Author Topic: Fate of Everest Anseline after time on 'The Vernon'  (Read 12258 times)

Offline Jamjar

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Re: Fate of Everest Anseline after time on 'The Vernon'
« Reply #36 on: Wednesday 09 May 18 13:31 BST (UK) »
Another version of the surname.

Burial Rookwood Catholic: Anslen Julius 37 3-4-1876 SEC*M1*7**89

A thread on Ancestry message boards suggested he was buried here.

If you are 'brothers8' there was a reply to the post that wasn't answered. Someone has information on Jules.

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Offline majm

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Re: Fate of Everest Anseline after time on 'The Vernon'
« Reply #37 on: Wednesday 09 May 18 13:35 BST (UK) »
Well found JJ. :)  :)
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Offline Jamjar

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Re: Fate of Everest Anseline after time on 'The Vernon'
« Reply #38 on: Wednesday 09 May 18 13:38 BST (UK) »
Yet another variation.  :D

770/1876 ANSLIN Juleuis  AGE 37 YEARS DIED SYDNEY SYDNEY

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Offline Gold prospector

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Re: Fate of Everest Anseline after time on 'The Vernon'
« Reply #39 on: Wednesday 09 May 18 14:54 BST (UK) »
Thank you for your findings as per above...
Starting with Julia:
As you know, from 1876, she served her time in the Parramatta Training School (where she was known as 'Julietta') and was then, on Dec 5, 1877 indentured out to E. A. Lumsdaine of Burwood for 5 years (whom I take to be the wife of Rev. W. Lumsdaine of Burwood - as a fellow inmate from the School was indentured to that Reverend gentleman about the same time). However, she absconded and was sent to the 'Reformatory'.
Next, I have her Marriage Certificate of Nov 10, 1883 indicating she married Thomas Nestor, 'a plasterer', age 21, at St Michael's Anglican Church, Sydney (so, presumably she was born in 1862 - maybe Lambing Flat as her parents were there at the time).
She had been living in Wattle Street, Ultimo. However, there were "letters of importance" addressed to her at 73 Forbes Street as advertised by 'a friend' in The Evening News(Sydney), 30/10/1883 and 12/12/1884.
However, she may have moved to Bourke, NSW subsequently as there was uncollected mail addressed to her there as "Miss J. Anseline" (there being no other Miss J. Anseline's to my knowledge).
1897: My next set of documents (from the Barrier Miner newspaper), relates to Broken Hill where, as Julia Nestor,  she was before the Police Court for drunkenness (April, 1897 - 10 shillings or 7 days), indecent language and drunkenness (Sept 1897 - 5 pounds or 6 weeks), drunk and disorderly on another occasion (22 shillings and sixpence or 7 days), drunk and disorderly (Feb, 1898 - 4 pounds, 2 shillings or 14 days, obscene language (Aug, 1898 - 20 shillings or 7 days) and in Nov 1898, drunkenness (40s or 7 days) and indecent language (60s or 3 weeks). In  all instances, she didn't pay the fine and served gaol time!
I have also saved a document(somewhere!) that shows she was gaoled for prostitution as well around that time.
Interestingly, her mother, Mary, was in trouble with the Law in Broken Hill for running a house of ill-repute in 1904. (She was know as 'Polly'!!!)
Julia probably had 2 children - James (born 1888) and John (born 1894). Both were 'Nestor' on their Birth Certificates but their care was taken over by (uncle) Everest (now married to Sarah in Broken Hill) and, thereafter the boys were Anselines.
I'm not sure when she died, however, on her mother's (Mary) Death Certificate (dated 1913) she is not listed as one of the living offspring.
So, my questions are:
Could the uncollected letters be her mother advertising for her whereabouts? (Mary Anseline had advertised under her name looking for her other children, Emily and Alfred - found in Trove)
Whatever happened to Thomas Nestor?
Was he the 'Thomas Nestor' who was the apparent ne' er do well for which there were numerous scrapes with the Law during the 1880's in Sydney up to the end of 1888 when there is an abrupt stop to anything about him (did he come to a 'messy' end considering his predisposition with petty crime often with violence?)? He may have had 2 brothers, Edward and John (who advertised the death of their father, Thomas Nestor (Snr), September, 1885) - the brothers also had had some issues with the Law too.
Sorry about the long story to date, but I thought I should give you what I already have so that this story can be built on...
Many thanks for any assistance!
Gold prospector.
PS: I might just leave the story of Jules Francois until tomorrow!


Offline Dundee

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Re: Fate of Everest Anseline after time on 'The Vernon'
« Reply #40 on: Wednesday 09 May 18 15:57 BST (UK) »
..... (did he come to a 'messy' end considering his predisposition with petty crime often with violence?)?

He might have been using an alias, but would have be lying about his age if this is your man.

https://www.records.nsw.gov.au/index_image/1998_a006_a00603_1307000105r

Debra  :)

Offline wivenhoe

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Re: Fate of Everest Anseline after time on 'The Vernon'
« Reply #41 on: Thursday 10 May 18 00:00 BST (UK) »

"..Julia probably had 2 children - James (born 1888) and John (born 1894). Both were 'Nestor' on their Birth Certificates..."

What is your uncertainty about these boys being children of Julia?
What birthplace and dates for them...who is informant?

Can you scan the 1913 death certificate and place here for us to see.

Offline wivenhoe

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Re: Fate of Everest Anseline after time on 'The Vernon'
« Reply #42 on: Thursday 10 May 18 02:43 BST (UK) »

This about Julia -

........ "letters of importance" addressed to her at 73 Forbes Street as advertised by 'a friend' in The Evening News(Sydney), 30/10/1883 and 12/12/1884."


Evening News 30 Oct 1883 p3
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/result?
Julietta Anseline - Letters of Importance for you at 73 Forbes St call immediately on your friend.

I am not seeing the notice, 12 Dec 1884, Evening News.


"..... moved to Bourke subsequently...........mail addressed to her there as "Miss J. Anseline" (there being no other Miss J. Anseline's to my knowledge).

Where are you seeing this later reference to her?

Julia married 10 Nov 1883, so you might wonder about her being known as ANSELINE after that?

On the marriage certificate, 1883, her name is (Ada, this crossed out) Julia ANSELINE.

See Ada NESTOR , Darlinghurst Jail, Dec 1884.

Offline Gold prospector

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Re: Fate of Everest Anseline after time on 'The Vernon'
« Reply #43 on: Thursday 10 May 18 03:26 BST (UK) »
Dear Debra,
I think the fact that Thomas had an alibi may be a breakthrough!! :D
May I give a little preamble here which might explain some of my conclusions to date?
The 'real' Thomas Nestor' (occupation, plasterer) was supposedly born in 1862 as he gave as his age 21 yrs, on his 1883 Marriage Certificate for his marriage to Julia Anseline.
However, I can find nothing else in subsequent years to definitively connect him to Julia.
There were a number of 'Thomas Nestors' around at that time; but the one that seems to be the main 'suspect' is this criminal 'Thomas Nestor' based on his age estimate.
For example, there is apparently a Birth Certificate for a 'Thomas Nestor' born in 1864 to parents, Thomas and Catherine (Ancestry.com)
Also there is an entry in the NSW Police Gazette of 26 Jan 1881 describing a warrant for the arrest of a 'Thomas Nestor' for riotous behaviour..."He is about 18 years of age, 5 feet, 5 inches high, slight build, freckled face..."
In fact, there were numerous reports of his arrest and imprisonment in the 1880's up until 1888 after which there is absolutely nothing.
I had assumed he came to a murky end. This would allow for him to have a child, James, with Julia, in 1888 but it wouldn't explain John who was born in 1984 (unless they/he was born to other men and the children were christened 'Nestor' because she was Julia Nestor - ?plausible -  given the fact she may have had free morals - eg: she was in gaol for prostitution in the late 1890's in Broken Hill). The boys were both born in Broken Hill and were 'Nestor' on their Birth Certificates (Ancestry.com) but became 'Anseline' when (uncle) Everest (recently married to Sarah in 1897 in Broken Hill)took over their care in the late 1890's.
On the other hand, a change of name explains that problem neatly - though James and John were both born in Broken Hill.
Many thanks for the link to Thomas Hynes (alias Nestor), born 1867, though apparently he was tried in Sydney in 1893 according to that document. However, he was 5 feet 5 and a half inches tall. It would have been great if the tattoos had said 'I love Julia' instead of "I love AB" and "I love FAC"!!
If this is the guy, it's great that there is a mugshot!!
He certainly could have lied about his age from the very beginning!
Interestingly, I have noticed entries for a Thomas Hynes about that time (Ancestry.com).
Once again, many thanks! ;) ;)
Paul.

Offline Gold prospector

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Re: Fate of Everest Anseline after time on 'The Vernon'
« Reply #44 on: Thursday 10 May 18 03:47 BST (UK) »
Dear Wivenhoe,
Thanks for your recent two posts.
Yes, I also have the 'uncollected letters' notice at her Sydney addresses. I wondered if they were attempts by her mother to contact her...
The entry that was related to 'uncollected letters' in Bourke to 'Miss J Anseline' was printed in "Country Letters", Wednesday 9, 1887, as published by the NSW Govt Gazette.
I have also attached here the Death Certificate on Mary McRae (Anseline) - nee Morris.
I'd be interested in everyone's thoughts.
Gold prospector.
PS: I have Julia's Marriage Certificate but I'm not seeing the name 'Ada' crossed out and replaced with 'Julia'.
PPS: Whoops... forgot to attach document; will re-send