LEMON

[squires]

Hi everyone

I don't know if there is a connection to the Lemon ancestry being posted on this page and my G Grandmother Sarah Ann Lemon who married William Thompson in Trinity C of I church in Belfast on 07/06/1881. Sarah's father was called William Lemon

In the 1911 census under 'where born', Sarah has Co. Donegal, but searches for Lemon births or marriages in or around her approx DOB in Donegall comes up with zero results. I am thinking maybe Sarah's maternal family came from Donegal (not Lemons) but her paternal Lemon family came from elsewhere, possibly Monaghan

Will be travelling back home in Dec/Jan for a holiday and will hopefully use up a day or two at PRONI although I don't know how much information I will retrieve from Counties 'south' of the border. Until then I would love to get as much information as possible

Frances

[Toddstown]

After spending all day on this TODD/LEMON inquiry yesterday (who is to get the bill for this?) it seems prudent to ask a couple of important leading questions… This is the Andrew TODD (c1756/1843) born in County Down IRE line of LEMONs in Co Monaghan...

1. When did John LEMON b. c1846, the husband of Harriett Ann WILLIAMSON, die?  Could it be 1883? Is it known?

Eliz3 wrote:
John LEMON of Killacronaghan married Harriet Ann WILLIAMSON on 18th January 1867 at Presbyterian Church, Smithboro, Co. Monaghan.   His father is given as David LEMON while hers is John Williamson of Listillen;  she was just 19 years old.   Marriage was 'By Licence'  - John Elliott. (interesting!)   In presence of Thomas LEMMON and Mary LEMMON.   The later two spelled their names with double m's.

2. What are the full names of any of the known male children of this John LEMON b.c. 1846, son of a David LEMON?  Any Walter names?

I too need help with locating the early TODD/LEMON farm in Killacronaghan or Killycronaghan, in between Killeevan and Smithborough, County Monaghan, No Ire. My interest lies in the early TODD lineage, proof, and sources to sort out the various County Down TODD lines, and to find the missing very early cemetery [not in Prof. Richard S. Jessup Clarke's  excellent 21 volume Gravestone Inscriptions series].  Reverend Samuel A. AGNEW of Bethany, Lee Co., Mississippi wrote of this TODD/LEMON farm in his letters and papers preserved in the Kentucky Historical Society, Frankfort, Kentucky, USA.  One of Rev. Agnew's letters, dated 7 Feb 1898 was addressed to E.T. Helm [Emily TODD Helm] of Elizabethtown, KY. 

In this important letter he carefully writes: "Andrew TODD was married twice: first to Sidney WEST, then to Mary SIMPSON.  He had children by both wives.  His eldest son by his first wife, John TODD was killed at the battle of Waterloo in 1815.  His daughter Mary married a LEMON and remained in Ireland when her father with the remaining children came to America.  She lived on the place that was occupied by her grandfather and father and it is still occupied by her son, William LEMON, who if alive is now a very old man.  It is in Killachronaghan Townland, not far from Smithsboro in Co. Monaghan.  By his last wife Andrew had Samuel Rutherford born in 1807, Letitia Simpson born 1809 and Margaret Isabelle [or Isabella] born in 1811.  My mother, Letitia Simpson Todd married Dr. Enoch AGNEW in 1832 and died Feb 28 1879 in Union Co. Miss and is buried in Bethany burial ground in Lee Co., Miss."  [quickly transcribed in part, today from copy of original obtained, 2008, from Emily Todd Helm file at Ky His Soc.]

This TODD heritage is very important to either align or distinguish away from the early TODD family of Toddstown1 (a townland's nickname) and Toddstown2 (a farm near Ballynasveagh & Glaskerbeg East)- both in County Down, No Ire.  ...snip

[hallmark]

Any use?? Am working on Hall but have these....

Smithborough;    18th April 1877....Thomas HALL of Lisgall married Mary Ann LEMON of Killacronaghan (Father William LEMON, farmer).  Witnesses were Alexander HALL and Isabella LEMON.


Another Williamson/Lemon connection...Birth; 16th Mar 1880 Robert Thomas son, Robert Williamson + Sarah Jane Lemon, Carn  at Tyholland.

4th May 1881 Joseph Elliott son, Thomas Elliott, Clones,  married  Isabella Lemon dau, William Lemon, Killycronaghan at Scotstown.

[Toddstown]

Re: TODD/LEMON farm in Killacronaghan or Killycronaghan, in between Killeevan and Smithborough, County Monaghan, No Ire

Yes, your HALL and ELLIOTT also seem to fit here nicely--It appears as though Walter John LEMON, born 1849 may be the best? candidate for Colin and Elizabeth in Western Australia's line...I am not sure...but see what you think of Rev. Samuel Agnew's papers, extracted below....


RECORDS OF THE DESCENDANTS OF ANDREW TODD COPIED BY REV. SAMUEL A. AGNEW of BETHANY, LEE COUNTY, MISSISSIPPI, USA (and transcribed roughly in part here today by Toddstown, to reply to this message thread at Rootschat, Lemon board, 28 Aug 2009 )

A.  Andrew TODD was born in County Down Ireland,  about 1756
This Andrew TODD died in Laurens District South Carolina USA, 13 July 1843  age about 87 yrs. 
He married first, Sidney WEST and had issue as follows (six TODD kids):
I.   John TODD killed in Battle of Waterloo 1815 had no issue

II.   Mary TODD m David LEMON in 1815 or 1816

a.   Matilda LEMON m.  _____ DUNWOODY and had 10 DUNWOODY kids [intermarried with NICKLES, McCOY, McCRUM]

b.   William LEMON m.  _____ and had issue- 10 LEMON kids
i.   David LEMON
ii.   Wm LEMON
iii.   Thomas LEMON
iv.   John LEMON
v.   Mary Ann LEMON m Thomas HULL/HALL of Lisgane, Smithsborough
vi.   Sarah Jane LEMON m  Robert WILLIAMSON of Coramagen Newbliss
vii.   Isabella LEMON m Joseph ELLOTTE
viii.   Martha LEMON
ix.   Elizabeth LEMON
x.   Margaret LEMON

c.   David LEMON d 9 July 1867 m Martha Jane HETHERINGTON or HETHENUGTON 3 May 1848 in Stonebridge Church Co Monaghan Ireland by Rev Ringland Fisher or Fishar of Raffery or Rattery Killinchy Co Down Ireland and had issue

i.   Walter John LEMON born 1849
ii.   Mary Anne LEMON 1851
iii.   Wm David LEMON 1854 m Minnie WOOST b Mecklenburg Germany 1860
iv.   Letitia Jane LEMON 1856
v.   Harry/Harvey Ringland Kilpatrick LEMON 1858
vi.   Samuel Herbert LEMON 1862
vii.   Thomas LEMON 1867

d.   Isabella LEMON b 1820 d 13 Feb 1884 m. Thomas LEGHORN and had __  issue [intermarried with LAWSON of Lurganboy Drum…]

III.   Richard TODD
IV.   Aaron TODD
V.   Jane West TODD
VI.   Eliza TODD

(Andrew TODD married 2nd, Mary SIMPSON of County Monaghan who died in Laurens, South Carolina USA, 23 Aug 1850 aged about 66 yrs and had issue as follows:  (3 TODD kids with Mary Simpson)

VII.   Samuel Rutherford TODD born 7 Oct 1807  [DNA alignment confirmed, 2009, from this line]
VIII.   Leticia Simpson TODD born 19 Sept 1809  [** line of Rev Samuel AGNEW who preserved this data]
IX.   Margaret Isabella TODD 11 Nov 1812

[Toddstown]

It looks like Walter John LEMON is not the right guy-- Rev Agnew wrote that this man married Isabella CARVER, apparently of Minnesota USA and had 5 kids...so, eliminate this one ...and the possible death date of 1883 and birth in 1849 both won't fit either then...

[Toddstown]

Yesterday I also made some notes on a different David LEMON, so I guess this alternative David LEMON (died 1838) has to be considered also…given the scenario evolving...

Ros Davies writes that Ballymorran was the “home of poet David Lemon 21 Apr 1838” [source: http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~rosdavies/PLACENAMES/Ballyhm.htm ]
David LEMON .  Holywood of Ballymaghan; leased a house & small garden in 1863 from Thomas McClure GV . 
David LEMON .  Killinchy of Ballymorran, poet, died 21 Apr 1838 DR .
David LEMON . Killyleagh will probated 1839; executor was J. D. Wilson of Ballygoskin IIW # 38447
John LEMON . Killinchy of Ballymorran; died 16 Jun 1778 aged 21; son of James Lemon; buried Presbyterian graveyard MIs
[source: http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~rosdavies/SURNAMES/L/LeaLem.htm#lem ]

Was there Presbyterian  migration from _______ Co Down to Co Monaghan and back to Ballymorran, Killinchy, Co Down, ?  There is a land record for a David LEMON, of Ballymorran.   Separately a Robert TODD (b. c. 1806)  family in Ballymorran also had a land record  with a RUSSELL family, as both recorded on microfilm at PRONI, Belfast, County Down, No IRE.  The RUSSELLs of Balloo Killinchy may be tied with the adjacent Ballymorran RUSSELLs, and the SCOTTs of Killinchy… I don’t recall the details offhand…After being kindly driven around Balloo, Ballymorran and Killinchy, County Down, this past spring, the neighborhood is certainly very close together.

[dgclough]

1. When did John LEMON b. c1846, the husband of Harriett Ann WILLIAMSON, die?  Could it be 1883? Is it known?


2. What are the full names of any of the known male children of this John LEMON b.c. 1846, son of a David LEMON?  Any Walter names?

I know that John Lemon lived close to the age of 100 and that he definitely died in County Monaghan - this information was from his daughter Tillie, who died this year at the age of 99. I am not sure of the date when he was born, as in 1901 it said he was 55 but in 1911 it said he was 72!

On the 1911 census John and Harriet are listed as having 10 children, 8 alive. My ancestor, John Gray (son of Mary Elizabeth Lemon and Thomas Gray), who was born in 1895, was living with his grandparents, John and Harriet, in 1911, so I'm wondering whether Mary was one of the Lemons who had died?

I only seem to have 9 children down (maybe one died in childbirth or something):

Mary Elizabeth, born c. 1867 (according to 1901 and 1911 censuses)
Margaret, born 1869, married Robert Henry Gordon
Letitia Ann, born 1872, married John Clarke
David John, born 1874
Thomas James, born 1876, married Isabella Neely
Clemena, born 1879, married Mark Reynolds
Henry, born 1880, married Susan
Susan, born 1883, married Edward Andrews
Artie, born c. 1886, emigrated to America

John's father was definitely called David as I have a copy of his marriage certificate. I think his mother was Martha Jane Hetherington or Mary Patten. I guess that David Lemon and Mary Todd were a generation earlier, but you don't have a John listed as son of David and Martha?

[hallmark]

Well it doesn't look like there are any Grey/West records to be had, am one record short of linking quite a few family lines incl Hall/Lemon/Grey etc...

Will be hanging my hat up on this until next year now as I won't be driving around Monaghan in winter time. I've 2 more parishes to get records from next week...then hibernate!

I've about 18,000 records to sort out over the winter onto my database.

[dgclough]

Yesterday I also made some notes on a different David LEMON, so I guess this alternative David LEMON (died 1838) has to be considered also…given the scenario evolving...

Ros Davies writes that Ballymorran was the “home of poet David Lemon 21 Apr 1838” [source: http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~rosdavies/PLACENAMES/Ballyhm.htm ]
David LEMON .  Holywood of Ballymaghan; leased a house & small garden in 1863 from Thomas McClure GV . 
David LEMON .  Killinchy of Ballymorran, poet, died 21 Apr 1838 DR .
David LEMON . Killyleagh will probated 1839; executor was J. D. Wilson of Ballygoskin IIW # 38447
John LEMON . Killinchy of Ballymorran; died 16 Jun 1778 aged 21; son of James Lemon; buried Presbyterian graveyard MIs
[source: http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~rosdavies/SURNAMES/L/LeaLem.htm#lem ]

Was there Presbyterian  migration from _______ Co Down to Co Monaghan and back to Ballymorran, Killinchy, Co Down, ?  There is a land record for a David LEMON, of Ballymorran.   Separately a Robert TODD (b. c. 1806)  family in Ballymorran also had a land record  with a RUSSELL family, as both recorded on microfilm at PRONI, Belfast, County Down, No IRE.  The RUSSELLs of Balloo Killinchy may be tied with the adjacent Ballymorran RUSSELLs, and the SCOTTs of Killinchy… I don’t recall the details offhand…After being kindly driven around Balloo, Ballymorran and Killinchy, County Down, this past spring, the neighborhood is certainly very close together.

Hmm this may be possible.

I found this website:

http://chicagoscots.net/Famous_Scots_N-Z.html

which says that Mary Patten married David Lemon. Unfortunately it gives no more information on David Lemon, as the section including L seems to be missing, but it does say how the Pattens emigrated from Scotland to Monaghan and from Monaghan to America. Mary Patten was born in Monaghan. As it says "FAMOUS SCOTS" maybe the connection to fame is that she married a poet, namely David Lemon, but I'm not sure. Who is the John Lemon, son of James, that you mentioned, and who is Reverend Agnew?