Is it the same bridegroom?

[AddictedtoFamilyTree]

Are any of these their children?

05 Apr 1770 Ellenor, d. of John & Ann Hope bap.
29 Dec 1771 Mary, d. of John & Ann Hope bap.
22 May 1774 George, s. of John & Ann Hope bap.

[LizzieL]

Unfortunately baptisms in market Drayton only give the father's name, so I cannot be certain of the mother.

Ann had a son John a few months before she married William. There were three children sons or daughters of William baptised George 1766, Mary 1768 and William 1770.

Then there are more children's baptisms in 1779, 1785, 1786, 1790 (sons or daughters of William) and two on the same date in 1794. The last pair are son and daughter of William and Mary, so at least I know the mother of them. The register doesn't say they are twins, one might be a couple of years old.

None of the records give date of birth. I think they may be BT's on FindMyPast, although they do have the actual marriage register scans as well.

The gap in births does fit with Ann dying and William remarrying.
Ann's brother left considerable sons of money to nephews and nieces, with help of some kind people on the deciphering board they have confirmed they were Hopes, and look like the illegitimate John, George and Mary. Nothing to William jnr but he might have died by 1811 when the bequests were made. None of the later set of children were mentioned (I know the first two died in infancy) this could be because they were not blood relatives of Ann's brother or because they had all predeceased the brother. I am still trying to find what happened to them.

[AddictedtoFamilyTree]

Do the marriage details have fathers details on like banns and certificates? Sorry if it's a silly question, I haven't got that far back.

[AddictedtoFamilyTree]

Found the two marriages in findmypast, there's not really enough information on them to be sure is there. The two William's could always be cousins. Are you far from Market Drayton? Which church were the two marriages (and presumably the baptisms) at? Do you know where Ann's brother is buried?

[LizzieL]

I can only find one William of the right age to have married either or both ladies, got his baptism s/o John in 1743 and his burial in 1812, age of death matches up to baptism. I think his father may be the son of John (Johannis) who married Jane Davies in 1725. They had a lot of children, many of whom died in infancy and William looks as if he's the last child when his mother was probably in her mid forties. If that is the case, the Jane Hope who is a witness on the first marriage could be his mother or his older sister Jane (b 1726) if she was still a spinster.

Ann's brother James Eltham made a lot of money in London and died Old Street, St Lukes in 1811. he is buried at St Luke's Finsbury. His will is on Ancestry. In his will he directed that he was to be buried with his wife Ann (nee Bass).

If Ann Hope isn't buried in Market Drayton, there is a slight possibility that she might be buried in London perhaps died while visiting her brother. James Eltham had no children, so left money to various nephews and nieces and their children on both his and his late wife's sides of the family, so it looks like they were quite close.

[AddictedtoFamilyTree]

James Eltham of Old Street, buried 8th June 1811 died of Dropsy?
There is a forum for graves, you could see if anyone could go and have a look for you? Headstone may give some clues? I'm about to go out but I'll have a nosey tomorrow, Im a bit stuck with my tree, my Great Grandma and mother are awol between Great Grandma's birth and her marriage. She should be in two census returns and she's hiding well!

[AddictedtoFamilyTree]

Maybe this could be her if he did go to London to stay with her brother?
NAME:    Ann Hope
BIRTH:    abt 1740
DEATH:    abt 1816
VITAL:    15 Mar 1816
OTHER:    15 Mar 1816 - St Paul, Covent Garden, England

Or is there a possibility they went out of the area for a while? Do you know what John did as an occupation? Some of my Shropshire branch moved about, presumably following work, but others stayed put.

Name:   Ann Hope
Event Type:   Burial
Birth Date:   abt 1742
Gender:   Female
Spouse:   John Hope
Death Date:   7 Mar 1792
Death Place:   England
Death Age:   50
Burial Date:   10 Mar 1792
Burial Place:   Darlington, Durham, England

[LizzieL]

Ann's husband was William not John. John was her illegitimate son who adopted the surname Hope.
She died before 1811, because she was not mentioned in her brother's will. In fact the will was written in 1808 with later codicils, so she had died by 1808. Her other son George Hope was mentioned in the original will, but the last codicil in 1811 about a month before James Eltham died, redirected George's bequest to his sister because George had died in the meantime.

[AddictedtoFamilyTree]

Sorry! Got confused. If she was in London, maybe he had already made provisions for his sister? Was she older than him?  I wouldn't necessarily assume she is already dead because she isn't in his will.