Need help identifying John Birch DOB approx 1809 in Armagh

[stephie_brissie]

I’m having trouble identifying my 3 x GGF John Birch. He was (according to birth certificate and marriage certificate of my 2 x GGM his daughter) born in Armagh approximately 1809. I haven’t found how he travelled to Australia, where he landed or where/when he died. It is noted on my 2 x GGM birth certificate that John Birch married Susan Doherty in van diemans land in May 1851 but I cannot find this record. It is possible  they didn’t officially marry as she WAS married in 1848 in VDL to another man Walter Neiles, had a son with him also called Walter, who died in 1850 aged 2. She had another child by Walter who survived , a daughter called Sarah Jane Neiles. I cannot find any birth entry for Sarah either, only marriage record later in Victoria.
Walter seems to be out of the picture after this, as Susan and John Birch turn up as parents in 1853 with birth of son Joseph Henry Birch in Victoria, and then in 1856 my 2 x GGM Emma Jane is born in Kyneton, Victoria.
After that Susan Birch pops up a lot in newspaper articles on the Victorian goldfields, she seems to have been quite the character, but the only mention of her husband is in 1881 in an article where she claims he died 18 years earlier (about 1863) at pleasant creek ( now Stawell) , but again cannot find this record.
I have searched convicts coming to VDL and NSW- there were 12 John Birch’s who were transported to Australia - none of them match my John’s DOB or come from Ireland. It’s possible he was born in Armagh but lived in England and traveled from there but I can’t define MY John Birch. Please if anyone knows or can help me, this ancestry is an anomaly.

[Seelife]

Hi,
A John Birch was on the ship "Swift" in 1850 with a Conditional Pardon destination Melbourne.
Emigrant ship Bangalore fro Launceston.  Records on Findmypast avalable on Libraries Tasmania.
It gets a bit complicated, as there was a John Birch born 1852 in Tansmania and travelled to Melbourne , mothers name Ann Wright. There are other records

There was a John Birch, convict out of Portsmouth to Tasmania on the ship Palmyra departure 1 May 1846 arrival 23 Aug 1846. May be your guy, Tasmania Convict Records 1800-1893
Conduct Record CON33/1/81

There was another out of Bermuda, I dont think he is the right one.     

[stephie_brissie]

Thank you but neither of these John Birch’s are mine. The Bangalore one is the Bermuda one, died in Geelong Gaol in 1883, he was 31 y.o when he arrived in 1848 making his birth year approx 1817, and native place is Shoreditch. The Palmyra one also is from Shoreditch but was 20 y.o when he arrived in 1846 , so born about 1826, again too young. My John Birch, in 1856 on Emma’s birth cert he states his age as 47 - making him born approx 1809. Also he states he is from  Armagh, Ireland. He couldn’t read or write as he marks an X as signature.
Believe me when I say I have checked all the records I have found with no joy. But I’ll accept any other suggestions!

[garstonite]

2 Susan Doherty born in Australia on geneanet.org
one in Melbourne
one in Goornong
pay per view but maybe another member on Rootschat has credits to view the records
a warm welcome to Rootschat

https://en.geneanet.org/fonds/individus/?size=10&sexe=&nom=doherty&ignore_each_patronyme=&prenom=susan&prenom_operateur=or&ignore_each_prenom=&place__0__=&zonegeo__0__=Australia&country__0__=AUS&region__0__=&subregion__0__=&place__1__=&zonegeo__1__=&country__1__=&region__1__=&subregion__1__=&place__2__=&zonegeo__2__=&country__2__=&region__2__=&subregion__2__=&place__3__=&zonegeo__3__=&country__3__=&region__3__=&subregion__3__=&place__4__=&zonegeo__4__=&country__4__=&region__4__=&subregion__4__=&type_periode=between&from=1820&to=1840&exact_month=&exact_day=&exact_year=&go=1
..........................
ADDED Just noticed one died in 1843 - so it could be the Goornong Susan born 1821 and died 1911 - she had a good life

[garstonite]

make a note of the cemetery and area in case it pops up in your further research

https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/197050972/susan-birch

[stephie_brissie]

I have a lot of information on Susan Doherty Birch, it’s John , her partner/husband who is the mystery.
I know that Susan MARRIED Walter Neiles in Tasmania 1848, I have found a record for a baby Walter born 1848 and dying 1850 in Tasmania. There was a second child - Sarah Jane Neiles -so I’m assuming this child was also Walters’. She remains with Susan, travelling to the Victorian goldfields and marrying etc etc. Then in 1853 a child is born to Susan Doherty and John Birch , his name Joseph Henry Birch. I must say I cannot find birth records for Sarah or Joseph so I’m thinking that maybe Susan and John weren’t that fussed about registering properly? I think that because I suspect that John and Susan didn’t officially marry either! After baby Walter died I suspect Susan and Walter Neiles relationship broke down. Would appear he went to NZ, and she went to Victoria with John Birch (and started calling herself Birch ). The only family member I can find official records for is Emma Jane Birch , my relative, born in 1856. It’s her records that have provided me with the little information I have on John Birch. I was hoping the records for Sarah and Joseph could be found and might provide more clues.
Also, John Birch states his occupation in 1856 on Emma’s birth certificate is “servant” - which sounds strange. Could it mean “ servant of her majesty” or in other words still a convict?
And, on her marriage record his occupation is “miner” - this is in 1878, but on her death certificate (she died tragically in 1884 at 28 years of age) he is stated as being a “storekeeper”. My question is: if he died in 1863 as Susan claimed in a court document I have found, would it be noted that he was already deceased on Emma’s records? I thought so, but then maybe Susan is lying about him being dead. She is a very colourful character so maybe fabricating a back story isn’t beyond her!
I just don’t know when John Birch arrived in Australia, how he got there ( was he a free settler, convict, soldier, born there? ) and when or where he died. Just that he was born in Armagh, Ireland about 1809.

[garstonite]

Joseph Henry Birch was born in 1853 in Cham,,Victoria and died 1938 ...

https://en.geneanet.org/fonds/individus/?size=10&sexe=&nom=birch&ignore_each_patronyme=&prenom=joseph+henry&prenom_operateur=or&ignore_each_prenom=&place__0__=&zonegeo__0__=Victoria%2C+Australia&country__0__=AUS&region__0__=VIC&subregion__0__=&place__1__=&zonegeo__1__=&country__1__=&region__1__=&subregion__1__=&place__2__=&zonegeo__2__=&country__2__=&region__2__=&subregion__2__=&place__3__=&zonegeo__3__=&country__3__=&region__3__=&subregion__3__=&place__4__=&zonegeo__4__=&country__4__=&region__4__=&subregion__4__=&type_periode=between&from=1851&to=1854&exact_month=&exact_day=&exact_year=&go=1

[wivenhoe]

BDM TAS marriage
17 Apr 1848    Bethesda C of E  Hobart
NEALES Walter      28   plasterer  (NEILIS Walter convict "Maitland")
DOGHERTY Susan  26y spinster   (DOHERTY Susan convict "Tasmania")
witnesses John SWEENEY   Mary AITKINS                 all parties sign

birth   31 Aug 1848
NAILIS male   parents NAILIS Walter plasterer / Susan DOGHERTY
informant  Walter NAILIS (X)  New Town Rd  Sep 28

birth   19 Apr 1850
NILAS Walter    parents  Walter NILAS plasterer /  Susan DOMEGGIN
informant Walter NILAS (X)  Elizabeth St   27 May

death
NAILIS Walter 11 Aug 1850   2 yrs  plasters child  convulsions
informant father Walter NILAS (X)  Liverpool St 12 Aug


BDM VIC marriage
NEILES Sarah           marr. WALSH Robert                 87/1876

BIRCH Emma Jane   marr.  WISCH Gustav Andrew     3166/1878


"I have a lot of information on Susan Doherty Birch"
* What do you have for Susan after her convict arrival in Tasmania and from the time of her  appearance in Victoria?.  Do you have death details for Susan?

"Susan and Walter Neiles relationship broke down. Would appear he went to NZ"
*  see newspaper below 23 Nov 1876

* Birth, marriage and death certificate for Emma Jane BIRCH.
  For each of these records can you please list all the information on each.

"if he died in 1863 as Susan claimed in a court document I have found"
* what documents?...where did you find them?....what is the matter recorded?

McIvor Times and Rodney Advertiser  23 Nov 1876 p2
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/91835290?
.....W. K. HARRISON   V Sarah BIRCH......the defendants mother, having told the constable who left the summons at her place for her son that he had gone to New Zealand.....

Not awfully clear, but I read that to mean that a son has gone to New Zealand.
This reference to New Zealand is not about John BIRCH?.

McIvor Times and Rodney Advertiser 11 Jan 1877 p2
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/91835507?
.....Sarah NAILIS alias WELSH......

Bendigo Advertiser 13 Nov 1869  p3
https://trove.nla.gov.au/search/advanced/category/newspapers?
....you were cognisant of the fact that I was married as my ***me and the church in which I was married were inserted in the schedule. Mr Virtue told me that the schedule was useless as I am a married woman. Sarah Jane BIRCH corroborated the evidence of the last witness.

McIvor Times and  Rodney Advertiser 28 Jan 1881 p2
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/90139532?
My husband died eighteen years ago at Pleasant Creek. I am a widow.