Author Topic: I'd LOVE to figure out how the two families are related...  (Read 361 times)

Offline Ayashi

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I'd LOVE to figure out how the two families are related...
« on: Wednesday 29 January 25 14:29 GMT (UK) »
I've been trying to work out the family of a man I suspect is my 3rd great grandfather (father of illegitimate son).

Robert Love TELFORD was born in 1832, South Shields, the son of Henry Haggerston TELFORD and Ann GREENER. I have Henry's ancestry pretty well tracked for the most part, but Ann's has been a bit of a nightmare. If correct, her mother's maiden name was LAIDLER, one grandmother is unknown and the other is SMITH... Two children had the LOVE middle name (Robert and Francis Love TELFORD).

In both 1841 and 1851, Robert is not living with his parents but instead in the household of Francis LOVE (1799-1858, Durham) and his wife Ann (formerly DIXON, maiden name unknown). Robert is "nephew". Ann married Francis as a widow but I don't know her first marriage. They did not have children.

Given that I know more about Henry's side, I suspect Francis and Ann might be relatives on the GREENER side somewhere- if the family title isn't an honorific. I know Francis was the son of William LOVE and Isabella ANDERSON but struggled filling in even a few generations of his ancestry. Without his wife's first marriage, she's just a void in the whole puzzle.

I bought Francis' death certificate in the hope another family member was the informant, but I think he died at his half-brother's house and the informant was a neighbour or such. I don't know about Ann.

Hoping for fresh eyes and thoughts here. If this can be figured out, it could solidify so much of my research in this area. It's just obvious that the relation is a bit further removed than uncle/aunt - nephew 1st degree.

TIA
Ayashi

Online familydar

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Re: I'd LOVE to figure out how the two families are related...
« Reply #1 on: Wednesday 29 January 25 15:25 GMT (UK) »
You don't give Ann Love's dates.  Is there any possibility that she's Ann Greener who perhaps married a Dixon after being widowed and was then widowed a second time before marrying Francis Love?

Jane :-)
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Online rosie99

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Re: I'd LOVE to figure out how the two families are related...
« Reply #2 on: Wednesday 29 January 25 15:41 GMT (UK) »
There is a baptism at St Hilda's, South Shields on 22 Jul 1832 for a Robert Telford parents Henry and Ann, no middle names mentioned.  Is that who you are referring to
Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline Ayashi

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Re: I'd LOVE to figure out how the two families are related...
« Reply #3 on: Wednesday 29 January 25 15:46 GMT (UK) »
Sorry, you are right lol. Ann ??/DIXON/LOVE was born 1786, Usworth, Durham, unknown death. They are two different people- aside from anything else, both women were alive at the same time.

Ann TELFORD nee GREENER was born c1810, North Shields.

~

Yes, that appears to be it. He appears on other records with the middle name LOVE and I think at least one where he appears with middle name HAGGERSTON (possibly in error, it was a common middle name from his father's side).


Offline WolfieSmith

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Re: I'd LOVE to figure out how the two families are related...
« Reply #4 on: Tuesday 04 February 25 22:15 GMT (UK) »
Ann Telford (nee Greener) consistently says in census that she was born North Shields abt 1811.

There is an Ann Greener baptised in Tynemouth 1812, 1st daughter of John Greener, Labourer of North Shields, native of Stannington and Hannah Davison, native of Washington.

Ann, wife of Francis Love, formerly Dixon nee ? says she was born Usworth abt 1785.

There are two Davidsons aged 20 and 15 living with the Love family in 1841 as well as Robert Telford, possibly another nephew/niece of Ann Love.

A baptism at Washington ;

Hannah Davison of Old Stables, 13 Dec 1789, dau of William & Hannah.

A baptism at a church in Chester Le St Area (could be Washington or Lamesley) on the free search facility on DRO.

Anne Davison of Great Usworth, 1784, dau of William & Hannah,

Needs more work but seems to fit.

Alan,

 


 


Northumberland - Smith, Willis,
Durham - Rogerson, Child
Cumberland - Irving, Hill
North Yorkshire - Layfield,
Ireland - Collins

Offline Ayashi

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Re: I'd LOVE to figure out how the two families are related...
« Reply #5 on: Wednesday 05 February 25 00:02 GMT (UK) »
Interesting, thank you for that!

If that's right, it does throw other things out the window, I had some tentative DNA work on that line that seemed to suggest a different christening.

I'll have a poke at this tomorrow :)

Offline WolfieSmith

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Re: I'd LOVE to figure out how the two families are related...
« Reply #6 on: Friday 14 February 25 21:24 GMT (UK) »
A couple of things I noted.

The Hannah Davison from Washington marries a Robert Stoker in Tynemouth in 1823, then moves to County Durham with husband working in the mines, and children.
I cant find a marriage for John Greener and Hannah Davison or any baptism after Ann Greener birth in 1812.

Ann Davison and Hannah Davison from Usworth/Washington have a brother Benjamin Davison.

This looks to be him in 1861 with his second wife and second family (had an extensive first family and remarried in 1838, presumably as a widower)

Witton, North Bedburn, Durham
Benjamin Davison, 64, Coal Miner, b Durham, Aisworth,
Eleanor, 36, wife, b Northumberland, Gosforth,
William, 12 b North Bedburn,
John A, 5, b North Bedburn,
Benjamin, 4, b North Bedburn,
Hannah, 1, b North Bedburn,
Mary Anderson, Mother in Law, 70, b Ovingham,

This is the family in 1851, ages and birth places are way out, but its the same family. Anderson grandparents are a few doors away.

New Bitchburn, North Bedburn,
Benjamin Davison, 46, Coal Miner, b Wallsend,
Eleanor, 30, b. Fawdon,
William, 2 b Bitchburn.

Eleanor is widowed in 1871, 47, b Fawdon, all children born Bitchburn.

Interesting thing is where they are living in 1851.

Bitchburn Colliery owner was Joseph Love, who seems to be the older brother of Francis Love. Living in the houses immediately either side of Benjamin Davison are : George Love, Ralph Love. Allan Love & Anthony Love and their families. They all appear to be younger half brothers of Francis Love.

Alan
 
Northumberland - Smith, Willis,
Durham - Rogerson, Child
Cumberland - Irving, Hill
North Yorkshire - Layfield,
Ireland - Collins

Offline Ayashi

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Thank you.

I did try tracing the children from the census and wasn't able to get anywhere with it.

I'll have another go with this new information. Thank you for remembering me and having a good rummage!

If I'm lucky I might be able to re-link up with the potential GREENER DNA matches through the GREENER line. Deviating from my original suspicions is a bit painful  ::) but this investigation has already taken a few turns. I've been trying to get legitimate descendants to confirm or disprove my theories but the only person who answered me was managing DNA results for someone who has since died. This is going to be one of those looong ones...

- Edit: OK, now I want to scream. DAVISON married MASON, descended from HAGGERSTON(E), specifically Ann the aunt of Frances HAGGERSTON who married William TELFORD (the parents of Henry Haggerston TELFORD)  ::)