(*Completed with thanks*)Agnes/Mary DAVIDSON one or two women?

[jennywren001]

Hi Everyone,

Davidina Thom is my great great grandmother she married William Jolly in 1869 in Montrose and on her marriage certificate she gives her parents as John Thom (weaver) and Agnes Davidson. Davidina born in 1850 was the youngest of the eight children I have attributed to this couple. I have a marriage cert for a John Thom and Agnes Davidson in Dundee in 1827 that states they are both in this parish (it says 'in' for everyone on the page) and that Agnes is the daughter of John Davidson Shoemaker. John and Agnes' first four children were born in Dundee the remaining four in Montrose.

I have a 1869 death certficate for John Thom which states married to AGNES Davidson. I have a 1891 death certificate for a MARY Thom  that states widow of John Thom weaver, daughter of John Davidson shoemaker and Jane Wyllie. I have the family from the 41 census through to the 81 living in Montrose. Agnes should have been on the 91 as her death is recorded as 12th August but I can't see her. Finally, I have a marriage in 1803 in Brechin for a John Davidson weaver - scored out then shoemaker written over the top and Jane Wyllie daughter of deceased Alex. Wyllie. This couple I took to be Agnes' parents - getting very excited as Jane's father is a bonus on the wedding certificate!

But - problems:
1841 census Agnes living in Montrose states born in the county (correct if she was born in Brechin) age 35
1851 Agnes states born in Brechin Forfarshire age 45 - John and Jane of Brechin looking very good for parents  ...
1861 Agnes now states born Midlothian Edinburgh!  age 52
1871 Agnes born Edinburgh age 63
1881 Agnes born Edinburgh age 71
Agnes for 81 years then Mary? Her daughter Mary Thom signs (marks with X) the death cert so you'd think she's know her own mother's name. So, just a series of mistakes? Two women? Going in circles with this could use a wee bit help to move forward or rather backwards.

Jen

[apanderson]

Hi Jen,

A quick thought .....

I think you may have answered your own question.

When daughter Mary Thom sign's her mother's DC with an 'X', this indicates she was illiterate, so wouldn't have known if there was an error in the details in front of her.

Anne

[Forfarian]

You certainly have a poser there!

If Mary signed with a 'x' it meant that she was unable to sign her own name. Therefore it may be that she could not read either, and would not have realised if her mother's name was wrong. She may have been a bit confused and when the Registrar asked for the name of her mother she might have given her own name by mistake.

I think if she has consistently been Agnes all her like, and Mary on a death registered by an illiterate daughter Mary, I'd regard the death certificate as likely to be wrong.

[jennywren001]

Hi Anne and Forfarian,
Thanks for your thoughts - I've had another look on the death certificate and note that somebody named Piggins has signed above where Mary put her X and it's been scored through - I see that Piggins also signs as the informant on the death below - maybe there was general confusion all round that day! So, I'll take it there's a mistake on the death certificate and try and find Agnes' true birth place and where she was at the time of the 91 census.
Jen

[Forfarian]

note that somebody named Piggins has signed above where Mary put her X and it's been scored through - I see that Piggins also signs as the informant on the death below

This is quite normal - if an informant is unable to sign their own name, they sign with an 'x' in the presence of a witness who also signs. If this Piggins just happened to come in to register a death while Mary was registering her mother's, Piggins could have been asked to witness her making her mark.

[jennywren001]

"This is quite normal - if an informant is unable to sign their own name, they sign with an 'x' in the presence of a witness who also signs. If this Piggins just happened to come in to register a death while Mary was registering her mother's, Piggins could have been asked to witness her making her mark."

I'm sure that was the case but in this instance don't you think it looks like a mistake?
Jen

[Forfarian]

Yes, definitely a mistake.

There should be a note in the left margin saying something like 'clerical error in column..'

[apanderson]

It looks like the case that our Mr. Piggins simply signed in the wrong place and the Registrar just scored out his name.

Anne

[jennywren001]

Hi All,
All doubts now banished as thanks to a PM I can now see on Familysearch 'Agnus' Davidson born Nov 5th 1807 Canongate Edinburgh born to John Davidson and Jean Wylie.  Should have used Agn* when searching ahhh...

I do like Mr Piggins - what a great name...

Many thanks.
Jen