RootsChat.Com

I’m not too sure where to put this but I found the following, article about belief in Miasma at the time of ‘The great stink’ in London and before the general public really understood what was causing the Cholera and typhoid outbreaks among others.

http://richardjohnbr.blogspot.co.uk/2010/11/disease-in-victorian-city-extended.html

We have quite a few ancestors in more than one line that were lost to these and smallpox, both in London and Wales and would like to understand more about how the dread of these diseases affected people, their beliefs, habits and attitudes to death in the face of so much of it.

I am hoping there is something that is not so much academic but more a historical novel, about London. Something like the Philip Roth book, ‘Nemesis’ where he describes the reality of how the dread of Polio affected a small town in the USA, something he actually experienced and remembered.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nemesis_(Philip_Roth_novel)

Are there any books on this that are London and or Welsh based, that anyone can recommend that are a genuinely good read, historically accurate and yet not too heavy going or morbid?

Does anyone know what entitled someone to be considered a Master and by what authority the terms of apprenticeship were upheld?

I have recently found apprenticeship documents for several ancestors that mastered a variety of trades including wooler-weaving, blacksmiths, tailors and boot/shoe makers.  Each document was almost identical in regard to terms and conditions.

The investitures seem to be legal documents and I wondered if it was something drawn up by a solicitor or some other body such as a Worshipful company? This is because of the horrific fact that fathers could impose this document upon their own sons if they were Masters in any particular art.
I also wondered how these terms were enforced and what the penalty of any breech was most likely to be.

Here is a word for word copy of an indenture for a 7 year apprenticeship. I have seen a few of these now for various trades, such as blacksmith and shoemaker. All of the terms and conditions are more or less identical.  The length of apprenticeship seems to be 7 years. The only difference seems to be how much has to be paid to a master.


This Indenture witnesseth that, ….(Name)….son of …(Name of father)…..of …(Address)… in the County of….. the sum of ten pounds being paid or secured to the Master, as the consideration for taking the said apprentice, doth put himself Apprentice to… (Name)… [Richard Lambert Rose] Citizen and MERCHANT TAYLOR of London, to learn his Art, and with him (after the manner of an Apprentice) to serve from the Date hereof until the full End and Term of ….seven…Years, from thence next following to be fully complete and ended; During which Term, the said Apprentice his said Master faithfully shall serve:

•   His Secrets keep;
•   His lawful Commandments everywhere gladly do.
•   He shall do no Damage to his said Master, nor see it to be done of others, but that he, to his Power, shall let, or forthwith give warning to his said Master of the same.
•   He shall not waste the goods of his said Master, nor lend them unlawfully to any.
•   He shall not commit fornication, nor contract matrimony within the said Term.
•   He shall not play at cards, dice, tables, or any other unlawful games, whereby his said Master may have any loss.
•   With his own goods or others, during the said term, without license from his said Master, he shall neither buy nor sell.
•   He shall not haunt taverns or play-houses, nor absent himself from his said Master’s service, day nor night, unlawfully;
•   but in all things, he said Apprentice, he shall behave himself towards his said Master, and all his during the said Term.

And the said Master, his said Apprentice in the same Art which he useth, by the best means that he can, shall teach and instruct, or cause to be taught and instructed, finding unto his said Apprentice, meat, drink, apparel, lodging and all other necessaries, according to the custom of the City of London, during the said Term. And for the true performance of all and every, the said Covenants and Agreements, either of the said Parties bind themselves unto the other by these Presents.

IN WITNESS whereof, the Parties above named to these Indentures interchangeably have put their Hands and Seals the …day..of ..month.. in the …number of years…Year of the Reign of our Sovereign Lady VICTORIA, of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland, Queen, and so forth and in the Year of Our Lord, One Thousand Eight Hundred and ….

Witness: The master’s signature and clerk’s signature.

Stamped and sealed.

Dear searchers,

We were surprised to find that an ancestor was listed as an in-patient at St Thomas’s Hospital in London on the 1911 census and this raised questions that have been difficult to answer.

On it, I learned for the first time that she’d had two more children than we knew about as both of them had lived and died in-between the census. Sadly, there are too many possible births on Freebmd to identify them.

Is it impossible to know how long was she a patient? Could it have been a short stay that coincided with the census? This seems unlikely as her husband has not listed her on his own census at their home address although they remain married and the next time we find them together is many years later where they are living with a son.

Then there is the matter of why she may have been in hospital at all, as the column for infirmity is not filled in for any of the patients. St Thomas’s wasn’t an asylum and there were plenty of those in London she could have gone to and so it seems her condition may have been physical but this is all unsatisfactory guessing.

Questions like these come up quite often for certain individuals and I wondered whether there is any method for searching between the censuses that is efficient. Thus far, and as a beginner, the amount of time to do random searches through all the possible documents is prohibitive.

Does anyone, does anyone here have an idea where I may begin to find the answers?

Thank you

Dear Posters,

Is there anyone here that can help me to find where my Great Uncle, Edgar John Evans was buried?

He was killed during the 118 day siege of Ladysmith on the 6th January 1900, either during the first attack of the storming attempt on Waggon Hill or later that same day as part of the reinforcement at Ceaser's camp Ridge.

He was 26 and a Private with the 2nd Battalion Gordon Highlanders.

There are quite a few links to memorial pages but so far, it seems that the only men listed on the pages,  are soldiers of rank. The lowest ranks are not named individually. All we can find so far is that he was one of 17 unnamed men killed along with two named Officers.

I think he may be buried at a place called Cemetery Hill. It would be so good to know with certainty, where he is and to have a photograph of the memorial, especially if it has his name on it.

Is there anyone here that can tell me where to find him or perhaps how?

Thank you