ancient European DNA

[supermoussi]

List what arrowhead finds can be linked to each haplogroup then please.

[Redroger]

Though an amateur archeologist I do not have that expertise. But it is certainly feasible to do this where, as at Stonehenge both arrowheads are available and DNA has been recovered. Hopefully research of this type will be forthcoming in the not too distant future. However the numbers involved are likely to remain small and it is believed that even into the neolithic period there were less than 1 million people in the whole of Europe, so inevitably traces of them are extremely limited.

[Malcolm33]

   I think perhaps everyone needs to read "The Seven Daughters of Eve" by Dr. Brian Sykes and his later book "Blood of the Isles".

   These books give a comprehensive look at our European ancestors and even of what life was like for the Seven Women (now nine) who are the maternal ancestors of every European.   Dr Sykes has given each of them a name and where they lived and when.
   Ursula was born 45,000 years ago near Mount Parnassus in Greece.
   Xenia lived 25,000 years ago between the Black Sea and the Caspian
   Helena lived 20,000 years ago just north of the Pyrennean Mountain area
   Velda's life was around 17,000 years ago in Cantabria northern Spain,
   Tara also lived about the same time as Velda, but in Tuscany near the mouth of the River Arno
   Katrine was close to Venice some 15,000 years ago
   Jasmine lived by the Euphrates at the end of the Ice Age.

   I am descended from Tara as is Dr Sykes, Prince Philip, Tsar Nicholas II, King George I, King Charles I, King George V, Kaiser Wilhelm of Prussia, and Jesse James.    (Haplogroup T2b)

   On my paternal side my y-dna is R1a which is commonly called the Viking group and is found in the Fjords of Norway, and then from East Germany, right across Russia and into northern India.  But I also know that my father's mother's father was R1b1a2 since a distant cousin has tested in that haplogroup.   That means that the 18th Dynasty Pharaohs including King Ymn Twt Ankh are my distant cousins and that we have a common ancestor who lived near the Black Sea about 9,500 years ago.

      You can find maps of each haplogroup in Europe on the net, with the percentages of each group.

        King Tut's group is as mentiontioned R1b1a2 and this is the Celtic-British group which is as high as 90% in some parts of England.    If you test with IGenea - a Swiss Genetic company -  and you do match the basic 12 markers with the King, then they refund the cost of the test to you.

       You can use dna testing to examine a possible match with people of say the last 5 generations but then many more markers should be tested - at least 37, and better still a 100, but this can be costly. 

  Malcolm

[supermoussi]

A more up to date book is Britain Begins by Barry Cunliffe, although it has more of an historic slant than DNA.  see:- http://www.waterstones.com/waterstonesweb/products/barry+cunliffe/britain+begins/8926351/

Some of the theories in Sykes first book are now out of date/discredited.

[Redroger]

That is always the problem, this type of research is always a work in progress.

[Malcolm33]

Be careful.    Syke's research and discoveries disprove many of the old traditional historic ideas and that is why he is being attacked.    If DNA is to be doubted then how can it ever be relied upon in a court of law?    The same thing is happening with religion.   I had to learn Ancient Egyptian to uncover many of the lies we have been taught, just to make sure for myself.

[Erato]

"If DNA is to be doubted then how can it ever be relied upon in a court of law?"

Because the questions posed in a court of law are entirely different from those posed by researchers of human genetic history.

[Malcolm33]

      I should add that the one valid reason why some of Syke's work is being challenged is because he was working on a smaller number of markers, 21 to be precise.    Today many people have had their dna tested and to at least 37 markers or more.   This has changed the overall picture to some degree, but the pendulum is swinging back and forth as laboratary research advances.   

       At the same time we are learning much more about our history.   In Cymraeg the word for England is Lloegr meaning the Lost Lands.   Yet we now know that great areas of England remained predominantly Celtic.   This is what is upsetting some Celts who want to believe that the Anglo-Saxons really did commit some kind of genocide.     Yet we do know that Elmet was more or less left alone once they accepted Saxon overlords, and language also shows that there was a merging of the three main blood groups.     History also tells us that the Vikings were a huge influence in Ireland and that Dublin was built by them and was their Slave Trading Centre.

[mike175]

Maybe not as ancient as we thought? Apparently all Europeans are related within the last 1,000 years 

http://gcbias.org/european-genealogy-faq

"... anyone alive 1,000 years ago who left any descendants will be an ancestor of every European ..."

hmmm . . .