Newman

[barrydepp]

I am researching the line of Newman from Gosport and Portsmouth in Hampshire. Then a major spanner was throwing into the works. are you all sitting comfortably then I will begin.

My 3x Great grandfather was not a Newman. His name was William Butler according to the census born 1798 Gosport or 1808 Southampton. (they all lost the plot). He Marries Harriet Phelps from Gosport. Date 10th March 1834 at Gosport Holy Trinity as Butler. on the 17th June 1833 first child was Born, Amelia Butler. Christened on 26th Feb 1837 Gosport as NEWMAN this was her new surname. Married under the Newman Name.
 on the 29th February 1837 St’ Marys. Portsea, Portsmouth. William remarried Harriett as Newman. Harriett sister was presents of both weddings. On 24th Dec 1937, second child was born Harriett Ann Butler. (I have copy of birth certificate) christened on 4th February 1838. Gosport Holy Trinity as Newman. Again This is her new surname. Married under the Newman Name.
 The Third child was born. William Butler on 24th July 1840 at Hawke St Portsea, Portsmouth. Christened on 26th August 1842 Alverstoke. Then He was rechristened with is brother one after another on 5th December 1850 at Gosport Holy Trinity as William Charles Newman. (I have a copy of his birth certificate). Married in the name Newman.
 all the other children where all register as Newman.
 John Newman, born, 23rd March 1844, Alverstoke. Christened. 14th April 1844, Gosport. Cannot find death.
 George Joseph Newman, born4th March 1847. Gosport. Christened, 20th June 1847, Gosport
 James Thomas Newman, born, 4th March 1850. Green Row. High St. Gosport. Christened. 5th Dec 1850, (this is the christened date William Butler rechristened too)

My 3x Great Grandfather was in the navy. I have most of his records. Stated on the top of the first record say William Butler Alas William Newman. Then his ship records reads William Newman. Changed to William Butler.

I have all records to back all above up. The only death I cannot find. Harriet died 1870 and it states on here death certificate Harried Butler. Husband a seaman not deceased. here sister registered here death. All the Sons died as a Newman and all children married under the surname. I have Two William Butlers One died in Portsea, but living with a woman say married on the census. cannot find marriage. the other on the 1871 census in London as a Widower, and say from Southampton. all the other William Butlers have ruled out. William Butler was not on the 1861 census.

1841 Census. As William Butler
 1851 Census. AS William Newman
 1861 Census. His not on there family are.
 1871 Census. Harriet's dead. some family moved to London.
 If anyone have a really good answer to all the above. I would love to know.

[Marmalady]

Do you have William/s birth -- were his parents married?

In my husband's tree I have a Richard / Joseph Horrobin / Plant -- throughout his life he used two christian names and two surnames interchangeably

His parents were not married at the time of his birth, although they pretended to be when they registered him -- so he was registered under his father's surname.
His father died, his mother married and he appears to be brought up by his paternal grandparents --who enter him on censuses with his mother's surname
Throughout his adult life, he uses the two surnames randomly. Some children are registered with one name, other children registered with the other name. Ditto with baptisms -- some children are even registered with one name but baptised with the other. When the children reach adulthood some use Horrobin, some use Plant as their surnames

Maybe your William Butler / Newman was in a similar situation

[barrydepp]

Hello Marmalady.  Thanks for your reply. Sorry I do not know who his parents are. I wish I did, as this would help me out big time.

Barry

[Little Nell]

Hi Barry

Welcome to RootsChat. 

Ages on the census records can be notoriously inaccurate, so bear that in mind.

There are some baptism records which might be of use to try to narrow things down for you:

William Butler son of Ambrose & Martha Butler bpt 22 Nov 1798, St Mary Southampton
William Butler son of William & Jane Butler bapt (aged 7yrs 7 months) 22 Apr 1798, St Mary,  Portsea (possibly not yours)
William Butler son of William & Elizabeth Butler, bpt 21 Apr 1799, St Mary Portsea
William Butler son of Joseph & Sarah Butler, bapt 3 Apr 1801 St, John Portsea
William Butler, son of John & Mary Butler bpt 9 Aug 1802 Gosport
     
Are any of these parents' names repeated in William's family?  None of the records indicate that the child was illegitimate.

Nell

[barrydepp]

Hi little Neal

Many thank for you input. I've had these details for a long while too.  The only name that is in the family are used a middle names. Joseph a few times and Sarah only once. The name William is also used once and he would of been a twin as on this birth certificate got a time of birth on it 😀

[Little Nell]

he would of been a twin as on this birth certificate got a time of birth on it

If this birth was in the Portsea RD in the early years, then he may not have been a twin.  Many registrars recorded the time in the early years of civil registration nad it would seem that the one in Portsea was one of these.  I have the birth certificate for my 2 x gt grandfather in 1839 in Portsea and it has the time on it.  He was not a twin.

Nell