KNOWLES, William 1891, Tom 1893 & Martha Eliza 1895-1961

[walkersearch]

Thanks for picking this up but I'm sure he returned on the Teutonic 28 Dec 1896 with William 5, Tom 3 and Martha 1.  It was a flook that I found the ship's passenger list on Ancestry.ca - I'm not skilled at research - but the names, ages and the date fit together.  Since then I found the place of birth for Tom and Martha was Colfax, Iowa (from the UK 1911 census) and their mother's death is registered there in October 1896. So it fits with my grandmother's story that her mother died in America when she was a baby and her father bringing the children back.  William senior married Mary Elizabeth Smith in 1900.
Thanks for your message.
Carolyn

[Jool]

Hi Carolyn, sorry, maybe I didn't make myself clear.  I was trying to say that after he returned to England with his children in 1896, he remarried Mary Elizabeth Smith and went back to America with her in 1913.  The wife's name is listed as Elizabeth not Mary Elizabeth, maybe that we what she was known as.

Who were the children living with in Sneyd Green Hanley in 1913?

Jool 

[walkersearch]

Hi Jool,
sorry I'm being obtuse. 
It's possible he did.  Though I'd be surprised if she's the woman he married in 1900.  I have a postcard to Willie, Postmark Jly 27 09 giving him "Dad's address: 79 Mumforth Street, Flint[?]", signed Ma which suggests they're not together. Then Tom writes to Pat, Postmark Jan 11 13, saying, "I wonder where Dad is but I reckon he's alright or we would hear from him."   
He is not mentioned again.  Maybe he did return to America in 1913. 
I thought you might like to see photos Will, Tom & Pat taken around 1910.  This message form has an 'attach a photograph' button but it doesn't work for me.

Carolyn

[walkersearch]

Jool,
I've just seen the age of Elizabeth on the Cedric passenger log and it does look like the same woman. So they both went to America in middle age - brave at the time.

C

[Jool]

Hiya Carolyn, I know your main interest is coming forward to find the families of Will & Tom, but I found this which could possibly be William senior in the USA.  Sometimes going backwards and sideways helps you find clues.

Their ages are out, but I have seen these discrepancies many times.  But the year of immigration and his trade fit.

1920 census, Alliance Ward 3, Stark, Ohio
William Knowles, head, age 50 (b. abt. 1870 England).
Parents' birth place England
Year of immigration 1913
Occupation: Brick Mason
Home rented

Elizabeth Knowles, wife, age 51 (b. abt. 1869 England)
Parents' birth place England
Year of immigration 1913

Jool

[walkersearch]

Hi Jools,
this is interesting. If they had gone to Boston as stated on the Cedric passenger list, and set off West towards his former home Iowa, they could have settled on the way.

Thanks
Carolyn

[vivck]

Hello!
I have just discovered this site whilst looking for something else!
I assume you are related to Alpheus Walker? from Wolstanton.
My Grandfather was William Allen whose father William went to the USA.
I coincidently moved to Leek 2 years ago where they came from and have been given or researched much of the family history back to 1660.
I know little of what happened after he married Smith in 1900 although my Grandfather went to live with another family and became mayor of Newcastle under Lyme and a succesful business man.
Great Grandfather William seems to have been the black sheep and was cut out of his father's will- his father also being William was a builder in Leek and left at least 16 houses between his  8 grandchildren so your grandmother must have inherited two!
Many of this side of the Knowles clan still live in the Potteries area.

[walkersearch]

I am so glad you did come across this!
Alpheus Walker and Martha (aka Pat) Knowles were my grandparents. My grandmother said her father failed to care for her, was a gambler and drinker and that he remarried. After that she never mentioned him but spoke of her brothers with much affection.  She said Will and his wife were very good to her and was very proud of his achievement of becoming mayor but I didn't remember where. 
In the 1911 census: Martha & Tom are living with Mary Jane Hancock at 91 North Rd Burslem.    In 1920, at age: 57 William & Elizabeth are residents of Stark, Ohio.

It's wonderful to hear about your family, my mother lost touch with her relatives in the Potteries which was a great shame.  Did Tom Knowles marry and have children?
I had some great help from members of this message board piecing together the story of William Knowles, Mary Eliza Gibson and Mary Elizabeth Smith. My grandmother's collection of postcards from Will and Tom spanning 1907 to 1918 gives lots of information about where they were all living and some clues to the boys' whereabouts during the WW1. 
I thought William senior's father was Joseph Knowles and would be grateful for the correct information.  I've been gathering information on Ancestry.ca -The Harper Family.
Carolyn

[vivck]

Hi,

you were reading early!
I will find my file and give you more info later.
Grandfather's parents were William and Mary Gibson as you thought
and William's parents also William  (builder) who married Hannah Allen which is where the name Allen comes in although it was used as Alan by the time of my father.
His parents were Joshua c1795 and Martha Pickford, before that Joseph c1762  and Sarah Taylor.

Not sure where you live but we originated from Quarnford which is on the moors between Leek and Buxton.
I only recently got photos of my grandparents but that's a long story.......

I know some of the Gibson and Walker Stoke on Trent families if you need that too.
Wondered why I couldnt trace bad boy William but I use ancestry in the library where it is free so I went backwards rather than pay for the 1911 census until I was sure who was who

Vivienne