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Ireland (Historical Counties) => Ireland => Armagh => Topic started by: AngelaCharteris on Tuesday 19 September 06 16:21 BST (UK)
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Hi, I am looking for any information regarding the birth records of my great grand father "HENRY VANE CHARTERIS" or his wife Annie Moore. He was born 1858/59 New Brompton, Chatham, Kent, England. She was born 26th Feb 1862 in Armagh to Charles Moore & "Anne". They married 14th Feb 1882 at St Marks, Co Armagh, Armagh, Ireland.
I have since found out that where Henry was born, is a Naval/Marine/Army base now known as Gillingham. I have been searching for over 10 years for any information on his birth/parents/siblings with no success. I have his complete Military history records from enlistment to when he left the military service but they don't say who his parents are. I cannot find his birth records anywhere, despite extensive seaches. Can anyone help me please???
He married Annie Moore who was from Armagh, Ireland. I have searched the Medway records, 1837online, St Catherines house index with no success.
I have enclosed 2 photographs of them as well as a family photo taken just befor they imigrated to Western Australia abt 1908/1909. I hope someone can help me.
Thank you so much, Angela Charteris
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Can anybody help Angela locate or guide her on how to obtain a marriage certificate for (according to the army records) Henry CHARTERIS and Annie MOORE married 14 Feb 1882 St Marks, Armagh ???
Casalguidi
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Hi Angela. don't know if this is of any help to you.
Armagh 1852
Ann Moore Groces English St.
James Moore wine & spirit dealer Market St.
A, Moore publican Barrack St.
Robert Moore hosier Scotch St.
Anthony
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Anthony, thank you so much for taking the time to come in & help me. It is so much appreciated. Thanks Angela
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Can anybody help Angela locate or guide her on how to obtain a marriage certificate for (according to the army records) Henry CHARTERIS and Annie MOORE married 14 Feb 1882 St Marks, Armagh ???
Casalguidi
Hi Angela,
I found your couple's marriage entry--indeed, they were married on 14th Feb 1882--here's information:
Henry Vane Chartris married to Annie Moore in Armargh Church of Ireland in the parish of Armagh in Armagh, Co Armagh, Ireland.
You can apply to the Irish GRO for a photocopy of their marriage entry using this information for only 6 euros. When you get their entry, it will tell you who their fathers are.
Then you can trace their birth entries.
Kind regards,
Tees
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Hi Angela,
The birth year you have on your Annie Moore is before the Birth Registration started in Ireland. Registration was only started in 1864.
I would advise you to get this couple's marriage entry first in order to find out their fathers. From the Irish GRO.
You can look up in the England & Wales GRO indexes on your Henry Vane Chartris and any varients on the surname as you can get his birth entry.
I can only find a Annie Murray with the father of Charles but no Annie as a mother but it was in 1868. In Co Armagh.
Good luck,
Tees
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Hi Tees, I have about all but given up on finding any records of my great grand fathers birth records :'( I have tried to apply for thier marriage certificate several times but am having a hard time every time I ring Ireland to find out who I actually apply for the certificate too. Any advise on what to do next??? Thanks for the help, Angela Charteris
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Hi Angela,
I do empathise with you and your frustration in finding your Irish ancestors in the records. You are not the only one who have this problem. ;D
Let's start with getting you the marriage certificate--You have two options--1) Applying to the Irish GRO by post and request a photocopy of the entry for only 6 euros (this will be about 3 to 4 weeks' wait OR 2) Applying to the Northern Irish GRO by post or online and get a certified copy for a bit over 10 pounds and you will get it in the post within 10 days from the receipt of the payment. If you want this method, I would recommend that you get a reference number then it will only cost you 5 or 6 pounds.
I would go with the option#1 as you only need a photocopy unless you need a certified one for the governmental purpose.
Here are two websites where you can get the marriage certificate from:
1) http://www.groireland.ie/ (Ireland)
2) http://www.groni.gov.uk/ (Northern Ireland)
Use the exact information I gave you on the marriage. They will have no trouble in locating it for you.
Kind regards,
Tees
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Hi again,
I will do a bit of sleuthing on your Henry Charteris's birth record. I think the problem is with the surname's spelling which you could not find him.
Give me a bit of time in finding him.
By the way, are you very certain that he was born in England?
Kind regards,
Tees
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Hi Angela,
Would you prefer a transcription of the marriage entry instead?
Let me know if you are interested.
Kind regards,
Tees
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Tees. I have his complete war records & it definately states his name as CHARTERIS & where he was born: NEW BROMPTON, CHATHAM, KENT, ENGLAND.
I know it is called Gillingham now (New Brompton)
What would a transcription give me that the others dont? I got all the information about him from his war records. My private email is
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Thanks so much for your help & yes, it is very frustrating lol. Angela
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Hi Angela,
I have seen four entries on Familysearch.org--they stated that he was born in 1857 in the same place you mentioned. He had one more middle name of Francis!
His wife was the same one you stated.
I could not find him in the Birth Indexes either.
I think he may be registered under the different name unknown to us.
I would contact the churches in Kent area--the one that served the area your g grandfather stated that it was his birthplace to see if they have any baptism record on him--hopefully, it will give his birth date.
I have a theory based on one of my relatives who served in the military--he went by four different names at four different times he served in the Army! He had good reasons for doing it. The only trouble is that when it was time for him to collect Army pension--he had to own up to it and told them four names and durations! He did get his pension without any trouble.
It may be the case with your g grandfather--he may had been using this name for some reasons unknown to us--perhaps he wants a better chance of getting good promotions? The result he likes it so much and kept this identity for the rest of his life?
Oh, as to the transcription, it is a quick way to get information if you want to have it in a hurry. For only 4 pounds and one service will transcribe the information you seek and E-mail it to you within 3 days or so.
I think your best bet would be waiting for the marriage entry as it will tell you who was his father then you can try and look for him in the 1850 Census--hopefully, with a wife and children. One of these children will give you an opportunity to obtain a birth record and find out who his parents really were. Then, with a bit of luck, you will find your g grandfather's birth record.
Kind regards,
Tees