Author Topic: The Sheafe family of Wye  (Read 16600 times)

Offline MattD30

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Re: The Sheafe family of Wye
« Reply #36 on: Thursday 06 September 18 19:51 BST (UK) »
Hello all,
I have been following this thread on and off for a long time and I have a suggestion to throw into the mix with regard to the Sheafe connection.

I have a marriage for Thomas Sheafe of Cranbrook and Sarah Sheppard. The marriage took place in West Peckham 17 Sep 1610. This marriage puts two people with the right names into the vicinity of Hadlow for the birth of an Elizabeth Sheafe in 1611, bap 21 July. This could well be the Elizabeth Sheafe that married Valentine Austen in 1634. The Wye death dates for Thomas the prisoner and Sarah the widow also fit this scenario.

Sarah Sheppard was the daughter of Alexander Sheppard and his first wife Elizabeth Covert as per County Genealogies for Sussex. Alexander's second wife was Ursula Knatchbull, a family that had long had links with the Sheafes in the Cranbrook area, bringing the story full circle.

I would certainly love some verification of my theory in the form of a handy will reference or some such gem, but it might be worth at least investigating this idea further.

Elizabeth

Hi Elizabeth

I haven't looked either the Sheafe or Austen lines in any depth lately as I have been sorting out a few other lines of research.

I hadn't come across the 1611 christening of Elizabeth in Hadlow myself so it is definitely worth investigating.

I'll check my notes and get back to you as soon as I can. In the meantime what else can you tell me about this Thomas and Sarah? Did they have any other children?

Matt

Offline thistlecatau

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Re: The Sheafe family of Wye
« Reply #37 on: Friday 07 September 18 08:22 BST (UK) »
At this stage I can only find the one Hadlow baptism for a Sheaf/Sheafe/Sheaffe but I don't have access to images of the original registers. Someone a lot closer to Kent (I'm in Tasmania!) might have to investigate that bit, unless they eventually end up on line somewhere. I have several site subscriptions but Hadlow is not included in any of those.....yet! We antipodeans can always live in hope.  ;D 

Offline Terry Luckhurst

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Re: The Sheafe family of Wye
« Reply #38 on: Friday 07 September 18 11:17 BST (UK) »
Hi All
I am a member of the Kent Family History Society (KFHS). While working a case on the Kent Bartons, namely Thomas (father) John (son) of Charing Kent, I could not back project from John's bap. With the absence of Hadlow PRs I searched the principal (highest populated and population density communities) to try and discover the early life profile of Thomas. The one Parish that I could not access online or in the KFHS PR transcriptions prior to 1836 was Hadlow. I enquired (May 18) with Kent History & Library Centre who advised that a Hadlow PR digitisation (transcription) was in progress and would be available on public domain mid 2019. I exhausted all the available East Peckham and Hadlow wills that were available. These I doubt would not be sufficient to cover the full profiles of your subject ancestors. I have kept my Barton case open pending Hadlow PRs and possible pre dated PR records till mid 2019 

Another of our lineages is the Sheaffes, but the Thomas Sheaffe on my line is the generation before yours he's the son (bap 1587) Richard Sheaffe  -  where our line takes his brother Edmund. From KFHS PR there are 3 potential Thos Sheaffes at Cranbrook for the marriage to Sarah 1. bap 1587 s/o Richard, 2. bap 1588 no father recorded, 3. bap 1592 s/o Alex. 

Looking back on my Austen lineage I have the same life profile for Elizabeth as you up to the point that Valentine died in 1651. Thereafter I have no trace, but did not search too hard as she and this Valentine's second marriage was not on my direct lineage.

I can also concur re the Sheaffe and Knatchbull relationship as our Richard Sheaffe's Jun 1557 will states two daughters Joan and Anne marrying into the Knatchbull family.

Terry

Offline MattD30

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Re: The Sheafe family of Wye
« Reply #39 on: Saturday 08 September 18 00:51 BST (UK) »
Hi again

I haven't had time to look at my Sheaffe notes today but have been looking through my Austen notes and working on a link to another branch of my family. I will go through my Sheaffe notes tomorrow and try and post an update tomorrow or on Sunday.

I think the confusion occurs sometimes when several people had the same name, and when they were alive or died at the same time. Valentine is a name which pops up quite frequently and sometimes I have to check my tree to see which Valentine Austen I'm looking at!

Matt


Offline thistlecatau

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Re: The Sheafe family of Wye
« Reply #40 on: Saturday 08 September 18 01:59 BST (UK) »
@Terry
My actual line is the Thomas Sheaf (b 1592) son of Alexander (b 1566) son of Thomas Sheaffe and Mary Harmon. The story is that my Thomas moved from Cranbrook to Cleeve Prior, but I have never seen any hard evidence for that and would dearly love to prove this one way or the other. However, because the Sheaf name is relatively uncommon I keep a bit of a track of all the ones I come across in case I can tie them in! I have the Thomas Sheaffe who married Sarah as the 1588 one, and the 1587 one marrying Mary Gibbon of West Cliffe. But who knows!!

Thanks for your info on the Hadlow registers. That will be something to look forward to.
Cheers,
Elizabeth

Offline Terry Luckhurst

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Re: The Sheafe family of Wye
« Reply #41 on: Saturday 08 September 18 13:44 BST (UK) »
Hi Elizabeth
Well if you relate back to Alexander Sheaffe bp 15 Dec 1566 Cranbrook m. Phebe Hyder Sep 1591 Cranbrook, as you say his parents Thomas (bp 1532) and Mary (nee Harmon) are well documented and 15 children too. Then continue back projecting via Richard Sheaffe (bap 1505, Cranbrook) then Thomas (bap 1470, Norwich Norfolk clothier, draper) till the line ends as far as I can see with his father Thomas Shefe (Sheff) b abt 1440 Norwich who was a "marble" - Pembroke Marble - his work is spread around the church corbels in Norwich probably even where he was interred at St George Tombland Norwich - right next to the cathedral. His craftsman mark is on his ledger stone.
Terry

Offline Terry Luckhurst

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Re: The Sheafe family of Wye
« Reply #42 on: Saturday 08 September 18 13:46 BST (UK) »
Elizabeth
Thomas Shefe (b abt 1440) was a "marbler" - I just note when I repeated it here it tends to want to lose the last "r".   

Offline Terry Luckhurst

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Re: The Sheafe family of Wye
« Reply #43 on: Saturday 08 September 18 14:18 BST (UK) »
Elizabeth
I think my keyboard is having a Great Vowel Shift or I am.
The craft of Thomas Shefe was "marbeler" - difficult to find it on searches almost akin to a stone mason....but they had their guilds, also their craftsman marks were local, his being Norwich. Also the marble came from Dorset Purbeck and not Wales.
Terry 

Offline MattD30

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Re: The Sheafe family of Wye
« Reply #44 on: Sunday 09 September 18 01:08 BST (UK) »
Hi Matt
Sorry to bother you again, but just before I move onto Robert Austen (b ca1479) I have noted a possible conflict of burial sites for Matthew Austen. In his will he asked to be buried at Chilham. But in his widow's will 2 yrs later she asked to buried near him at Wye, where she was later interred. The Wye Parish burial registers have a record of Thomasine but NOT Matthew. Not a major problem for my purposes but I would like to be accurate. Do you have a source citation for Matthew's burial place? Without any other record one can argue for both Wye and Chilham, ie did his Exec carry out his wish or was Thomasine correct? No MIs at either of the two sites.

I noted that Matthew and Thomasine had amassed quite a family. I have recorded eight probably nine with good source citation, re:Tyler Index. But their early records were inconsistent with some baptisms not providing the given name of the father - with many Austens in and around adjacent parishes it makes it difficult to pigeon hole them. I also note that Tyler Index has a hiatus 1640-1660 (Civil War and Interregnum period) which doesn't help. Do you have a full verified list of their children?

I think I will hit this Austen line buffers with Robert (Richard's father) as records are becoming increasingly difficult to come by prior to 1538, unless MIs have survived and wills were written. Do you have a link to any will Robert may have produced?

Best regards
Terry

PS I am not my own cousin yet!

Hi Terry

I have been looking at my notes on the Austens and also the Sheaffe family and have come up with a few ideas.

I have a copy of Matthew Austen's 1640 Will and agree with you that it does say that he wished to be 'buried in the churchyard of Chilham'. However it may be that this changed and that he later wished to be buried in Wye. Unfortunately we don't have the registered copy to compare this against in order to see if any changes were made.

I do have a record of Matthew's burial in Wye though which definitely confirms he was buried there. I will let you know the details tomorrow.

I also have a copy of Matthew's Inventory which was filled with the Will. This also describes him as being "of Wye" but the interesting thing here is that it was appraised by E_______ Fagg [or Fogg] and Anthony Pim - neither of whom seem to be named in the Will. There could be a link with Chilham here as Anthony Pim of Chilham is my ancestor. There's no evidence here that these two Anthony's are the same person or that the Will of Matthew Austen here is wrong and my only conclusion so far is that Matthew had lands or connections in both parishes. Since the Austens were quite spread out and had land in both parishes I think it quite likely that when he wrote the Will Matthew wanted to be buried in the parish of his birth (Chilham) but perhaps when he died this couldn't be done (maybe he died suddenly and they couldn't get him to Chilham) or perhaps he changed his mind (details we'd only know if we could see the registered copy of the Will).

I know that there are a number of cases in Chancery involving Matthew Austen and I think there is one involving his Will. So another possibility may be that some legal dispute arose after his death. I do have notes on some of these but they are at the bottom of a box so need digging out. I will get back to you on that as soon as I can.

I will post an update on the Sheaffes tomorrow.

Matt