Author Topic: Samuel Smith c 1808  (Read 5261 times)

Offline redtonyt

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Samuel Smith c 1808
« on: Tuesday 31 January 17 15:25 GMT (UK) »
I am helping a friend from Adelaide, South Australia research his Family Tree.

What I know.
Some strands have been in South Australia for over 150 years.  Variously they originate from Cambridgeshire, Suffolk and London.  However, the particular family I am interested in came from the Beds/Northants border area.  This is them arriving in SA,

SMITH Samuel, Fanny LOVELL, Wm, Eliz, Sarah, Kerrenhappuch, Lydia arrived in SA 1849-05-18 aboard Susannah from London 49-01-20 via Plymouth

Fanny Lovell’s heritage has been reasonably easy to research, as were the children but, Samuel Smith is another story.  The only record I have on him is the 1841 Census, when the family was living in Bozeat, Northants.

Census ref
H107, Piece 802, Book 1, Folio 14, Page 20.

Samuel Smith   Aged 30   Publican   Not born in County
Fanny      Aged 25         Not born in County
William      Aged 5         Not born in County
Elizabeth      Aged 3         Not born in County
Sarah         Aged 1         Born in County

My suspicion is that Samuel, was born (possibly at Knotting) the son of u/k Smith and Keren-Happuch.  Her maiden name (if my research is correct) was Jones born 1766 at Bletsoe, Beds.  The reason for uncertainty over Samuel’s father’s maiden name is the second marriage of Keren-Happuch (as Wildman) to Sn Smith at Thurleigh on 9 June 1796.  Detail as found on FreeReg.  What does the Sn stand do for, Simon or something completely different?

So my questions are,

Can anyone give me the actual name of the Groom at the marriage in 1796?

Secondly, can the baptism of Samuel Smith be found with his parentage, based on the information as found?

Tony

Offline StevenG

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Re: Samuel Smith c 1808
« Reply #1 on: Tuesday 31 January 17 16:15 GMT (UK) »
There are two baptisms at Odell on 28th July 1839. William & Elizabeth Smith, children of William & Fanny, of Odell. William is given as a dealer.
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Offline rosie99

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Re: Samuel Smith c 1808
« Reply #2 on: Tuesday 31 January 17 16:21 GMT (UK) »
Samuel Smyth
Fanny Lovell
marriage:   19 March 1835   Puddington, Bedfordshire
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Offline johnP-bedford

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Re: Samuel Smith c 1808
« Reply #3 on: Wednesday 01 February 17 08:18 GMT (UK) »

My suspicion is that Samuel, was born (possibly at Knotting) the son of u/k Smith and Keren-Happuch.  Her maiden name (if my research is correct) was Jones born 1766 at Bletsoe, Beds.  The reason for uncertainty over Samuel’s father’s maiden name is the second marriage of Keren-Happuch (as Wildman) to Sn Smith at Thurleigh on 9 June 1796.  Detail as found on FreeReg.  What does the Sn stand do for, Simon or something completely different?

So my questions are,
Can anyone give me the actual name of the Groom at the marriage in 1796?

From the Thurleigh marriage transcript...
9 Jun 1796 Jn (= John) Smith of Rushden Northants to Karenhappuch Wildman alias Tyler, widow, signs Wildman

There's a topic on the Wildman alias Tyler scenario done 10 years ago...
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=252727.81

Cheers John 
Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
Partridge - North Beds; Northants & Peterborough
Bishop - Bedford; Hunts, Hemingford Grey
Allen - Hunts, Hemingford Abbotts
Clement - Croydon
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Offline redtonyt

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Re: Samuel Smith c 1808
« Reply #4 on: Wednesday 01 February 17 09:04 GMT (UK) »
Thank you all for your replies, especially the one from John.  I shall get round to reading that link, all ten pages of it, even though my interest may only be via a marriage.

That marriage detail helps to set my at rest as, I had found a Census return in 1841 for a John Smith, living at Hinwick, Beds, aged 70.  My reasoning for picking up on this particular return was the presence of a grandson (assumed) by the name of Low Smith.  The father of Keren-Happuck Jones was a Low Jones.  Also living there were a John Smith (35) and William (40) the father of Low?  In 1851 both John and William can be found with their place of birth noted a Knotting.  Hence my thought on the possibility of Knotting for Samuel.

Keren-Happuch Smith died in Wellingborough District in 1840, aged 72.  John Smith (probably) died also in Wellingborough District in the last quarter of 1841 aged 72.

Now to tie down Samuel Smith's birth detail and, then researching the remaining Smith Family.

Cheers,
Tony :)

Offline johnP-bedford

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Re: Samuel Smith c 1808
« Reply #5 on: Wednesday 01 February 17 10:10 GMT (UK) »

Keren-Happuch Smith died in Wellingborough District in 1840, aged 72.  John Smith (probably) died also in Wellingborough District in the last quarter of 1841 aged 72.

As per Beds FHS Surnames Index CD ...
Keren-Happuch Smith was buried Podington in 1839 abode Hinwick (NBI 20/6/1839)
John Smith buried Podington in 1841 also abode Hinwick (NBI 5/11/1841)

Podington is in the Wellingborough Reg District.

Also have you a more precise year of birth for Samuel Smith, say from Australian records, or from his age at death; being 30 on 1841 census gives us 1811, but there is no sensible baptism for him on/around 1811 in North Beds parishes from that same CD.

Cheers John
Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
Partridge - North Beds; Northants & Peterborough
Bishop - Bedford; Hunts, Hemingford Grey
Allen - Hunts, Hemingford Abbotts
Clement - Croydon
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Offline redtonyt

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Re: Samuel Smith c 1808
« Reply #6 on: Wednesday 01 February 17 11:20 GMT (UK) »
Hi John,

Thanks for your continued interest.

According to the Australian Death Index Samuel Smith died on 27 April 1859, aged 53.  The death was registered at Adelaide; his place of residence was given as Marion, South Australia.  He was buried in West Terrace Cemetery, Adelaide.

That's all I have managed to find so far.  The 1808 was pure speculation based on the '41 census.

Cheers,
Tony

Offline johnP-bedford

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Re: Samuel Smith c 1808
« Reply #7 on: Wednesday 01 February 17 16:56 GMT (UK) »
Found the attached... from Northampton Mercury 24 Dec 1842

In 1841 at Bozeat Samuel Smith was a publican... this chap is a farmer & victualler, so assume it is the same man.... he seems to be assigning all his personal estate & effects to William Smith, farmer of Hinwick ... could this be his brother ?
Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
Partridge - North Beds; Northants & Peterborough
Bishop - Bedford; Hunts, Hemingford Grey
Allen - Hunts, Hemingford Abbotts
Clement - Croydon
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Offline redtonyt

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Re: Samuel Smith c 1808
« Reply #8 on: Wednesday 01 February 17 17:54 GMT (UK) »
In 1841 at Bozeat Samuel Smith was a publican... this chap is a farmer & victualler, so assume it is the same man.... he seems to be assigning all his personal estate & effects to William Smith, farmer of Hinwick ... could this be his brother ?

The answer to your question is, that is what I have always thought (and hoped) and the Notice does appear to support this.  Just need to find baptism records to put my theory to bed!

Tony