Buried deep!

[GuyMassey]

My Irish great grandfather James Sullivan, was described as a well respected leading hand at Woolwich Arsenal when he died in an accident at work after many years of service. I have finally tracked down his burial details and am shocked to discover that he was interred in unconsecrated ground, 3rd Class, nine feet down! The Mayor of Woolwich  (who was also the local undertaker) was one of the mourners and his son later married into our family!
Why the undignified burial? Am I to assume that there will be no grave marker as a consequence?

[avm228]

This old thread from another site may help:

http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/read/GENBRIT/2001-12/1009567913

[cemetery friends]

With his Irish name there is a fair chance that he was RC. Only persons baptised in the C of E faith would have been buried in consecrated ground [and receive the tradition burial service]. Catholics were buried in unconsecrated ground and in cases where municipal cemeteries later developed separate areas were developed for Catholics. Even then there were rules in place to differentiate such as Southampton Old Cemetery, one of the earliest municipal cemeteries, had no separate chapel so Catholic funeral services were held off site and they were also not allowed their own boundary fence within the cemetery [although the Hebrew community were allowed those features]. Londonderry has a wall between Catholic and Protestant grave plots, the foundation of the wall goes 14 feet underground. During the Victorian era town councillors were not allowed to wear regalia such as the mayor's chain or robes of office if attending a non conformist or Catholic funeral. If they went against the rule there was a heavy fine and a ban from public office.

The reason for the depth was I assume that it was envisaged a wife and child would later be added [or even a fellow soldier/s of the same faith]. The fact that the cemetery had to provide grave space for public common graves for people of no means plus [then] minority faiths probably encouraged economy in lay out and depth maximising on available space.

[GuyMassey]

Thank you both for the link, and the very full explanation.
James was indeed a Roman Catholic, and his family were poor. I would be interested to find out if there is any form of grave marker.
One day I hope to visit and pay my respects.
I have attached a .pdf transcript that I have made from the newspaper reports after his accident. It makes extraordinary reading and gives an insight into the working conditions at the arsenal.
By uploading it I hope it will help one victim of the time to be remembered, and serve as a reminder to others of just how lucky we are to be living now.

[GuyMassey]

My Irish great grandfather James Sullivan, was described as a well respected leading hand at Woolwich Arsenal when he died in an accident at work after many years of service. I have finally tracked down his burial details and am shocked to discover that he was interred in unconsecrated ground, 3rd Class, nine feet down! The Mayor of Woolwich  (who was also the local undertaker) was one of the mourners and his son later married into our family!
Why the undignified burial? Am I to assume that there will be no grave marker as a consequence?

I correct a slight error on the above, it was John Messent who was a councillor at the time of the accident who married into our family. John Messent was Mayor of Woolwich in 1902 during the Coronation of Edward VII & Alexandria and had a commemorative coin struck with his name on it.

[diggerman2]

Yeah the depth of the grave was more to do with getting as many bodies as possible into the grave.
There are many graves in the cemetery where i work that have numerous bodies in , so they were obviously dug very deep originally - whereas nowaday the norm is  6foot (for two) , or 7ft 6 in (for 3).
I have heard of graves being dug to a depth of 20 feet!!!
Can't have been easy - especially before the days of mechanical diggers.

[Dimps]

There is a catholic section at Woolwich New Cemetery, in Plumstead.  No problem from 1830 onwards here.  He would have been buried in an unconsecrated area as it was a pauper's burial.

Deborah