Author Topic: BAILEY & CLARKE - Wattisfield/Redgrave area  (Read 5321 times)

Offline AndrewMartin

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BAILEY & CLARKE - Wattisfield/Redgrave area
« on: Monday 17 August 09 17:23 BST (UK) »
Hello,

I've been rummaging through records for a while now for the death (to lead me ultimately to the birth and parents) of Mary Bailey, (née Clarke).

My first acquaintance with her was on 20th July 1835 when she appeared as the mother to the illegitimately born Caroline Clarke (my Gt Gt Gt Grandmother) at Wattisfield, Suffolk.

22nd October 1837 is the next date that i've found her on, when she's once again at Wattisfield's parish church at the baptism of her illegitimate son Edward Jarman Clarke.

On the 8th November 1838 she married widower William Bailey, and that's it.

By the time of the 1841 census, she's gone, leaving behind William Bailey, some children from his first marriage, with Mary's two illegitimate children - Caroline and Edward - and also an Ellis Bailey aged 2.

With such a narrow time frame to examine (8th Nov 1838-6th June 1841) i decided to look through the parish records for Wattisfield and Redgrave with Botesdale for a baptism of Ellis (i'm assuming he is a 'he') and also a burial for Mary Bailey... but there was nothing.

Unfortunately, the Suffolk Records Office at Bury St Edmunds, doesn't hold the original records, just fiche and I couldn't find an index for burials and baptisms... so I'm a bit puzzled.

I *did* find a potential death in the neighbouring district of Thingoe (courtesy of freeBMD):

Deaths Dec 1840
BAILEY    Mary    Thingoe    13    541

but I'm wondering whether I should bite the bullet and just order it?

Perhaps someone reading this has a note of Mary Bailey's death inbetween Nov 1838 and June 1841... or even Ellis' birth around 1839.

I've tried familysearch.org too... but nothing is catching my eye.

What do you reckon?





Andrew Martin
Cambridgeshire, England.
www.familytreeuk.co.uk
www.historyrepeating.org.uk
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Researching: BABBIDGE, BAILEY, BARBER, BARKER, BISHOP, BOULTER, BOWERS, BRIGHTWELL, BURNELL, CLARKE, COOPER, CROSS, DEWEY, DEWSBURY, FLOWER, FREEMAN, GAWTHROP, GIDDINGS, GIGNER, GILBERT, GILLIONS, GOLTRIP, GOTHARD, HARRISON, HAWKINS, IRONS, JEFFERY, LEVITT, MARTIN, MODEN, NEWMAN, NEWELL, ONG, TALL, TAYLOR, TINGEY, WHITEHEAD, YARROW.

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Offline amber39

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Re: Bailey and Clarke in Wattisfield/Redgrave area
« Reply #1 on: Monday 17 August 09 18:06 BST (UK) »
I wondered if I could find Mary on the 1851 Census and she was still alive. I found a Mary Bailey age 39  born Wattisfield and living in Eye  Workhouse ,she is given as  Married and a Pauper

This could be a possibility!
Maybe her and her husband had a disagreement and she left home.or he turned her out.

I have a vivid imagination !!!


Regards   Amber39.
Norfolk: Copling,Coppen ,Oakley, Vertigans, Cracknell
Suffolk:  Grist, Scopes, Bullenthorpe. Knights,Watcham
Cambs.: Wilson, Andrews.
London: Monk

We must learn to regard people less in the light of what they do or omit to do, but more in the light of what they suffer.  Dietrich Bonhoeffer

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Offline AndrewMartin

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Re: Bailey and Clarke in Wattisfield/Redgrave area
« Reply #2 on: Monday 17 August 09 18:43 BST (UK) »
Amber, thank you for this. I'll investigate this!

That's a great idea. I wonder what would have led her to the workhouse? The disagreement or a health problem?

Andrew Martin
Cambridgeshire, England.
www.familytreeuk.co.uk
www.historyrepeating.org.uk
www.twitter.com/familytreeuk

Researching: BABBIDGE, BAILEY, BARBER, BARKER, BISHOP, BOULTER, BOWERS, BRIGHTWELL, BURNELL, CLARKE, COOPER, CROSS, DEWEY, DEWSBURY, FLOWER, FREEMAN, GAWTHROP, GIDDINGS, GIGNER, GILBERT, GILLIONS, GOLTRIP, GOTHARD, HARRISON, HAWKINS, IRONS, JEFFERY, LEVITT, MARTIN, MODEN, NEWMAN, NEWELL, ONG, TALL, TAYLOR, TINGEY, WHITEHEAD, YARROW.

Offline AndrewMartin

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Re: Bailey and Clarke in Wattisfield/Redgrave area
« Reply #3 on: Monday 17 August 09 19:25 BST (UK) »
right, thanks to Amber, i think i've got her aged 68 on the 1881 census as an inmate and housekeeper at the Hartismere Union Workhouse.

That's a long term at the workhouse : /

Her step daughter and her son also had spells in the workhouse but I wonder what happened to William Bailey as he struggled (presumably) with the young children?

http://www.workhouses.org.uk/index.html?Hartismere/Hartismere1881.shtml
Andrew Martin
Cambridgeshire, England.
www.familytreeuk.co.uk
www.historyrepeating.org.uk
www.twitter.com/familytreeuk

Researching: BABBIDGE, BAILEY, BARBER, BARKER, BISHOP, BOULTER, BOWERS, BRIGHTWELL, BURNELL, CLARKE, COOPER, CROSS, DEWEY, DEWSBURY, FLOWER, FREEMAN, GAWTHROP, GIDDINGS, GIGNER, GILBERT, GILLIONS, GOLTRIP, GOTHARD, HARRISON, HAWKINS, IRONS, JEFFERY, LEVITT, MARTIN, MODEN, NEWMAN, NEWELL, ONG, TALL, TAYLOR, TINGEY, WHITEHEAD, YARROW.

Offline Greensleeves

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Re: Bailey and Clarke in Wattisfield/Redgrave area
« Reply #4 on: Monday 17 August 09 21:32 BST (UK) »
I don't know if this is of any use, but FreeBMD has a death of Ellis Bailey at Hartismere in September Quarter 1870.  Also, in the 1861 census there is an Ellis Bailey, aged 21, an Ag Lab, at Botesdale (which is also in the Hartismere district).  Next-door to him is the family of William Bailey (56) with wife Mary and various younger  children.  Probably not the same family, but might be worth a check: RG9 Piece 1149, Folio 5, Page 3.

Greensleeves
Suffolk: Pearl(e),  Garnham, Southgate, Blo(o)mfield, Laws, Josselyn/Josslyn/Josling/Gosling
Durham/Yorkshire: Sedgwick/Sidgwick, Shadforth, Thompson, Rudd, Mattingley
Ireland: Davis
Norway: Torreson/Torsen/Torrison
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline AndrewMartin

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Re: BAILEY & CLARKE - Wattisfield/Redgrave area
« Reply #5 on: Friday 28 August 09 21:24 BST (UK) »
Thanks Greensleeves, I'll check this out :)

I've just found Edward Jarman Clark (the illegitimate brother to my illegitimate ancestor) in 1881 at Semer, Suffolk, with his wife and four children. He (or the writer) added an 'e' to the surname.

Sounds like Mary Bailey (Clark) was having trouble as it seems that she's in, out, and back in the workhouse. Perhaps she was doing a Jeffery Archer and I'm just a few clues away from a literary career. ;)
Andrew Martin
Cambridgeshire, England.
www.familytreeuk.co.uk
www.historyrepeating.org.uk
www.twitter.com/familytreeuk

Researching: BABBIDGE, BAILEY, BARBER, BARKER, BISHOP, BOULTER, BOWERS, BRIGHTWELL, BURNELL, CLARKE, COOPER, CROSS, DEWEY, DEWSBURY, FLOWER, FREEMAN, GAWTHROP, GIDDINGS, GIGNER, GILBERT, GILLIONS, GOLTRIP, GOTHARD, HARRISON, HAWKINS, IRONS, JEFFERY, LEVITT, MARTIN, MODEN, NEWMAN, NEWELL, ONG, TALL, TAYLOR, TINGEY, WHITEHEAD, YARROW.

Offline Greensleeves

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Re: BAILEY & CLARKE - Wattisfield/Redgrave area
« Reply #6 on: Saturday 29 August 09 10:05 BST (UK) »
Hmmm.... I have ancestors in Semer, and I also have Clark(e)s in my tree.  Am going to have to rummage in some old notebooks to see if I have gleaned anything which might be of use to you, but which  has not been included in my tree.

Will get back to you once I've had a chance to check.  If your tree is anything like mine, I wouldn't hold out any hopes of exciting occupations: on the Suffolk side I come from a long line of Ag Labs, enlivened occasionally by a Wheelwright or Boy At Post Office!

Regards,
Greensleeves
Suffolk: Pearl(e),  Garnham, Southgate, Blo(o)mfield, Laws, Josselyn/Josslyn/Josling/Gosling
Durham/Yorkshire: Sedgwick/Sidgwick, Shadforth, Thompson, Rudd, Mattingley
Ireland: Davis
Norway: Torreson/Torsen/Torrison
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline AndrewMartin

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Re: BAILEY & CLARKE - Wattisfield/Redgrave area
« Reply #7 on: Thursday 26 November 09 19:12 GMT (UK) »
I've found the missing Mary Bailey (nee Clarke) in 1841.

She's not with her husband, children and step-children in cosy Botesdale, Suffolk... instead, she's in Ipswich with her 6mth old daughter Emily Bailey.

In fact, she's serving a 6 month sentence at Ipswich County Gaol for "ill-using children".

What do we reckon "ill-using children" mean? At first I thought it meant physically abusing them... but then I wondered whether it meant that she was making them go to work - as it's only a 6mth sentence.

It's definitely her though - Ipswich Records Office told me (from the Gaol Book), the name of her father (William Clarke), her abode (Botesdale) and her age (29) - which are all correct.

Oh dear!

Andrew Martin
Cambridgeshire, England.
www.familytreeuk.co.uk
www.historyrepeating.org.uk
www.twitter.com/familytreeuk

Researching: BABBIDGE, BAILEY, BARBER, BARKER, BISHOP, BOULTER, BOWERS, BRIGHTWELL, BURNELL, CLARKE, COOPER, CROSS, DEWEY, DEWSBURY, FLOWER, FREEMAN, GAWTHROP, GIDDINGS, GIGNER, GILBERT, GILLIONS, GOLTRIP, GOTHARD, HARRISON, HAWKINS, IRONS, JEFFERY, LEVITT, MARTIN, MODEN, NEWMAN, NEWELL, ONG, TALL, TAYLOR, TINGEY, WHITEHEAD, YARROW.

Offline AndrewMartin

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Re: BAILEY & CLARKE - Wattisfield/Redgrave area
« Reply #8 on: Thursday 26 November 09 19:15 GMT (UK) »
What do we reckon "ill-using children" mean? At first I thought it meant physically abusing them... but then I wondered whether it meant that she was making them go to work - as it's only a 6mth sentence.

Plus, if she WAS abusing children, then why would they stick her in gaol with her 6mth old daughter - surely if she was guilty, then it would have been counterproductive? So i reckon it's something like child labour.

I will of course be getting copies of the documents that refer to her.. so it will probably go into proper details that the archivist wasn't allowed to summarise for me in the few minutes he spent emailing me back.

Interesting stuff!
Andrew Martin
Cambridgeshire, England.
www.familytreeuk.co.uk
www.historyrepeating.org.uk
www.twitter.com/familytreeuk

Researching: BABBIDGE, BAILEY, BARBER, BARKER, BISHOP, BOULTER, BOWERS, BRIGHTWELL, BURNELL, CLARKE, COOPER, CROSS, DEWEY, DEWSBURY, FLOWER, FREEMAN, GAWTHROP, GIDDINGS, GIGNER, GILBERT, GILLIONS, GOLTRIP, GOTHARD, HARRISON, HAWKINS, IRONS, JEFFERY, LEVITT, MARTIN, MODEN, NEWMAN, NEWELL, ONG, TALL, TAYLOR, TINGEY, WHITEHEAD, YARROW.