Looking for Isabella Nina Preston Thomson's biological father

[KimberlyAnnLambert]

My Great grandmother Isabella Nina Preston Thomson was born to Nina Eliza Thomson on 10 FEB 1880 at 95 Flood Street, South Chelsea, Middlesex, England. There is question as to her father for various reasons. Through DNA I have deduced that Isabella's father is likely the son of Stephen BALDWIN born 9 DEC 1804 at Plaxtol, Kent, England (can find certainty of this man's wife Sarah). The three likely possibilities are James (b. ABT. APR 1840 • Ightham, Kent, England), Stephen (b. JANUARY 1842 • Malling, Kent, England) or George (b. 4 JAN 1847 • Ightham, Kent, England).
How can I find my 2nd great-grandfather?

[CaroleW]

Being realistic - you can't.

No fathers name on her birth cert so everything is guesswork unless she named a father on her marriage cert.  Even then - many illegitimate children made up a fathers name when they married so as to appear "respectable"

All 3 possibilities are dead so unless you research all 3 until you find living relatives and check their DNA - I can't see any way of proving paternity.

Did Nina Elizabeth originate from Chelsea as I notice the Baldwin brothers were born Kent.  have you found any one of them in Chelsea at the time of the childs conception/birth

[Rosinish]

Just wondering what leads you to think the Baldwin name is possible?

Have you found where the name Preston came from or could there be a clue in that?

I know many illegitimate children seem to inherit their paternal father's name/surname as a middle name?

Do you also know where the names Isabella & Nina came from, family names possibly or maybe the paternal g/mother?

Annie

[suzard]

My Great grandmother Isabella Nina Preston Thomson was born to Nina Eliza Thomson on 10 FEB 1880 at 95 Flood Street, South Chelsea, Middlesex, England. There is question as to her father for various reasons. Through DNA I have deduced that Isabella's father is likely the son of Stephen BALDWIN born 9 DEC 1804 at Plaxtol, Kent, England (can find certainty of this man's wife Sarah). The three likely possibilities are James (b. ABT. APR 1840 • Ightham, Kent, England), Stephen (b. JANUARY 1842 • Malling, Kent, England) or George (b. 4 JAN 1847 • Ightham, Kent, England).
How can I find my 2nd great-grandfather?

I cannot find a birth reg for Isabella Nina Preston Thomson 1880

there is a birth reg for Isabella Nina Preston registered Mar qtr 1880 Chelsea 1a 335 -so this would fit with a birth 10 Feb 1880

there is a marriage of (who seems to be her mother)
5 Oct 1863 St Judes Upper Chelsea
Thomas Henry Preston 21 Bachelor decorator Sloane St father Henry Preston deceased
Nina Eliza Thomson 17 spinster Sloane St father William Thomson occ Decorator
Witnesses Alfred George Thomson Fanny Notting? Jane Broadler?
all signed

1881
Flood St Chelsea
Nina E Preston Head widow 34 Mantle Maker
Lousa Preston daughter 6 scholar
Isabella Preston daughter 1
all b Chelsea
RG11 77 51 23

so why do you think Mr Baldwin was the father?

Suz

[philipsearching]

My opinion (only an opinion - not proof of anything!) is that DNA can suggest a relationship, but cannot say with certainty the nature of the relationship - only put a percentage on probabilities.

Therefore, I would believe that Isabella Nina PRESTON born 1880 (whose mmn was THOMSON) and the birth, parents' marriage and census data found by suzard are correct.

Philip

[CaroleW]

so why do you think Mr Baldwin was the father?

Was she born more than 9mths after Thomas Preston died?   

Big gap between 1863 and birth of Louisa in 1874/5

[philipsearching]

Was she born more than 9mths after Thomas Preston died?   

Big gap between 1863 and birth of Louisa in 1874/5

(AMENDED)

If the age of 21 for Thomas when he married in 1863 is correct, I have found only two possible deaths in London, Middlesex and Surrey in or before 1881:
Sep qtr 1877 St Geo Hanover Square vol 1a p222 age 35
Jun qtr 1880 Hackney vol 1b p295 age 38

GRO has:
Birth - PRESTON John George, Mar qtr 1879 Chelsea vol 1a p316 mmn THOMSON
Death - PRESTON John George, age 0, Mar qtr 1879 Chelsea vol 1a p242
Birth - PRESTON Isabella Nina, Mar qtr 1880 Chelsea vol 1a 335 mmn THOMSON

I checked on the GRO for PRESTON mmn THOMSON births from 1863 to 1878 but couldn't spot any.  Odd! The gap between the 1863 marriage and the first birth is starting to look a little strange!  And who was Louisa (on the 1881 census)?

A search on the GRO for Louisa PRESTON born c1875 brought up two results:
PRESTON Louisa Dec qtr 1874 Kensington vol 1a p124 mmn POWER
PRESTON Louisa Jane Mar qtr 1875 Islington vol 1b p315 mmn BRIGHT
and for Louisa THOMSON or THOMPSON:
THOMSON Louisa Mary Dec qtr 1874 St Geo Han Sq vol 1a p337 mmn FULLER
THOMSON Louisa Elizabeth Woods Mar qtr 1875 St Geo Han Sq vol 1a p385 mmn THOMPSON
THOMSON Louisa Mary Sep qtr 1875 Chelsea vol 1a p287 mmn McCORMACK

It would be interesting to know where Thomas and Nina were on the 1871 census - and if they were together.


Philip

[suzard]

It seems Nina Eliza and Thomas Henry were not together in 1871

1871
Flood St Chelsea
Nina E Preston Hed Married 34 Mantle Maker
Louisa Preston daughter 6 scholar
Isabella Preston daughter 1
all b Chelsea
RG11 77 51 23

and possibly this is Thomas Henry
1871
44 Leete? St Chelsea
Henry Marsh head W 54 tailor Wetminster
Thomas Preston nephew married 26 decorator Poole Dorset
Rosina Gibson?Webster?( difficult to read) Lodger U 22 dressmaker
RG10 89 86 21

Possibly thomas Henry in 1861 (pre marriage)
Henry Marsh Head M 44 Tailor Middlesex
Mary marsh wife 42 Poole Dorset
Thomas Henry Preton U nephew 18 Writer and Grainer Poole Dorset
RG9 38 37 14

I will try to follow this line back

There is a tree on A******y which has Thomas Henry Preston 's death as Sept 1877 - possibly the poster had the death certificate as informant was Henry Marsh and cause of death was cirrhosis

Suz

[avm228]

Regarding Louisa, there is this baptism entry (all struck through, but legible):

St Luke, Chelsea

15 July 1883

Louisa Elizabeth, born 29 Dec 1874, daughter of Unknown and Nina Preston, spinster.

Abode: Argyll Home for Orphans, Manor St.