Author Topic: Letters of administration  (Read 1112 times)

Offline landeg

  • RootsChat Extra
  • **
  • Posts: 12
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Letters of administration
« on: Thursday 01 February 18 15:33 GMT (UK) »
I'd like to establish why someone who died intestate in Cardiff in April 1924 took two years to get her letters of administration granted in London to her sister in law in August 1926.

The admon states that she has no real estate (unknown, but death occurred in a nursing home)
No living parents (true)
Without child (false, she had an illegitimate daughter in 1868 who was brought up by the father's parents).

Would the delay be due to the fact that, at the time of her death, her only next of kin was a younger brother who died in April 1925 or maybe that the administration was contested?

How would I determine whether there was such a protest and by whom?

Online rosie99

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 41,919
  • ALFIE 2009 - 2021 (Rosbercon Sky's the Limit)
    • View Profile
Re: Letters of administration
« Reply #1 on: Thursday 01 February 18 15:53 GMT (UK) »
Why do you think there would have been a 'protest'  :-\

Did the brother know she had died - Was he in a fit state at the time of her death to deal with administration - Maybe something happened after his death that prompted an application for administration to be made to 'tidy' things up. 
Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline landeg

  • RootsChat Extra
  • **
  • Posts: 12
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Letters of administration
« Reply #2 on: Thursday 01 February 18 17:52 GMT (UK) »
Thanks for your interest.

There's a family legend that there was a portion of land/property somewhere between Bridgend and Cardiff that slipped through their fingers. Now I wish that I had paid more interest in this tale when I first heard it 30+ years ago. There was talk of the word "chancery" that leads me to think that some sort of protest occured.

The nearset substance that I can find is the daughter who didn't benefit from her mother's will. I saw something similar happen in 2017 so it's entirely possible it happened in 1926.

So, what I actually know is.....
1868 Celia H mothers an illegitimate daughter, Mabel, and the father is named as David M.
Surprisingly, Mabel is brought up 30 miles away with David's parents and, between 1871 and 1881, goes from grand-daughter to daughter and takes on their surname.

1878 Celia marries Henry T, they have no children.
1905 Henry dies near Cowbridge and leaves the bulk of his estate to Celia
1924 Celia T dies in Cardiff in Apr.
1925 William H (Celia's brother) dies in Cardiff
1926 Celia's admon to Sarah H (William's wife)
1926 Sarah dies in Cardiff

William and Sarah H are living about 15 minutes walk from Celia; Colum Road and Cathedral Road. I have no doubt that William knew of Celia's situation* and, I'm guessing, funded her stay in the nursing home. I've William's will on order, his estate was worth £13,000+.
As far as I know so far, Mabel got nothing and wonder if her dad, David M, tried to get a slice of pie for his daughter.

Edit. *William knew of Celia's death, he was "in attendance"!

Online rosie99

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 41,919
  • ALFIE 2009 - 2021 (Rosbercon Sky's the Limit)
    • View Profile
Re: Letters of administration
« Reply #3 on: Thursday 01 February 18 18:04 GMT (UK) »

The nearset substance that I can find is the daughter who didn't benefit from her mother's will. I saw something similar happen in 2017 so it's entirely possible it happened in 1926.


If it was an administration there was no will found  ???
Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk


Offline landeg

  • RootsChat Extra
  • **
  • Posts: 12
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Letters of administration
« Reply #4 on: Thursday 01 February 18 18:07 GMT (UK) »
OK, substitute "administration" for "will"

Offline mazi

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 3,110
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Letters of administration
« Reply #5 on: Thursday 01 February 18 19:22 GMT (UK) »
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01lgh/

This google book may help, it seems the right of intestacy between mother and illegitimate child was debated in parliament in the early 1920, and not resolved until 1926

Mike

Offline landeg

  • RootsChat Extra
  • **
  • Posts: 12
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Letters of administration
« Reply #6 on: Friday 02 February 18 06:50 GMT (UK) »
Thanks Mike

That kept me occupied for a while.
It's a good insight into the politics and social aspects of the time.

However, it appears that Mabel was totally accepted into her father's family but ignored by her mother's.
Celia certainly married well and lived comfortably; in the 1911census night, she's living alone as a widow in a 9 room house and is of Private Means. Column 7 is blank although I don't know if filling that in would be relevant to her past marriage.

I've read Henry T's funeral report which looks like a potted Who's Who of the locality.
I know that it could have been a poorly kept secret, but would owning up to mothering a child affected her social standing?

Posing my original question, why would the estate of someone who died in Cardiff be proved in London?

Steve.

Online rosie99

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 41,919
  • ALFIE 2009 - 2021 (Rosbercon Sky's the Limit)
    • View Profile
Re: Letters of administration
« Reply #7 on: Friday 02 February 18 09:02 GMT (UK) »
Posing my original question, why would the estate of someone who died in Cardiff be proved in London?

Probate/Admin is to my knowledge proved at the office at which it was claimed, it is not related to where someone was living/died. 

ADDED I have just looked at the probate index around that time and there are a few 'Welsh' wills that were proved in London, maybe they were just passing some over. Certainly in WW2 London wills were dealt with in Wales
Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline landeg

  • RootsChat Extra
  • **
  • Posts: 12
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Letters of administration
« Reply #8 on: Saturday 03 February 18 10:32 GMT (UK) »
That's a fair point. Staff shortages or organisational difficulties have always existed.

Brother William's will took 14 months to get signed off and that was in London as well.
Sister-in law Sarah's will took only 2 months in Llandaff, the same year.

Should the delays have been caused by a legal dispute, how would I go about investigating this?
Would a trip to Kew to view chancery records be beneficial?