Author Topic: George Hawkins need help finding birth  (Read 1077 times)

Offline raa

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Re: George Hawkins need help finding birth
« Reply #18 on: Thursday 08 June 23 18:47 BST (UK) »
Charles is a seaman age is not clear looks like 41 on51 cencus gives his birth as 1810 and when he died in feb 1855 age is 44 so birth i think 1810/1811 he signed his marriage cert witness Eliza Hawkins that would be step daughter and william blight underhill Margaret leaves a mark ages isnt clear on her death 1869 gives her death as 66 which would match up for her birth 1803 rattery she died at 32 southside st plymouth Charles is not relation and he had no children with Margaret but be interesting if hes Georges Brother 1830 they never gave out bride grooms parents

Offline raa

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Re: George Hawkins need help finding birth
« Reply #19 on: Thursday 08 June 23 19:34 BST (UK) »
cannot find birth for charles Hawkins around 1810 plymouth im starting to wonder if theres a miss spelling for his birth also odd on my dna nothing pops up on my Hawkins George i should have matches with as hes my 3rd great grandfather

Offline raa

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Re: George Hawkins need help finding birth
« Reply #20 on: Thursday 08 June 23 19:46 BST (UK) »
longshot George slocom Hawkins baptised 5 oct 1806 Sampford Courtenay, Devon  mother Ann   oooh and George Hawkins baptism 1803 staverton mother Mary  south hams thats not far outside plymouth  so a possible

Offline raa

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Re: George Hawkins need help finding birth
« Reply #21 on: Friday 09 June 23 05:20 BST (UK) »
if George and Charles were brothers still doesnt solve problem finding there borths theres no birth in plymouth 1811 for Charles Hawkins makes me wonder if either one is who they say they are


Offline Neale1961

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Re: George Hawkins need help finding birth
« Reply #22 on: Friday 09 June 23 08:46 BST (UK) »
I think it is a fairly good possibility that George and Charles were brothers – given that they seem to have been sharing the same address in Looe Street. If that is the case then knowing about Charles, gives you information about George that you didn’t have before – ie. born in Plymouth to father named William (a carpenter). Unfortunately early baptisms will not state the father’s occupation. But if you find baptisms for both a George around 1802-03 and a Charles around 1810-1811 with the same parents, then you might feel confident you have the correct ones. Be prepared to consider various spellings.

As you say, NO baptisms for either George and Charles have been found, but there do seem to be gaps in the records. For example, I could see burials in Charles the Martyr, Plymouth, but not baptisms for the time of interest. In my experience FindMyPast has the best coverage of Devon records – so I would try to see what records you can access there. Using FamilySearch, Ancestry and FreeReg, I could find no relevant baptisms.
----------------

I did some work on the witnesses to both marriages today, as often these turn out to be blood relations and can be important leads - apart from Eliza Hawkins.

William Blight UNDERHILL was born 1812 Plymouth. His parents Hugh and Grace were residents of Looe Street.

Ralph RYDER/ RIDER was born 1797 Modbury Devon. He was a cabinet maker – & his father Ralph was a mariner
Ralph Married Mary STONEMAN abt 1823
In 1841 living in Charles the Martyr Plymouth (Jubilee St)
In 1851 living in Charles the Martyr Plymouth (Salem St)
2nd wife jane PEPPERELL (married 1839)

Robert LEWIS was born abt 1804 Plymouth. He was a stone mason – & his father was a builder.
Robert married Georgiana BOWDITCH 1829 Plymouth
In 1841 living in Charles the Martyr Plymouth (North St)
In 1851 living in Charles the Martyr Plymouth (Green St)
----------------

Just a note for future reference - Charles says his father William Hawkins carpenter
There is a William Hawkins in the Plymouth workhouse in 1841 (age 65 – born abt 1776) and a baptism for him 1776 in Charles the Martyr. No way of knowing if this William is of interest at this stage.
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Offline jonw65

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Re: George Hawkins need help finding birth
« Reply #23 on: Friday 09 June 23 16:03 BST (UK) »
Charles is a seaman

Charles Hawkins was in the Royal Navy.
As we have seen before with some men in the RN, there appears to be a record (or records?) for him in the Merchant Seamen's Tickets
In BT 113
Issued at  Lee, 10 March 1846, when he was on HMS Collingwood
It says that Charles Hawkins was born in Plymouth, Devon, in March 1811 (no day given)
Capacity Seaman
Went to sea in 1829
In Royal Navy 17 years
When unemployed resides at Plymouth
Age when ticketed 35

There is a description of him, including that he was 5 feet 1½ inches tall, brown eyes, couldn't write.

He is also in the Royal Navy allotment books in 1848 (from image)
HMS Powerful
Chas Hawkins
Quality AB
Allotment paid to Wife Margaret
Married Plymouth August 1848
Residence of the Party allotted to 32 Looe Street Plymouth
He marked X
Index here
https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/C16483712

Offline jonw65

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Re: George Hawkins need help finding birth
« Reply #24 on: Friday 09 June 23 16:12 BST (UK) »
From the allotment books again, this seems to be him in 1838
HMS Malabar
Chas Hawkins
AB
Allotment paid to Mother Mary Ryder
Residence of the Party allotted to 32 Looe St. Plymouth
his X mark
Indexed here
https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/C15666403

Offline jonw65

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Re: George Hawkins need help finding birth
« Reply #25 on: Friday 09 June 23 16:28 BST (UK) »
Was Mary was still around in 1841?  :-\
In the census there is one in Batter Street, St. Charles
Mary Rider, 70, born in County
In ED 15, just 8 census pages before our George Hawkins in Looe Street
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:MQTR-TKJ

Not totally sure.
You would think that a widowed Mary Hawkins (or similar) married a Ryder/Rider after the birth of Charles, but I am not seeing anything.
We do of course have Ralph Rider witnessing George's marriage.

Offline osprey

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Re: George Hawkins need help finding birth
« Reply #26 on: Friday 09 June 23 17:28 BST (UK) »
possible marriages

Stoke Damerel 16 Jan 1812 Peter Pinwill house carpenter & Mary Hockings widow, witnesses James Pitten(?) & Wm Roberts
Burial St Andrew Plymouth 2 Dec 1821 Peter Pinwill 73

St Andrew Plymouth 27 March 1823 Ralph Rider labourer & widower & Mary Pinwell widow, witnesses Benjamin & James Boulter
Cornwall: Allen, Bevan, Bosisto, Carnpezzack, Donithorn, Huddy, James, Retallack, Russell, Vincent, Yeoman
Cards: Thomas (Llanbadarn Fawr)
Glam: Bowler, Cram, Galloway, James, Thomas, Watkins
Lincs: Coupland, Cram
Mon: Cram, Gwyn, John, Philpot, Smart, Watkins
Pembs: Edwards (St. Dogmael's)
Yorks: Airey, Bowler, Elliott, Hare, Hewitt, Kellett, Kemp, Stephenson, Tebb