Author Topic: Description "lunatic" and "imbecile" on Census  (Read 33251 times)

Offline IgorStrav

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Re: Description "lunatic" and "imbecile" on Census
« Reply #9 on: Sunday 08 March 09 12:28 GMT (UK) »
Paulene, I agree with China that it is INVALIDE.

I wonder if she had some physical impairment which made walking etc difficult, which might explain her being able to work in a clerical sort of capacity, but have difficulty washing, getting dressed etc. 

I have now done some further research on the family I mention, and have discovered that their first child died in infancy, their second was the "lunatic", their third boy died at the age of 4, then they had two more boys, a second daughter who was the "imbecile" and then a final son. 

As if this wasn't enough tragedy, the eldest boy died at 22, followed closely by the mother aged 50, then the father died three years later aged 54, leaving the "imbecile" daughter to be put into Darenth Asylum - she was there, aged 13, in 1901 - and the youngest boy to go and live with an aunt.  I think the girl died, aged 34, in an asylum.

Fortunately, the three surviving boys seem to have done well, the youngest emigrating to USA at the age of 17, and then followed by his next brother.

Although I am not very closely connected, I may send away for the death certificates to see if this gives any clues to the precise ailments the children suffered, and why the parents died at such a young age.

I am horrified to think that an ailment which could be in some way treated, or at least mitigated by technology these days, might have led to a life in an asylum - although of course, that could be the result of a youthful mistake leading to unmarried pregnancy in some cases.

At the risk of repeating a sentiment often seen on these pages, it is very humbling to see the difficulties our ancestors laboured under, and I am immensely grateful to have the benefits we enjoy now.


Pay, Kent. 
Barham, Kent. 
Cork(e), Kent. 
Cooley, Kent.
Barwell, Rutland/Northants/Greenwich.
Cotterill, Derbys.
Van Steenhoven/Steenhoven/Hoven, Nord Brabant/Belgium/East London.
Kesneer Belgium/East London
Burton, East London.
Barlow, East London
Wayling, East London
Wade, Greenwich/Brightlingsea, Essex.
Thorpe, Brightlingsea, Essex

Offline willow154

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Re: Description "lunatic" and "imbecile" on Census
« Reply #10 on: Sunday 08 March 09 20:46 GMT (UK) »
Hi JAP, China and IgorStrav,

Thank you for your replies - it does look more like invalide, but what confused me was that that wasn't one of the criteria that was specified. I've just has a look at 'Ancestry Trails' and I see that:
The 1851 and 1861 returns specify whether people were blind, deaf or "idiot" and the 1871 and 1881 returns note whether a person was "blind, deaf, imbecile, idiot or lunatic".
I'm not completely sure what the difference is between an "idiot" or an "imbecile" - is it the degree, maybe?
The other confusing thing is, that on the 1891 and 1901 census, Hannah is recorded as a laundress or charwoman - so she was obviously physically able to carry out what must have been a mobile and energetic occupation!

IgorStrav, yes you're right we should be very grateful that our lives today are far easier today; however, I do worry that some poor souls in some countries still suffer some of the ordeals we have thankfully put in the past. But, at least there is progress in some places, and that is a start.

Paulene :)

Offline IgorStrav

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Re: Description "lunatic" and "imbecile" on Census
« Reply #11 on: Sunday 08 March 09 20:52 GMT (UK) »
Paulene, Stan explained that the wording is in the hands of the householder, not the enumerator, so whether "idiot", "imbecile" or "lunatic" was chosen depended on the understanding of someone who might be quite uneducated or indeed illiterate.

I suppose the "invalide" definition was just something that came up to express some sort of physical incapacity in one census only.  But I'm as unsure as you are what it could have been, if she was actually able to be a charwoman in later life.

And you are right about other countries.  :(
Pay, Kent. 
Barham, Kent. 
Cork(e), Kent. 
Cooley, Kent.
Barwell, Rutland/Northants/Greenwich.
Cotterill, Derbys.
Van Steenhoven/Steenhoven/Hoven, Nord Brabant/Belgium/East London.
Kesneer Belgium/East London
Burton, East London.
Barlow, East London
Wayling, East London
Wade, Greenwich/Brightlingsea, Essex.
Thorpe, Brightlingsea, Essex

Offline angelan

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Re: Description "lunatic" and "imbecile" on Census
« Reply #12 on: Sunday 08 March 09 20:58 GMT (UK) »
Thank you for your replies - it does look more like invalide, but what confused me was that that wasn't one of the criteria that was specified

I have seen other 'ailments' added to the final column in census records.
One ancestor was described as Consumptive, he died the following year leaving a widow and several young children.

I have also seen deaf, dumb, and also blind added to this column.

Regards
Angela


Offline stanmapstone

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Re: Description "lunatic" and "imbecile" on Census
« Reply #13 on: Sunday 08 March 09 21:54 GMT (UK) »
From the 1881 Census Rport
Use of terms insane, lunatic, idiot, imbecile
No accurate line of demarcation can be drawn between the several conditions indicated by those terms. Speaking generally, however, the term idiot is applied in popular usuage simply to those who suffer from congenital mental deficiency, and the term imbecile to persons who have fallen in later life into a state of chronic dementia. But it is certain that neither this nor any other definite distinction between the terms was rigorously observed in the schedules, and consequently no attempt has been made by us to seperate imbeciles from idiots. The term lunatic also is used with some vagueness, and probably some persons suffering from congenital idiocy, and many more suffering from dementia, were returned under this name. Still, as a rule, the term lunatic is not used to include persons suffering from such affections, but is limited to those afflicted by more acute forms of mental disease. We have, therefore, separated the lunatics from the idiots and imbeciles; the division being desirable for practical purposes hereafter to be mentioned. Some term, however, was required by us which should stand for all kinds of mental unsoundness, and for convenience we have taken the term insanity to include them all.


From the 1891 Census Report.
VII.—PHYSICAL INFIRMITIES.
The physical infirmities with which alone we are concerned are blindness, deafness, and mental derangement. We fear that the returns of persons suffering from these several defects, and especially of those suffering from the two last-mentioned, are in all probability excessively inaccurate.


From the 1901 Census Report
3. The Insane.
Doubt has often been expressed as to whether the value of the information relating to mental infirmities which may be obtained from the ordinary Census Schedules is sufficient to warrant the continued demand for such details at the hand of the English householder.


http://www.visionofbritain.org.uk/index.jsp

As Edward Higgs states in his book "Making Sense of the Census"
The degree of confusion in filling in this column is made plain by the insertion of information regarding afflictions other than those required.... The indications are, therefore, that the information relating to medical disabilities is very untrustworthy.

Stan
Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline stanmapstone

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Re: Description "lunatic" and "imbecile" on Census
« Reply #14 on: Sunday 08 March 09 22:09 GMT (UK) »
Just to add from the Report on the 1911 Census

The other reason why the returns regarding the number of mentally infirm persons are unsatisfactory is due to the risks arising from the confusion of terms. The terms themselves are not defined in the scheduled instruction. This was scarcely possible; but the term " lunatic " is intended for use in cases where the infirmity has been acquired during life, while the terms "imbecile " and "feeble-minded" are intended for use in cases where the infirmity has existed from birth, or from an early age, the former being applied to the more extreme cases, and the latter to the milder. An examination of the returns, however, provides ample evidence that these distinctions have not been uniformly made.
http://www.visionofbritain.org.uk/index.jsp

Stan
Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline Little Nell

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Re: Description "lunatic" and "imbecile" on Census
« Reply #15 on: Sunday 08 March 09 22:15 GMT (UK) »
This has been asked before - and no doubt will be again   ;) -

The Gendocs site gave the following definitions for these terms as used on the census returns.

Lunatic: somone who is mentally ill with periods of lucidity.

Imbecile: people who have fallen in later life into a state of chronic dementia (sounds like Alzheimers.)

Idiot: a person who suffers from congenital mental deficiency.

The site has moved and can be found here:

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/hitch/gendocs/abbrcen.html

Lots of other useful information there as well.

Nell

All census information: Crown Copyright www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline willow154

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Re: Description "lunatic" and "imbecile" on Census
« Reply #16 on: Sunday 08 March 09 23:44 GMT (UK) »
Thank you, Stan and Nell :)

Offline stanmapstone

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Re: Description "lunatic" and "imbecile" on Census
« Reply #17 on: Monday 09 March 09 09:19 GMT (UK) »


The Gendocs site gave the following definitions for these terms as used on the census returns.


The terms themselves are not defined in the scheduled instructions.  :) It depends entirely what the person filling in the schedule thought, which is why the census report says they "are are in all probability excessively inaccurate".

Stan
Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk