Mary Ann Varrell born c1808

[CelticMom]

As I noted above, she appears not to have a mmn listed on the GRO register for her birth. This usually indicates llegitimacy

Thanks, yeah I did see that, what I mean is that I didn't think maiden names appear on the gro index for that early?

[CelticMom]

oh yes I forgot you can now search on the gro official website and see a little more info than before. Thanks. I see what you mean now, so the baptism I have found of a Martha Pullen Nelson in 1852 to George Nelson and Martha ? possibly not the same, although it's not seeing any other births in that area for the Martha Pullen Nelson. So one would assume the 1852 birth must be the same Martha but then why would no maiden name be on the Gro Index?

Might need to order the birth cert for more clues.

On the baptism of Martha Pullen Nelson in 1852, George (a carman) and Martha where living on wells street in Marylebone.

[CelticMom]

So I've found someone who is a descendant of William Augustus Varrell and Sarah Langley, but we don't have any DNA match on Ancestry which is odd right?

It definitely looks like I have the right family as too many coincidences and it all seems to tie in.

He is a descendant of William and Sarah's son - James Thomas Varrell.

[CelticMom]

Hi
Here they are 1861 Gillingham 2 Layfields
William Varrall  80 retired fisherman Chatham
Sarah 78 Chatham
Elizabeth daughter 53 Gillingham

Death William Ausgustus Varrall Mar 1863 Medway.
So marriage at Hoo 20.5.1798 to Sarah Langly.

1841 also at Gillingham Gadshill
William 62 fisherman y
Sarah 60 y
Elizabeth 39 y
Martha Nelson 37 y
Elizabeth Barnard 3 y

There is a baptism at Chatham
Martha Varrall d of William and Sarah 18.1.1804 .
It looks like Martha was Mary Ann'solder sister.
She is  married on the 1851 census with the Michelins.

Other children Ann at Gillingham 15.9.1805 ,Anne 13.1.1813 at Gillingham and James Thomas 9.7.1815 there ,-at Chatham Sarah Elizabeth 22.7.1798 ,William Giles 7.2.1800,Elizabeth 18.6.1804 Hannah 25.6.1817 ,Giles John 15.5.1819 at Chatham

William is in the merchant seaman records for 1845 born 1778 from Chatham and on the same page is John Giles Varrall presumably his son.

Ciderdrinker

Hi there

can I ask which site you got all the baptism records from? Were there images? As I may need to subscribe and get those. I have ancestry, but don't see them on there.

Thanks

[Mabel Bagshawe]

oh yes I forgot you can now search on the gro official website and see a little more info than before. Thanks. I see what you mean now, so the baptism I have found of a Martha Pullen Nelson in 1852 to George Nelson and Martha ? possibly not the same, although it's not seeing any other births in that area for the Martha Pullen Nelson. So one would assume the 1852 birth must be the same Martha but then why would no maiden name be on the Gro Index?

Might need to order the birth cert for more clues.

On the baptism of Martha Pullen Nelson in 1852, George (a carman) and Martha where living on wells street in Marylebone.

Martha Pullen Nelson's dob is given as 27 August 1852. The Martha on GRO with no mother's maiden name is not registered until Oct-Dec 1852

Also can't see a marriage between a George Nelson and a Martha in the area around that time!

[CelticMom]

I think the fact they are both born in Marylebone with mother Martha makes it too much of a coincidence though. I've definitely seen births registered a little while after the birth too, so it's not totally out of the norm.

I may order the birth cert to see what it states. But sticking to my direct line for now.

I have found Lewis Philip Michelin birth was registered in 1837 in Medway Kent, didn't spot that before, he was baptized and buried in London. So that may well connect Mary Ann again to William and Sarah. I'm going to order the birth cert, to see what address comes up, perhaps Mary Ann was visiting her parents and went into labour.

Still, find it odd that there was no DNA match to the other descendant of William and Sarah I have made contact with, but I'm pretty certain I have the right family now.

Also, can any fresh pair of eyes help me with Emma Sarah Michelin, she is the only one I can't find what happened to. There doesn't appear to be any death record, I have tried numerous variations and I can't find a marriage.

You have all done amazing with cracking this for me so far, I am really thankful.

[ciderdrinker]

Hello
Sorry to not get back to you earlier.I'm not on line at home and the Library was closed over the holiday.
The marriage for Martha is on Ancestry.
I got the baptisms of FindMyPast but they are also on Ancestry.Neither have images for them only the transcription.So there is no point in subscribing to FindMyPast.
There are fuller transcriptions for Chatham and Gillingham at Freereg.
I believe Ancestry are to get some Kent parish records soon so  better to hang on for those.

Ciderdrinker

[CelticMom]

Hello
Sorry to not get back to you earlier.I'm not on line at home and the Library was closed over the holiday.
The marriage for Martha is on Ancestry.
I got the baptisms of FindMyPast but they are also on Ancestry.Neither have images for them only the transcription.So there is no point in subscribing to FindMyPast.
There are fuller transcriptions for Chatham and Gillingham at Freereg.
I believe Ancestry are to get some Kent parish records soon so  better to hang on for those.

Ciderdrinker

Thank you, I will wait for now then. I was going to subscribe to find my past  for the 1939 register, but that is now on ancestry too.

[ciderdrinker]

Hello me again
i did spot a baptism for William Augustus Varrall on Freereg
William Augusta Varrall s of Giles Dartnell and Hannah Varrall at Chatham st Mary the Virgin 13 Dec 1778.
Siblings all at the same church.
Giles 18 April/14 May 1766 ,Sarah 6.1.1769,Chadderton 11.11.1770,Ann 2.5.1773,John 24.9.1775,Thomas 3.3.1782-16 June 1782.

Giles Darknell Varrall s of John and Elizabeth bapt 11.4.1736 .(Other children on Freereg ,he seems to be their eldest).He marries Hannah Nicholson 4.9.1764 .Signs with a cross.Wit Emanl and Ann Mills

Burial for Giles age 80 9.2.1814 Chatham and Hannah 19.7.1813 age 72.

It looks like John Varrall married Elizabeth at the Fleet prison in London .
John Varrall of St Nicholas Rochester fisherman and Elizabeth Rancefull 18.11.1732.
that image is on Ancestry.

It looks like John comes from Strood John sof John an Marcy 22.3.1707/8.
Their second child called John.Again you can see the rest on Freereg

John Virrall married Marcy Durtnell at Sevenoaks 3.7.1700 (that from FindMyPast but only an index/transcription).
Possible first marriage at Strood to Debra Smith 23.1.1692/3 from Freereg.

I hopes that helps.Sorry i couldn't find the images for you.

Ciderdrinker