too many babies births + deaths close together

[brigidmac]

Sana + samuel Fellman had 6 children ;3 still living in 1910

If my research is correct they had Taube in 1890
 Kahya in 1891

In 1891 they travelled to manchester  where Taube died (age given as 0 )
Golda was born in 1892
 
the other possible dead babies are Samuel FelDman died 1892 aged 1
and Israel Fellman  b 1894 + died 1984
or another Taube  Fellman died 1984

khaya ,Golda + Esther b1897  survived

 are  the deaths from the same family would sending for death certificates be the only way to satisfy my curiosity .

would  babies have graves ?  Cumpsall Cemetary ?

the family were living at Bury New road or Nightingale st in these years . Ihave threads about searching the descendants  in USA + ancestors in Russian Latvia

Any advice/ opinions gratefully received

[mosiefish]

Taube is buried in Crumpsall see:
http://www.mdcs.org.uk/searchburials.aspx

You have to buy credits for futher information.

Mo

[california dreamin]

Hi brigidmac,

Looking at births registered under the name FELLMAN I can see:  Golde 1892, Israel 1894 and a Sadie 1911 who have births registered in the Cheetham district.  There are two others but are registered in other districts and probably not yours if your family were based in Cheetham Hill/Crumpsall.

There are deaths for the following Fellmans: Taube d. 1891 age 0 Cheetham, Israel d. 1894 age 0 Cheetham, Rachel d. 1900 age 27 Cheetham and Nathan d. 1916 age 58 Cheetham

The d/c would only tell you what the child died of, who reported the death and where they were living at the time of death.  For example if a child died in hospital it would name a member of the staff and not a parent (if that's what you are hoping to confirm).

They may have been buried in a Jewish Cemetary.  Try this page:  http://www.manchester.gov.uk/info/448/archives_and_local_history/462/family_history/15   rather than Crumpsall. 

Would the babies have graves?  Many people were buried in 'common' graves as a family grave would have been very expensive.  A common grave could have had something like 10-15 persons interred in it.

CD

Added:  I can see that the mother's maiden name for Sadie Fellman is COHEN if that helps.

[groom]

The d/c would only tell you what the child died of, who reported the death and where they were living at the time of death.  For example if a child died in hospital it would name a member of the staff and not a parent (if that's what you are hoping to confirm).

Not necessarily - my maternal aunt died in Great Ormond Street hospital in 1905 and the death was registered by my grandmother. Similarly a paternal aunt died in hospital as a child and the death was registered by her father.

[brigidmac]

Thans so much ;
 i have the refs from lancsbmd to use but as it costs £10 per certificate   i only sent for
a  death of Rachel Fellman aged 27 in 1900 .
 I will choose which of the babies to send off for ;
fairly safe in assuming Taube  IS ours so that won't bring any extra info

i have birth + death refs for Israel 

samuel  Feldman interested me d1892 aged 1

 because he would be 1st boy named after his father 
youngest sister  birth is registered as Esther L Fillman so there are occasionally spelling hiccups.

I'm fairly sure Golde b1892 is our Gertrude  doubt her birth cert would give me any extra info ;

This family went to Birkenhead around 1900 + USA in 1904/1904 .

But some elder half siblings may have been around so Sadie could have been a sister-in-law ; i think I've seen some connection to the Cohen family . i'll have to check my info so far

http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=702215.msg5691564#msg5691564

 .thanks for the encouragement + suggestions

[california dreamin]

Hi brigid

There may have been some friendship between the Fellman & Cohen families as I see on FindMyPast in the Manchester rate books that in 1898 Abraham Isaac Cohen and Abraham Fellman lived at the same property 38 Herbert St. (I don't think at the same time, there is a date next to the Fellman's entry but I cannot read what it says properly).  In 1899 Fellman was still there.

Good luck

[brigidmac]

I've not come across an Abraham Fellman yet ; i wonder if he is the missing Elder brother
 does it give an age  or a proffession ?

the connection I had was an Annie Cohen m Abraham landsman on the same day as
Rebecca Fellman married Bernard Bloch in the synagogue in 1986
(i'd noted it because mother + stepmother's maiden name was landman !

By Ggfather George Jacob Fellman  wasn't living with his family by then he was28 still sg+ working on his own count .
I wonder if Herbert st was near Bury Road where Father Samuel + wife and younger siblings + half siblings
were .Or near Nightingale rd where he rented a shop in 1983 

The other

[california dreamin]

Hi -

No, sorry there is no information like that in a Rate book.  It is only related to how much rate (£) was paid on a property.

Herbert St is very near to Bury New Road

CD

[brigidmac]

Thanks CD ; 
There should be 10 half-siblings from Samuel's 1st wife(Geis-ada/ Edith) in Manchester
 More  babies in a short time !    2 died young ;
the last was unbaptised + Edith died in Jacobstadt a month after birth 1888 .

 My GGfather George Jacob was 2nd b1871  came to GB in 1891 and is with his father (leizer-mendel /lazarus/samuel Fellman in Pimblett st on 1891 census  as boarders "living on means"

The rest of the family must have come to GB later as 2nd wife's 2nd child Khaya/Tilly/matilda was born Riga 1891

Rebecca was  3rd b.1872  married B.Bloch june 1896 Beth Hamedrash Synagogue + went to Dundee with him ..is on 1901 census Dundee

From russian records the ;
mesa/May
 Besa
sora/Sarah/celia
David    all                               were born between 1880 and 1886 

I have some evidence of them being at school in manchester ; Oct 1891 for May.Betsy + Sarah
1893 for David + Matilda   living at nightingale st
  1897 matilda ai New bury road again

They are on 1901 census in Birkenhead with half sisters Khaya/tilly  ....Gertrude  ..and Esther

Birth records in Russia are missing from 1870-1876 so I don't know the names of the eldest sibling or others

They may have been in Manchester from 1891-1900 too So Abraham + Sophie are both probables

 4th/5th brother is definitely  B Fellman b.circa 1876 Barnet/benjamin ?

There is a record of Barnd Fellman on ship from liverpool  aged 24 1900

Barues/Bengeman Fellman/Falman of 478 myrtle  Av NY is given as the relative that May then David (watchmaker aged18) are going to stay with when they immigrate to USA 
He is listed as a traveller or a jeweller .

There is a Rachel Fellman d.1900 aged 24 ...I've sent off for death cert to see if she is a missing sibling
.
Abraham is a possibility especially if i can find him with a middle name Jacob maybe he'll turn up in USA too

here's link to that research   http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=702215.msg5691564#msg5691564