Author Topic: Will and Death date variations  (Read 3826 times)

Offline pinefamily

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Re: Will and Death date variations
« Reply #9 on: Saturday 12 May 18 01:35 BST (UK) »
As I mentioned above, in between a brief discussion on 18th century wills, you need to check if there any other Henry Rider burials in and around the area. Is there an age for the 9 March burial?
More than one Henry Rider would account for the discrepancy in dates.
I have had a similar conundrum in my own family tree, with a burial months apart from a will; turned out the testator died within months of writing the will, and it took 15 years of contesting before the will was proved. The other burial was a grandson.
I am Australian, from all the lands I come (my ancestors, at least!)

Pine/Pyne, Dowdeswell, Kempster, Sando/Sandoe/Sandow, Nancarrow, Hounslow, Youatt, Richardson, Jarmyn, Oxlade, Coad, Kelsey, Crampton, Lindner, Pittaway, and too many others to name.
Devon, Dorset, Gloucs, Cornwall, Warwickshire, Bucks, Oxfordshire, Wilts, Germany, Sweden, and of course London, to name a few.

Offline Syd R

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Re: Will and Death date variations
« Reply #10 on: Saturday 12 May 18 01:39 BST (UK) »
Having checked the burials there are three Henry Riders my Henry had no issue his father was John and his nephew was Henry who was still alive after 1760,s
Still a mystery
SydR

Offline pinefamily

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Re: Will and Death date variations
« Reply #11 on: Saturday 12 May 18 01:48 BST (UK) »
When was the nephew born? Could some of the dates refer to him instead? That would explain the burial date.
I am Australian, from all the lands I come (my ancestors, at least!)

Pine/Pyne, Dowdeswell, Kempster, Sando/Sandoe/Sandow, Nancarrow, Hounslow, Youatt, Richardson, Jarmyn, Oxlade, Coad, Kelsey, Crampton, Lindner, Pittaway, and too many others to name.
Devon, Dorset, Gloucs, Cornwall, Warwickshire, Bucks, Oxfordshire, Wilts, Germany, Sweden, and of course London, to name a few.

Offline Jomot

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Re: Will and Death date variations
« Reply #12 on: Saturday 12 May 18 02:20 BST (UK) »
Familysearch has the burial transcribed under both dates, so there's clearly some confusion:

http://www.rootschat.com/links/01m1s/

Although the 1745 one says there is a linked image, I can't view it.   

Unfortunately without seeing the original register it's difficult to advise, but I have seen some registers where two or more years are on the same page but it's only evident by the repetition of the months, ie the page starts with 1745 but the months clearly roll round twice - the first being 1745 and the 2nd being 1746, although as has been said, the dates don't work either way.

The only other suggestion is that the parish register was written up after the event from other records and was simply written in wrongly.
MORGAN: Glamorgan, Durham, Ohio. DAVIS/DAVIES/DAVID: Glamorgan, Ohio.  GIBSON: Leicestershire, Durham, North Yorkshire.  RAIN/RAINE: Cumberland.  TAYLOR: North Yorks. BOURDAS: North Yorks. JEFFREYS: Worcestershire & Northumberland. FORBES: Berwickshire, CHEESMOND: Durham/Northumberland. WINTER: Durham/Northumberland. SNOWBALL: Durham.


Offline ~buttons~

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Re: Will and Death date variations
« Reply #13 on: Saturday 12 May 18 02:49 BST (UK) »
original

Offline horselydown86

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Re: Will and Death date variations
« Reply #14 on: Saturday 12 May 18 05:31 BST (UK) »
I am still somewhat confused with the dates even when allowing for a couple of months variation in calendars does not cover 11 month variation from death to will signing if dates were correct?

Thanks to ozigal, we can now be sure that the date of burial is 9 March 1745 Old Style = 9 March 1746 New Style.

This is not an 11 month variation.  It is 2 months and 5 days before the stated date of the writing of the will, and 4 months and six days before the stated date of probate.

The next thing to do is for you to post similar clips of any dates relating to the will and probate.

So, the date written out in full in the will text, the date in the probate clause (especially these two), the date on the jacket and the date of any depositions or memoranda of personal appearances (if applicable).

ADDED:

Henry Rider was buried 4 months and two days after his marriage,

Online arthurk

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Re: Will and Death date variations
« Reply #15 on: Saturday 12 May 18 11:49 BST (UK) »
I'm not familiar with Essex records, but the clip above looks like it might be from a register that was written up neatly at one sitting, some time after the event (the inserted Felsted entry notwithstanding). Are there any BTs, or alternative copies of the register, which might confirm the date given here?

Going back to the will, do you have any other examples of Henry Rider's signature or mark that you could compare the one on the will with? And who were the executors, and who benefited from the will? I'm just wondering - if the dates are all as you've given, could this have been some kind of fraud whereby someone impersonated Henry and wrote a will in his name after he had died, in order to get hold of some of his property? Or am I getting carried away?
Researching among others:
Bartle, Bilton, Bingley, Campbell, Craven, Emmott, Harcourt, Hirst, Kellet(t), Kennedy,
Meaburn, Mennile/Meynell, Metcalf(e), Palliser, Robinson, Rutter, Shipley, Stow, Wilkinson

Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline ~buttons~

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Re: Will and Death date variations
« Reply #16 on: Saturday 12 May 18 12:39 BST (UK) »
Marriage Licence for Henry Rider (age 45) of Harlow & Judith Canham (age 40) widow was dated 9th December 1745.

Henry's original signature is also on his will dated 14 May 1746.

1st signature is from their Marriage Licence in DECEMBER 1745
2nd signature from Henry Rider's will dated MAY 1746


Online arthurk

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Re: Will and Death date variations
« Reply #17 on: Saturday 12 May 18 13:11 BST (UK) »
Thanks for posting those. 'Rider' is very similar, but 'Henry' rather different. But because of the similarities in 'Rider', I'm inclined to think they are by the same person.

Anything striking in the contents of the will?
Researching among others:
Bartle, Bilton, Bingley, Campbell, Craven, Emmott, Harcourt, Hirst, Kellet(t), Kennedy,
Meaburn, Mennile/Meynell, Metcalf(e), Palliser, Robinson, Rutter, Shipley, Stow, Wilkinson

Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk