy2]

These New Zealand births for George Henry WATSON - 1872 and 1874, CAN BE ELIMINATED FROM THIS SEARCH  :

1.   George Henry WATSON - born 29 April 1872 - probably at Wairau*, Marlborough Province, NZ, - son of Margaret MAXWELL and George Henry WATSON (marr. NZ 1863).  [*George Henry WATSON snr. is on electoral rolls at Renwick Town / Wairau Valley - Freehold land - from 1870-71.]
George Henry WATSON (b. 1872) died at Hastings (North Island) 22 January 1940 - aged 68 years (Suicide by poisoning).   At the inquest into his death, a Mrs Dorothy E.M. WARD, his niece, gave evidence. [Dorothy WARD proved to be the daughter of his sister Isabella (m. SIMONSEN) ].
https://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/newspapers/NZH19400126.2.94
--------------------------- //

2.   George Henry WATSON - born 1874 - Buller, West Coast (South Island) - son of Robert aka Robert Tannahill WATSON and his wife Jessie.  //   Marr. Isabel Emily WRIGHT - 1906 //
Died 15 June 1954 at Christchurch aged 79 years [bc 1875] - Cremated (record of his death does not show on Christchurch Cemeteries database. )   His death notice in a local newspaper named his wife and children and also mentioned that he "was late of Granity, West Coast"  :
---------------------------- //   end

   ~  Lu

Edit :  clarify wording

[Lucy2]

This Australian one also eliminated :  > >

VIC - BIRTH
Year :  1873
WATSON - Henry George
Parents :  George WATSON & Susan MALONE
Birthplace :   The Loddon, VIC

>   Married :  1897 - Maud Eugenie TIBBETT - Henry George WATSON

>   Electoral :  Henry George (labourer)  //  Maud Eugene (sic) WATSON both at Farnworth Street, Castlemaine, VIC >  1924 // 1936

DEATH :
Year :  1952
WATSON - Henry George   >     Parents:  George WATSON  // Susan MALONE
Reg:    Swan Hill, VIC :
--------------------------------------------// end

     ~  Lu

[smithy]

Oh Lu, You have done such a lot of work looking for Henry George Watson, thank you so much. I have just been reading the info. you have found.
Frances wasn't the informant on the death certificate it was the clerk at the Hospital in Melbourne where he passed away. death certificate (1923) gives his birth as Timaru New Zealand and had been in Australia 14years so my calculations on arrival in Australia would be 1909.
On Gordon St.Clair Watsons birth certificate  Henry Watsons birth is Oamaru New Zealand  as far as i can understand the writing.( I have tried earlier on to upload a little of the certificate but had trouble doing it) Frances on the birth certificate has Melbourne as place of birth!
As we know birth certificates are the most reliable but  as far as family knows she was from New Zealand. On Frances' death certificate Place of birth is Auckland New Zealand  in 1959 when she died at Traralgon Victoria  she had been in Australia for 50 years
Have had a look at distance between Timaru and Oamara and the distance is not great but guess it was a good way in the 1800's.
I wonder would local family history societies perhaps have information on any Watson families that I might be 'lucky' enough to be able to connect to Henry George Watson.
Regards
Carol

[Lucy2]

Hi Carol

That additional info from the certs is great thanks.
Yes, Timaru / Oamaru are fairly close ... (my husband was born in one of those places, and schooled in the other  ).  It's the ..."maru" bit in the name ... and their close proximity which causes the confusion, I think.   

WATSON, you'll already know is a bit of a nightmare to research ... and there are so many with the same christian names !!

I do have a theory regarding Frances and Henry (Henry George), and some information to back that up.   Will share that with you on here, just as soon as I have free time to get it in order (deciphering scribbled notes is my problem).

    ~   Lu

[smithy]

Lu,
thank-you.
Carol

[Lucy2]

....  Frances on the birth certificate has Melbourne as place of birth!
....  but  as far as family knows she was from New Zealand. On Frances' death certificate Place of birth is Auckland New Zealand  in 1959 when she died at Traralgon Victoria  she had been in Australia for 50 years.

 .... I wonder would local family history societies [*Timaru / Oamaru ] perhaps have information on any Watson families that I might be 'lucky' enough to be able to connect to Henry George Watson.
[* = my note ]

Hi Carol

From that info you've supplied, it appears that Frances and Henry had both been in  Victoria from 1909.   (Some consistency there  ).   
Frances ROWNTREE (dau. of Edward Casson ROWNTREE and Hannah Winifred BUTTON) was born 1872 in Dunedin NZ (as per post from "eyesee" earlier) ... and electoral rolls also confirm Edward's presence in Otago during late 1860's and 1870's. :
Info from  family history societies (Timaru / Oamaru ) :    Try as I might, I cannot find a possible birth in or near, either of those localities for a "Henry / Henry George / George Henry" .
Have also just recently scoured the newspapers of those areas for WATSON birth notices and any other WATSON snippets which might relate.   I've been able to eliminate some persons/items.  The problem with the NZ Birth index (@ ancestry site) is that for the early 1870's, the index only gives "New Zealand" as a place of birth registration (rather than a specific city, town, etc. )  And that means we have to employ other techniques to hopefully find further information ... not always possible when working solely online.      As to electoral information / directories etc. for NZ, not all males were on rolls before 1880-81 ... so at the time of Henry's birth, early 1870's, it might be that his father (and, if indeed his surname was WATSON ?) was not showing up on rolls. 
I have no idea whether a family history society can assist you at all with this ?

In the information I'll post next, there is an obscure link to Timaru (which may link to "possible place of birth" on Henry's death cert. ?? ... it's purely speculation though).

     ~  Lu

PS ... sorry if there's a large gap in this post ... have tried unsuccesfully to correct it.  (probably connected to an advertisment appearing on page - although there's not one coming up ?? )

[Lucy2]

Henry WATSON / Henry George WATSON / George Henry WATSON :   

Earlier in this search > before info was posted here about the contents of death certs and electoral rolls > I stumbled upon the following "George Henry WATSON".   

I kept him in the background - just in case - and was a bit suprised when you'd said that Gordon S. WATSON had, on his marriage, given his father's name as "George" (albeit a "carpenter by trade").
And ... when Henry's death was discovered, that he'd been buried as "Henry George WATSON".
So why was Henry, always just "Henry WATSON" on VIC e/rolls ... and why did the name "George" creep in ??    Was he Henry George or George Henry in a former life ??

As already mentioned by others here, NO marriage between Frances and Henry has been found in New Zealand ... and I'm guessing too that Australian indexes have been checked ?

There does seem then to have been an "impediment" to Frances and Henry marrying ?   Was it that one, or both were already wed to others ??    Nothing found for Frances ... Henry a little more difficult to trace.

Aside from the names "Henry" / "George" ...and those two names in combination, there are other similarities such as, year of birth, occupation and the time-frame in which one man "Henry George WATSON" apparently arrived in Australia, and the other, "George Henry WATSON" apparently disappeared from New Zealand ??

   ~  Lu                                                              >   continues next post  >>