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Messages - jayaygee

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Handwriting Deciphering & Recognition / Re: Old French Documengs
« on: Sunday 16 April 17 14:01 BST (UK)  »
What a great find you have made.  On the first page it says it is a register of deeds and contracts drawn up by Pons BAUDOIN notary royal in residence in the town of Pradelles in the years 1594 and 1595, plus some words I can't make out.  On Généanet, there is a tree which includes a Pons Baudoin 1560-1610 notary in Pradelles, Haute Loire, so it very much looks like him.  The second paragraph is in Latin and quite beyond me.

Theoretically, the proper place for this sort of document here in France is in the relevant Archives Départementales as they enable research beyond the beginnings of most parish registers. They are invaluable to family historians, needless to say.

Unless anyone else does so in the meantime, I'll try and see what the documents are about, but I'm no expert.

Europe / Re: Campion - Normandy
« on: Sunday 09 April 17 17:26 BST (UK)  »
In case it's of interest, Marie GONDOUIN, wife of Michel CAMPION, died on 23rd September, aged 56, and was buried on 24th September 1782, and a Michel CAMPION, aged 70, died on 1st October and was buried on 2nd October 1782, both entries on image 324/431 of the parish register of St Jacques, Lisieux, BMS 1777-1783, Archives Départementales du Calvados, collection communale.

Also Michel CAMPION and Marie GONDOUIN were married in the same church on 30th October 1751.  His parents were Richard CAMPION (deceased) and Françoise BINACEL and hers were Pierre GONDOUIN and Hélaine CARPANTIER (sic) - image 78/589 BMS 1750-1760 St Jacques, Lisieux, AD Calvados, collection communale.


Europe / Re: Campion - Normandy
« on: Monday 03 April 17 22:43 BST (UK)  »
Thanks for the reply. It's the parents of Jacques Campion that I'm trying to discover, is it Michel Campion & Marie Lelong or Michel Campion & Marie Gondouin?

Sorry, my error - I got muddled!

My idea is:
M. Gondouin married Marie Anne Lelong
M. Gondouin died
Marie Ann (widow Gondouin) married Michel Campion in 1751
Michel Campion and Marie Anne (nee Lelong) had son Jacques.

Unfortunately that is most unlikely as women are virtually always recorded under their maiden names in France throughout their lives.  I have only seen death records using their married names in one place in SW France for a short period, and though obviously I haven't by any means seen everything everywhere, my husband's ancestors are spread over a large number of departments all over the country.  For what it's worth.


Europe / Re: French birth records circa 1730
« on: Sunday 05 March 17 09:22 GMT (UK)  »
To continue :

- St Roch  : Marriages 1785-1791 (National Library - ref Ms. fr. 8625)
                  Parish register 1790 (Paris Archives - ref V.6E I)

- St Eustache  :  Baptisms, marriages and burials 1529-1748 (National Library - ref  Ms. fr. 32587)

There is also a file listing the parishioners of St Eustache mainly in the 17th and 18th centuries but also some 16th century which uses the above register and other printed and manuscript sources.  The amount of information on individuals varies.  The original is held at St Eustache, but the Paris Archives have a reproduction.

I haven't checked if any of these are online or microfilmed.

Europe / Re: French birth records circa 1730
« on: Sunday 05 March 17 09:08 GMT (UK)  »
Surviving parish registers for the present-day 1st district of Paris where the Louvre is located:

- St Roch  :  Baptisms, marriages et burials  1733-1745 held at the National Library (ref. Ms fr.32585)
                   Marriages 1785-1791 held at the N

Europe / Re: French birth records circa 1730
« on: Saturday 04 March 17 11:17 GMT (UK)  »
The notary records wern't burnt, furtunately, because they had not been collected in one place or were not in the same place as the civil registration and parish registers (annexe of the City Hall and Palais de Justice.  I think most were still with the notaries in 1871. The Minutier Central at the National Archives wasn't created until 1928.

Most notary records are at the Departmental Record Offices of the "département" concerned which may explain why all the entries you have seen are from Paris.  It depends what you have looked at but there are certainly very large numbers of other records from elsewhere.  Apprenticeship contracts could be drawn up by notaries and therefore are most likely to be in the relevant Archives départementales if outside Paris.

Have you looked at these sites :

-  (Paris is both a city and a département these are the Departmental Archives but I don't think they have much if anything online that goes back to the 18th century)

- (the equivalent of the British Library online - can be very useful)

-  (the French Wikipedia for genealogy, though I think Family Search has something similar - no English version I'm afraid)

-  (about wine merchants in Paris - English version)

- (nothing online and closed until October

-  (a long shot, but you can search by name - not much online)

Europe / Re: French birth records circa 1730
« on: Friday 03 March 17 23:42 GMT (UK)  »
From what it says on the National Archives page you give the link to, it doesn't look as if everything is online as yet but it should be in the course of 2017. What is not clear to me is if all the Paris notary archives have been deposited or not, and I imagine that some will have been lost over the centuries.

I don't know if apprenticeship records would be complete, I'm afraid.

Hopefully someone else will be able to answer your questions better than I can. As I said before, I have no personal experience of researching in the Paris area archives.

Europe / Re: French birth records circa 1730
« on: Friday 03 March 17 16:34 GMT (UK)  »
Unfortunately, virtually all Paris parish records were destroyed by fire in 1871.  Some attempts have been made to piece some of them together again using other sources.  If you can find the name of the person you want here

there may be some hope, but this is just a sort of list, more or less the equivalent of the "tables décennales" and the details are only available in the Paris record office reading room. 

There are a few parish registers that escaped the flames and some copies that were made before the fire, but you would need to know the parish, I think, though I don't have any personal experience of searching in the Paris area.  As far as I can see they are held in a variety of repositories.

I know some family history societies are working on legal documents in the National Archives to extract genealogical information but I don't know what years are covered.  You could look here as I think at least some of the results have been put on this site:

You won't be able to see any details, as you need points to do this, but I could look for you if you find anything of interest.  And of course, there is always Généanet which has been suggested to you before, I think.

If no one else has more information and/or more helpful suggestions to make, I could make some enquiries at a big family history fair in Paris on 10th and 11th March if you don't mind giving me any details you have about the person you are looking for.

Europe / Re: POLAND: Isaac and Hettie SILVER
« on: Thursday 02 March 17 17:11 GMT (UK)  »
Shame it wasn't.

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