McMurrays of Tullynakill

[lindynz]

I'm interested in finding information about the McMurray family that lived in the Tullynakill area in the 17/1800's. My ggg grandmother was Mary McMurray, who was christened in 1802 (in Ballinderry?), and died in Tullynakill in 1870. She married David Adams in Killinchy in 1821.

Most family trees I have seen say Mary's parents were John McMurray and Margaret Allen who married in 1799. I believe Robert McMurray, of Roxborough House, Limerick, would have been Mary's brother, but I would appreciate if this could be confirmed. John's parents were Michael McMurray and Jane Hamilton Martin, Michael's parents were John McMurray and Janet Smyth. Apparently they were from Cork, but they may have originally been from Stirling, Scotland. Does anyone know anything about this family, and in particular, where they were from originally? I would love to be able to trace this family back further.

[aghadowey]

Previous topic-
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,479304.0.html

[lindynz]

Sorry, aghadowey, I revived this topic because no fresh information has come to light in recent times. The Ros Davies site is quite useful, but I'm not certain which McMurrays on there belong to "my" McMurrays. I'm hoping that someone might know about this particular family, and be able to give me some details of how they are connected. None of the research I have seen has been able to trace back any further than John McMurray and Janet Smyth, who were probably born in the early 1700s - so I'm hoping I can eventually establish where they were originally from(Scotland? Cork?), and perhaps even trace them back further.

[BallyaltikilliganG]

My instinct these references are not about your family, however they exist. My references are to two McMurray family trees, and they may be an expansion of one or other. Both are in the Blackwood Family History manuscript trees Collection in the LinenHall library, Belfast. My advice is visit yourself if possible, giving them time to have the volumes available,  however as is more likely you may live abroad I suggest you ask them for photocopying estimates only if they think your knowledge relevant and be prepared to pay the extra for post and packing if you are tempted.  “The Library welcomes all research enquiries, whether made in person, by phone, fax, letter or e-mail. Enquiries from members will be answered free of charge. Visitors from afar, and in particular those engaged in serious research projects, are recommended to make prior contact with the Library to ensure that they receive the best possible service. More complex enquiries should be made by letter, fax, or e-mail. Enquiries of this kind from within the British Isles will normally be answered free of charge, apart from any copying and postage charges. A minimum charge of £2 will normally be made in respect of overseas enquiries. A4 photocopies b&w are 20p.  The Library may be able to assist those with more extensive research requirements on terms subject to negotiation with the Librarian. Contact the Library for further information on info@linenhall.com or Telephone 028 9032 1707. Their address is The Linen Hall Library,17 Donegall Square North, Belfast BT15GB, Northern Ireland, see their website for contact details or use Email:info@linenhall.com.
The volume references for McMURRAY 6 with Notes,  Vol 31

➢   Hoping this is includes new information for you
➢   good luck, Jim
ps However if the material is really relevant when you get it, I suggest a further donation to this unique library that is always needing extra funds.

[rmcmurray]

You appear to be looking for information about my ancestors. John McMurray and Margaret Allen also had a son named Edward McMurray, who would be your ggg grandmother's brother. Edward emigrated from Ireland to America in the mid-1800s. I have some information at http://www.mcmurray.info/genealogy/, and I would love to discuss and compare our respective information.

[whiteout7]

"Archival sources
National Library of Ireland: Copy of confirmation of arms to descendants of John McMurray & wife Margaret (Allen), daughter of Robert Allen & to their son Robert McMurray of Roxborough House, Limerick & Patrickswell, 1 Mar 1862. GO MS 108:400-401"

http://landedestates.nuigalway.ie/LandedEstates/jsp/estate-show.jsp?id=2673

Appears to confirm "Robert Mcmurray" as the son of "John McMurray" and "Margaret Allen"

"McMURRAY (confirmed to ROBERT McMURRAY, Esq., of Roxborough House, Limerick,
and Patrickswell, co. Limerick) Ar. a lion ramp. az. on a chief of the
second three mullets pierced of the field. Crest - A demi lion ramp. guard.
gu. holding a Lochaber axe, and charged on the shoulder with a rose ar.
Motto- Virtute fideque."

For any person to have a right to a coat of arms they must either have had it granted to them or be descended in the legitimate male line from a person to whom arms were granted or confirmed in the past.

"Virtute Fideque" seems to be the motto of the Murrays of Elibank, Scotland too?

Robert McMurray Esq of Roxborough house (born 1806) is of Scottish ancestry and decend from John De Moreff of Blackbarony who swore fealty to Edward the 1st in 1296. ((Called the only son here?)) http://www.mocavo.co.uk/The-County-Families-of-the-United-Kingdom-1st-Ed/280142/461

"Only son of John McMurray of Marlmount, county Down Esq with Margaret d of Robert Allen Esq of Ballygrote, County Down
http://www.mocavo.com/The-County-Families-of-the-United-Kingdom-Ed-6/413441/672

1st marriage
March 17 1838
On the 10th inst., at St. Bride's Church, Liverpool, by the Rev. James Haldane Stewart, A.M., ROBERT McMURRAY, ESQ., Demerara and Liverpool, to SARAH ANNE, fourth daughter of THOMAS KNOX HANNYNGTON, ESQ., Castle, Dungannon, and granddaughter of the late ARCHDEACON CAULFIELD

((Demerara is British Guiana, perhaps he was making money here?))

Marriage: 10 Mar 1838 St Bride, Toxteth, Lancashire, England
Robert McMurray - full age, Merchant, Bachelor, Rodney Street
Sarah Anne Hannyngton - full age, Spinster, Dungannon, Ireland
    Groom's Father: John McMurray, Gentleman
    Bride's Father: Thomas Knox Hannyngton, Gentleman
    Witness: Jno. Ripley; Euphemia Gordon Hannyngton
    Married by Licence by: J. H. Stewart
    Register: Marriages 1837 - 1842, Page 33, Entry 66
    Source: LDS Film 1546289

2nd Marriage
1844
Robert McMurray and Elizabeth Ann Hayton dau. of John.W.Hayton, Greenfeild Abbey of County Flintshire, England.

[whiteout7]

"Only son of John McMurray of Marlmount, county Down Esq with Margaret d of Robert Allen Esq of Ballygrote, County Down
http://www.mocavo.com/The-County-Families-of-the-United-Kingdom-Ed-6/413441/672

This link seems to like them as coming from Stirling orginally, where did all this inromation come from?
http://mcmurray.info/genealogy/ged2html/d0000/g0000024.html

More John McMurray married Janet Smyth in the 1600's, he was the first of this family to arrive from Scotland.
https://books.google.co.nz/books?id=7o8SAwAAQBAJ&pg=PA952&lpg=PA952&dq=%22Jane+Hamilton+Martin%22&source=bl&ots=Lfv8QRCd-H&sig=tqVt2utDbTCrHoUu80NCBXFajzo&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwi38Kntv4jLAhXIKZQKHWptBoUQ6AEIPTAH#v=onepage&q=%22Jane%20Hamilton%20Martin%22&f=false

[rmcmurray]

Thanks, whiteout7.

That was some wonderful research, although it appears that at least in my situation we are talking about two different McMurray families. I do not believe that the McMurrays of Tullynakill are the same McMurrays from your research, and here are just a few of the reasons why the data which you discovered doesn't line up with the records which are available:

• The records which you listed refer to Robert McMurray, Esq as the sole child of a John McMurray and Margaret Allen, whereas in my family I have records of what must be a different John McMurray and Margaret Allen who had three children: Edward McMurray, Mary McMurray, and Margaret McMurray - with no mention of a Robert McMurray.
  • Note that I am a descendant of Edward McMurray, so I have detailed records of his descendants, and I have paired these records with someone who is a descendant of one of Edward's sisters.
  • However, while the detailed information which I have about Edward McMurray has been validated by multiple sources, some of the information about John McMurray's ancestors in my family tree data is from this other person, and the detailed research which you have provided now makes me question the veracity of his notes about the ancestry of John McMurray. (This other person may have inadvertently hijacked another John McMurray's family tree.)
• Roxborough House is in Limerick, whereas the family ancestors which I am researching lived in County Down.
  • These two locations are half-way across Ireland from each other, which was a considerable distance away in the early-to-mid 1800s.
  • Although that being said, I realize that John McMurray and Margaret Allen were listed as hailing from County Down in the data which you provided.
• My family members were dirt-poor in Ireland, which is why they emigrated to the USA during the Great Famine.
  • It is highly unlikely that any of my ancestors would have been able to purchase such a grand estate as Roxborough House.
  • And it is just as unlikely that someone from my family would have had the resources to hold their son's wedding ceremony in England.

Several years ago I visited the Public Record Office in Northern Ireland (PRONI), and one thing that I discovered during my research there was that there were a lot of people named John McMurray in County Down in the early nineteenth century. 

[BallyaltikilliganG]

starting with Marlemont   
"Only son of John McMurray of Marlmount, county Down Esq with Margaret d of Robert Allen Esq of Ballygrote, County Down
http://www.mocavo.com/The-County-Families-of-the-United-Kingdom-Ed-6/413441/672

Ros Davies has Tullynakill   21: 48/65 farm; in Lisbarnet townlands 4km SSE of Comber;  I think Tullynakill is an error see Ros’s map and its in Kilmood parish its also next townland to Lisbane in Tullynakill
Ballygrot is some distance away in and is the most NW townland in Bangor civil parish on Belfast Lough

Both Kilmood and Tullynakill have Adams but no McMurray in this incomplete record
http://www.irishgenealogyhub.com/down/tithe-applotment-books/tullynakill-parish.php#.V0bDlleoc5Q
has
Adams, James   Townland: Lisbane Year: 1833
Adams, James, Jr.   Townland: Lisbane Year: 1833
Adams, Wilm.   Townland: Tullynakill Year: 1833
and
http://www.irishgenealogyhub.com/down/tithe-applotment-books/kilmood-parish.php#.V0bGIleoc5R
Adams, James   Townland: Ballyministra Year: 1829

from http://www.irishgenealogyhub.com/down/tithe-applotment-books/killinchy-parish.php#.V0bREFeoc5Q
No Adams or McMurray

I did wonder about the civil parishes -Kilmood and Tullnakill both sit on Killinchy where Killinchy might have been the local registration district or church location, rather than where they lived.   so I am suggesting these could be relatives
Hamilton   McMURRAY   .   Killinchy   married Agnes McKibbin 19 Jan 1814 at Killinchy Presbyterian Church   PR
Miss   Mary   McMURRAY   .   Killinchy   married David Adams 20 Oct 1821 at Killinchy Presbyterian Church   PR
Samuel   McMURRAY   .   Killinchy   married Elizabeth McConnell 6 Jan 1816 at Killinchy Presbyterian Church   PR
Miss   Sarah   McMURRAY   .   Killinchy   married Thomas McKenzey 19 Mar 1840 at Killinchy Church of Ireland   PR

Ros Davies is excellent for church records in Killinchy Kilmood and Tullynakill. PRONI is more likley to hold microfilms only, but has many other types of records

http://www.ancestryireland.com  credits or joining required
gravestone inscriptions  have you seen?
McMURRAY-Tullynakill-Tullynakill-Tullynakill-Down
 
ancestors Ireland and familysearch.org always useful

good luck in finalizing your trees