Author Topic: Nena Lilian Prinsep  (Read 470 times)

Offline m23to53

  • RootsChat Senior
  • ****
  • Posts: 286
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Nena Lilian Prinsep
« on: Tuesday 29 August 23 11:47 BST (UK) »
A group of us have been researching Arthur Haversleigh Thoby Prinsep, 1862-1938, a character who used various names during his time in New Zealand and Australia for boxing, writing, avoiding the law because of bigamy, acting etc. His life would make a good film.
But though finding info about him, his siblings remain unknown. Nena Prinsep was born in Calcutta in 1868 and baptised that year (though her brothers born earlier were not baptised until 1875 in England), the sum of records found for her. She may be the Lilian Prinsep, a young painter visiting Guernsey in 1884 according to the island's paper 'The Star' (16/2/1884) but no evidence found. Her brother Ernest Charles is actually better recorded, later living and dying in England, though a birth date  of 1867 can not be proven. And there seems no evidence that Henry Prinsep, supposedly born 1865, actually existed - not helped by the birth in 1863 in Lucknow of a Henry Stewart Prinsep to different Prinsep parents.
Nena's birth is in the Findmypast India births, but none of her brothers, including Arthur, are.

Is it possible to find what happened to Nena, or the births of her brothers.

I have tried to keep this short otherwise I could go on for pages! I do have some notes on Arthur if you are interested.

Regards
John


Offline trish1120

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 28,067
  • Happy me
    • View Profile
Re: Nena Lilian Prinsep
« Reply #1 on: Tuesday 29 August 23 13:25 BST (UK) »
There are these 2 Marriages on FIBIS.
BENGAL

Marriage Year   1883
Husband First Names   Arthur J. H.
Husband Surname   Prinsep
Wife First Names   Adeline Mary
Wife Surname   Hinder


Marriage Year   1887
Husband First Names   Henry T.
Husband Surname   Prinsep
Wife First Names   Liela L.
Wife Surname   Skeen


FindMyPast seems to have the images.
All Census Look Ups Are Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Cummins, Miskelly(IRELAND + NZ) ,Leggett (SFK + NFK ENGLAND + NZ),Purdy ( NBL ENGLAND + NZ ), Shaw YKS, LANCs + NZ), Holdsworth(LINCS +LANCS + NZ), Moloney, Dean, Fitzpatrick, ( County Down,IRE) Newby(NBL.ENG, Costello(IRE), Ivers, Murray(IRE),Reay(NBL.ENG) Reid (BERW.SCOTLAND)

Offline timlindholm

  • RootsChat Pioneer
  • *
  • Posts: 1
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Nena Lilian Prinsep
« Reply #2 on: Wednesday 30 August 23 02:49 BST (UK) »
Hi Nena -- do you have the rather entertaining 2011 paper by John Malings about Arthur Prinsep? If not I could send. He was indeed an utter rogue! Would be most interested in your group trying to uncover more about him.

Tim Lindholm

Offline m23to53

  • RootsChat Senior
  • ****
  • Posts: 286
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Nena Lilian Prinsep
« Reply #3 on: Thursday 31 August 23 18:12 BST (UK) »
The 1887 marriage is that of Arthur's father, Henry Thoby Prinsep, not the supposed brother. We have now seen his mother's will which intimates that she was never married to Henry Thoby Prinsep, his father, but only to Charles Benjamin Roe whom she had married in 1855. A family tree says he was 1827-1900, but a search has produced no records to prove this - and not helping is his father's surname was Rowe according to a wedding record.
What a tangled web this family weaved.

John


Offline heywood

  • RootsChat Honorary
  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 39,986
    • View Profile
Re: Nena Lilian Prinsep
« Reply #4 on: Thursday 31 August 23 19:10 BST (UK) »
She may be the Lilian Prinsep, a young painter visiting Guernsey in 1884 according to the island's paper 'The Star' (16/2/1884)

Here is mention of a Lilian Prinsep in Geneva.
https://www.rootschat.com/links/01smc/
Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline Daisypetal

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 4,360
    • View Profile
Re: Nena Lilian Prinsep
« Reply #5 on: Friday 01 September 23 02:04 BST (UK) »

Hi,

Nena Lilian had a private baptism on the 11th August 1898, sadly I think it was because she was dying. The baptism gives her parent's as Henry Toby PRINCEP and Grace ROE. There is a death/burial record at FindMyPast for a Nina LILIAN,

Calcutta
DOD:  12 Aug 1868
Nina LILIAN
Age:  4M 28D
Illegitimate daughter of Grace ROE
Burial date:  12 Aug 1868
Cause of death: Diarrhoea

So she lost her name as well as her life. Poor little thing.

Regards,
Daisy
All Census Data included in this post is Crown Copyright (see: www.nationalarchives.gov.uk)

Offline Daisypetal

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 4,360
    • View Profile
Re: Nena Lilian Prinsep
« Reply #6 on: Friday 01 September 23 02:37 BST (UK) »

Is it possible that this is Henry PRISEP born 1865?

Baptism
Calcutta, St James, Bengal
DOB:  20 Nov 1865
Baptism:  03 May 1866
Henry 
son of Grace ROWE


Burial
Calcutta
DOD:  03 May 1866
Henry ROWE
Age:  5M 14D
Illegitimate son of Grace ROWE
Burial date:  04 May 1866
Cause of death: Cholera

All Census Data included in this post is Crown Copyright (see: www.nationalarchives.gov.uk)

Offline heywood

  • RootsChat Honorary
  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 39,986
    • View Profile
Re: Nena Lilian Prinsep
« Reply #7 on: Friday 01 September 23 07:49 BST (UK) »
Thank you Daisy. Thatís very sad re Nina and looks very likely re Henry.
Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline m23to53

  • RootsChat Senior
  • ****
  • Posts: 286
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Nena Lilian Prinsep
« Reply #8 on: Wednesday 11 October 23 13:16 BST (UK) »
I have now seen Grace's will in which she says she is married to George Roe/Rowe, not Prinsep. And we have found another infantile death of a child of Grace Phebe Roe, by a R. G. Evans !
Everything is uncertain as no birth record found for Arthur or Ernest, though seems they exist for others if that Nina Lilian and Henry were their siblings.
Seems Grace, the mother, was free and loose with her male friends.

Regards
John