Margery de Bohun, the wife of Theobald de Verdun - Complete Peerage

[horselydown86]

The parentage of Margery de Bohun, the wife of Theobald de Verdun the Elder of Alton (died 1309), has been the subject of some discussion in circles devoted to the Complete Peerage.

For example:

https://groups.google.com/g/soc.genealogy.medieval/c/L0Me21r5wb8/m/u5ksSKHvAgAJ

http://www.medievalgenealogy.org.uk/cp/p_verdun.shtml

Dozens of online trees have settled on Humphrey de Bohun VI, Earl of Hereford and Essex (died 1265) as Margery's father.

This derives entirely from interpretation of a confused and confusing entry in A. J. Horwood, ed., Year Books of the Reign of King Edward the First, Michaelmas Term Year XXXIII and Years XXXIV-XXXV, p. 170 (with a French text on p.171).

See:

https://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=njp.32101073815167&view=1up&seq=202&skin=2021

The entry relates to a dispute in the Court of Common Pleas in Easter Term of 1306 over a part of the manor of Bisley in the county of Gloucester.  Humphrey de Bohun VII, the then current Earl of Hereford and Essex, is a party to the suit.

As far as I can discover, nobody has hitherto searched the Court Roll for the original pleading; a pity because it is as lucid as the Year Book is confused and provides a definitive statement identifying Margery's father.

See:  http://aalt.law.uh.edu/E1/CP40no159/CP40no159dorses/IMG_1087.htm

The key section begins on line 9:

Et Theobaldus dicit q(uo)d quidam Humfr(id)us de Bohun p(ro)avus p(re)d(i)c(t)i Com(itis) cui(us) [h(er)os? / h(er)es?]
ipse est dedit & concessit eidem Theobaldo p(re)d(i)c(t)a ten(ementa) cu(m) p(er)tin(entiis) in lib(eru)m maritagiu(m)
[t(a)li?] quadam marg(er)ia filia sua &c...

And Theobald says that a certain Humphey de Bohun the great-grandfather of the aforesaid Earl whose [lord? / heir?]
himself is did give & grant to the same Theobald the aforesaid tenements with the appurtenances in frank-marriage
[tail?] with a certain Margery his daughter &c...

As I calculate the de Bohun lineage:

Humphrey VII (4th Earl of Hereford) - succeeded 1298 as Earl of Hereford & Essex.  Current Earl as of CP40/159.

Humphrey VI (3rd Earl of Hereford) - succeeded 1275 as Earl of Hereford & Essex.  Father of current Earl.

Humphrey V - did not become Earl as he predeceased his father in 1265. Grandfather of current Earl.

Humphrey IV (2nd Earl of Hereford) - succeeded 1220 as Earl of Hereford and died in 1275.  The great-grandfather of the current Earl and father of Margery de Bohun/Verdun.


Furthermore, Margery made no prior marriage with a Robert de W. He is a phantom, presumably a corruption of John de Worlemond.

I'm posting this here because I don't have a subscription to soc.genealogy.medieval and would prefer not to create a Google account to join.

CORRECTION:

Dozens of online trees have settled on Humphrey de Bohun VI, Earl of Hereford and Essex (died 1265) as Margery's father.

I have realised that this contradicts the de Bohun lineage which follows.  I was thrown out by inconsistent numbering for the succession of Humphreys found in online trees.

I should have said:

Dozens of online trees have settled on Humphrey de Bohun V (died 1265) as Margery's father.

[Biggles50]

Many thanks for the info.

Both my Wife and I have the Bohun’s in our tree but Humphrey 4th Earl Hereford is as far back as we went, he was my 19xGGF.

Even then we have not looked very much at this family.

[Skoosh]

Is this one of the same De Bohun family who followed Edward II to Scotland and impetuously charged at Robert the Bruce before Bannockburn. The king swerved aside, stood on his stirrups and split De Bohun with his battleaxe.

Ouch,
Skoosh.

[Biggles50]

It was Sir Henry de Bohun that was savagely hacked to death a Bannockburn by Robert the Bruce who also had his rival for the disputed throne brutally murdered some years prior during the period when various Scottish factions wheeled and dealed for the throne.

Sir Henry was the Son of Humphrey, 4th Earl of Hereford.

Sir Henry shows as my 18th Great Grand Uncle according to my Ancestry Tree.

[Skoosh]

"Savagely hacked to death!" where do you get this stuff, showing off in front of this enormous English army he thought he would make a name for himself, he charged Bruce with his lance, Bruce split him with one blow!
 What was he doing in Scotland anyhow? up for the golf he certainly never made it back. Like most of the army.
 His king had a worse fate and came to a bad end with the business end of a red hot poker.
 For double dealing, carnage & brutality see the English Wars of the Roses!

Skoosh.

Moderator comment: enough,    this was about clarifying some online information regarding a marriage, not the brutality of battles and war!   
Topic now locked.