Author Topic: Will of Richard Aylmer 1514  (Read 5335 times)

Offline Bookbox

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Re: Will of Richard Aylmer 1514
« Reply #18 on: Friday 12 October 18 17:00 BST (UK) »
Keep posting them all in pairs as you have been doing and one of us will scan them, until we find something worth transcribing.

Just interposing briefly to second that good advice.

Online goldie61

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Re: Will of Richard Aylmer 1514
« Reply #19 on: Friday 12 October 18 21:13 BST (UK) »
Willow, I have just scanned though Snippets 5 and 6.  It is all standard stuff - bequests for his soul, his wife's soul, the hospitals, the prisoners, the ankers and ankereses etc.

There's nothing of genealogical interest there and nothing new either.

Might we just bypass these snippets until he reaches something of interest?

Keep posting them all in pairs as you have been doing and one of us will scan them, until we find something worth transcribing.

I'd thought the same thing HD.
Glad you actually posted it! :)
Lane, Burgess: Cheshire. Finney, Rogers, Gilman:Derbys
Cochran, Nicol, Paton, Bruce:Scotland. Bertolle:London
Bainbridge, Christman, Jeffs: Staffs

Offline WillowG

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Re: Will of Richard Aylmer 1514
« Reply #20 on: Friday 12 October 18 21:57 BST (UK) »
John Castelyn, of Framlyngham Castell, Suff

Framlingham Castle in Suffolk
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Framlingham_Castle

Framlingham Castle was where Queen Mary I Tudor stayed and collected her forces before successfully marching on London when John, Duke of Northumberland, had given her crown to Lady Jane Grey, the Nine Days' Queen :)

Framlingham Castle has an almost equal claim to fame in that it features in Ed Sheeran's music video Castle on the Hill :)

(Going completely off topic now!)
Framlingham Castle is a lovely place to visit, and another of its claims to fame is that my son went down on one knee and proposed marriage to my daughter in law there :D
I'm familiar with many of the Suffolk places mentioned in this thread, having lived there for 30 years.  Summer visits are highly recommended; winter ................. not so much :-X

Carol

That is so lovely, Carol, I am so glad you decided to share! :)

I would love to go visit it myself!

Offline WillowG

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Re: Will of Richard Aylmer 1514
« Reply #21 on: Friday 12 October 18 22:12 BST (UK) »
Willow, I have just scanned though Snippets 5 and 6.  It is all standard stuff - bequests for his soul, his wife's soul, the hospitals, the prisoners, the ankers and ankereses etc.

There's nothing of genealogical interest there and nothing new either.

These early sixteenth century guys can go on in this vein for pages.

My situation is that I'm exhausted after a huge crisis day at my day job and will probably have another similar day tomorrow.

Might we just bypass these snippets until he reaches something of interest?

Keep posting them all in pairs as you have been doing and one of us will scan them, until we find something worth transcribing.

Of course! I am so sorry about the exhausting work day.

You meant two in a pair at a time, right, like this? Let me know if you want me to post it all at once (I have them prepared) instead, divided into two more posts.

Keep posting them all in pairs as you have been doing and one of us will scan them, until we find something worth transcribing.

Just interposing briefly to second that good advice.

Willow, I have just scanned though Snippets 5 and 6.  It is all standard stuff - bequests for his soul, his wife's soul, the hospitals, the prisoners, the ankers and ankereses etc.

There's nothing of genealogical interest there and nothing new either.

Might we just bypass these snippets until he reaches something of interest?

Keep posting them all in pairs as you have been doing and one of us will scan them, until we find something worth transcribing.

I'd thought the same thing HD.
Glad you actually posted it! :)


Of course I can do that! *hugs* I thought the writing here was exceptionally painful myself!

Just let me know when you want me to post the next part! (After this there is only four snippets left, thank goodness, one of which is the probate, which I think we'll also go over with a cat's paw in this instance, as the quality is abysmal.)

I agree, let's just extract what we can from this and move on!

So sorry about your day, HD. I so very much hope that in spite of it not appearing so right now that tomorrow will be better.


Online goldie61

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Re: Will of Richard Aylmer 1514
« Reply #22 on: Saturday 13 October 18 01:21 BST (UK) »
More prayers for their souls Willow........

line 5 Snippett 7

Also I bequeth my wyff my place that I dwell in with the rents that long therto for terme of her lyff  And
half a yere after And than to remayne to Elyne my doughter she to have it when she com(m)yth to mariage


Snippet 8
in fee symple after the decease of her mother/ Also yf she decease/ than to remayne to Elisabeth my doughter/ And
yf she decease than to remayne to margaret my doughter/ Also I gyve my wyff my two closes with the syke  mens
houses and iij Acres of Lande withoute seynt Gyles yates terme of her lyff And after her decease to remayne to
Elisabeth my doughter in ffe symple to gyve and sell/ And yf the said Elisabeth decease or her mother(?) or come not
to mariage /than I will that margaret my doughter have the said Closes with the sykemens houses and the said
iij Acres to her and to her heires for evermore/ Also I bequeth Elyn my doughter v score markes when she is maried


Well, it looks like 'the sick mens houses'................  :)
Lane, Burgess: Cheshire. Finney, Rogers, Gilman:Derbys
Cochran, Nicol, Paton, Bruce:Scotland. Bertolle:London
Bainbridge, Christman, Jeffs: Staffs

Offline WillowG

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Re: Will of Richard Aylmer 1514
« Reply #23 on: Saturday 13 October 18 20:38 BST (UK) »
Well done, Goldie!!! :) :D :) This is practically a miracle! Thank you so much! :) :-* :)

More prayers for their souls Willow........

These early sixteenth century guys can go on in this vein for pages.

They were more concerned for their souls than our eyesight, that's for sure ... ;D

I am so sorry for inflicting this horrid handwriting on us all!

More prayers for their souls Willow........

line 5 Snippett 7

Also I bequeth my wyff my place that I dwell in with the rents that long therto for terme of her lyff  And
half a yere after And than to remayne to Elyne my doughter she to have it when she com(m)yth to mariage


Snippet 8
in fee symple after the decease of her mother/ Also yf she decease/ than to remayne to Elisabeth my doughter/ And
yf she decease than to remayne to margaret my doughter/ Also I gyve my wyff my two closes with the syke  mens
houses and iij Acres of Lande withoute seynt Gyles yates terme of her lyff And after her decease to remayne to
Elisabeth my doughter in ffe symple to gyve and sell/ And yf the said Elisabeth decease or her mother(?) or come not
to mariage /than I will that margaret my doughter have the said Closes with the sykemens houses and the said
iij Acres to her and to her heires for evermore/ Also I bequeth Elyn my doughter v score markes when she is maried


Well, it looks like 'the sick mens houses'................  :)

!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Three out of six daughters so far! :) (Does quick head math based on the effigy 4 - 2 + 4 = 6. Six daughters and 2 sons in all)

Counts on fingers: Elyne, Elisabeth (after his mother and sister?) and Margaret :)

When I saw the name Elyne I was reminded of the whole Elyse/Olyve thing and my whole life flashed before my eyes ;D But Elyne or Elyn would be what we today would have written as Elaine, right?

On the other hand, based on the effigy 

having the effigies of a mayor in his robes, between his two wives; by the first wife are the effigies of her children, two boys and two girls; and by the second four girls; it being placed here in memory of Richard Aylmer, mayor in 1511, son of Robert Aylmer, who was mayor in 1481, and 1492, and Joan his first wife; he died in 1512.

shouldn't he have two wives? I have been paying careful attention, and he only makes reference to one, my wife's, not my wives's, and furthermore, said wife appears to be alive, not to have predeceased him ...

On the other hand, if he did have two wives, and does not mention the first one who predeceased him, that strengthens the supposition that Roger Aylmer too had a first wife that he does not makes referral to in his will ... Not a sentimental bunch, this lot.

'Sick mens houses'!!! Of course these people have sick men's houses on their property  ::)

and iij Acres of Lande withoute seynt Gyles yates

I remembered the land outside of Saint Giles' gates from somewhere and look and behold:

From his brother Thomas's will:

my Land with ought seint Gyles yates** be sold be myn executo(u)rs and the money y(er)of*** cum(m)yng be disposid in p(er)formannce of this my testament and last


=====

** without St Giles’ gates (?)
*** thereof

I remember thinking at the time that it was folly to sell prime real estate (I mean, right outside of St. Giles gates like that? Location, location, location), and clearly brother Richard, his executor, agreed :) Of course, he could have sold it to himself.

In the same snippet I also find:

the seke mens houses with the gret close therto p(er)tenyng at west Wyk gate

The sick men's houses again! :)

However, if you look at the full quote:

It(e)m I gefe to John Aylemer my nevy [nephew] the seke mens houses with the gret close therto p(er)teynyng at west Wyk gate to hold to the said John his heir(es) and his assignes for ev(er) more whan he com(m)yth to thage of xxj yer(e)

This precise, specific piece of land was left John Aylmer and his heirs and assignes forever by Thomas Aylmer, his uncle in 1500. Now, in 1509, Richard Aylmer is in possession of it, and leaving it to someone else entirely, his wife, and then his daughter Elizabeth.

A reasonable assumption to make is then that the nephew of Thomas Aylmer, John Aylmer, has passed away by this time.

Since Richard Aylmer is in possession of said land, it is possible that he was John's heir. It is also possible that he was the boy's father. But if John were the illegitimate son of the sister not mentioned in the father's will, Richard could still have a strong claim to the child's inheritance as his uncle ...

We'll see :)

Thank you so much again, Goldie! You have performed an absolute miracle here! :) :D :)

Online goldie61

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Re: Will of Richard Aylmer 1514
« Reply #24 on: Saturday 13 October 18 23:23 BST (UK) »
Snippet 9

or elles at the age of xviij yeres/ Also I bequeath to Elisabeth my doughter v score markes * good and lawfull money of
England when she is maried or when she com(m)yth to the age of xviij yeres/ Item I bequeth to margaret my doughter v score
markes of lawfull money when she is maried or elles when she com(m)yth to the age of xviij yeres / And if any of my doughters
decease or they co(m)me to mariage or to xviij yeres of age I will that the other Sisters lyvyng [   ] then the
seid C marke/ and yf it fortune that two of my doughters decease or they co(m)me to mariage or to the age of xviij yeres
than I will that my doughter that lyveth to mariage or to the age of xviij yeres shalhave no more but CC markes / And yf


* the scribe has missed out the word 'of' here.

Snippet 10

it fortune that all my doughters decease or they com(m)e to mariage or to xviij yere of age/ than I will that it be disposed
for my soule and their soules my frendes soules and Cristen soules / Also I bequeath Elyn my wyff in money and silver
plate and wares to the so(m)me of vj C markes / Also I bequeth my wyff all my stuff of housold / Also I beuqeth ev(er)y sevant
in my house xiij s iiijd Item I lefe? my necys xs/ Item I bequeth to Anngt*(?) my maide xs/ Item I bequeth feyth(?)
my maide xs / Item I bequeth my mother in law a black gowne  and a golde ryng to the value of xs And myn
own mother in lyke mind / Also I will myn Executors receve my dettes and paye my dettes/ Also I requyer my


* there's a contraction mark over the end of this - but I've no idea what it might mean!

The writing itself is not so terrible Willow, apart from the fact is it very tiny. It looks to me he might have had an old pen with an unsharp nib, and so the letters become all blotchy and it's hard to see the formation of the letter shapes. Some squiggle could be 'minie', or 'nimei' or any other permutation of those little letters! I know there's a particular term for 'little up and down strokes', but can't remember what it is.
Perhaps he couldn't afford a new quill!  :)
Lane, Burgess: Cheshire. Finney, Rogers, Gilman:Derbys
Cochran, Nicol, Paton, Bruce:Scotland. Bertolle:London
Bainbridge, Christman, Jeffs: Staffs

Offline Bookbox

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Re: Will of Richard Aylmer 1514
« Reply #25 on: Sunday 14 October 18 00:04 BST (UK) »
the other Sisters lyvyng [   ] then the
seid C marke/

Suggestion (snippet #9) ...

... the other Susters lyvyng shalhave betwyxt them the
seid C marks





Online goldie61

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Re: Will of Richard Aylmer 1514
« Reply #26 on: Sunday 14 October 18 00:14 BST (UK) »
Well I thought I'd written 'shalhave', but it obviously didn't come through in my post.  ??? (I usually take off the snippets, do the transcribing on a Word doc, then post it back again. Saves having to try and move between several pages on the post, and scrolling backwards and forwards on the posted images. Anyway, I've found that works best for me. Not an excuse for missing the word.)
But I would never have got 'betwixt' Bookbox! well done. Makes sense.
I can see it now (of course!)  :)
Lane, Burgess: Cheshire. Finney, Rogers, Gilman:Derbys
Cochran, Nicol, Paton, Bruce:Scotland. Bertolle:London
Bainbridge, Christman, Jeffs: Staffs