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Messages - Glen in Tinsel Kni

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19
Lincolnshire / Re: One man, two men or three different men?
« on: Saturday 18 May 24 18:30 BST (UK)  »
I have around 40 matches in total mostly on Ancestry who are descendants of the Cornelius and Harriet from the 1861.
Whilst they match me at anything up to 200cM they don't match any of my confirmed maternal relatives. I can now include the recent match on MH at 290cM who descends from Charles/Sidney into that group.  I've traced their kids forwards as best I can but there's still three  I haven't been able to follow completely;
Harriet  b1857
Mary Ann b1858
Henry aka Harry b1869. I think he's the army deserter reported in the Horncastle News in Nov 1888 but then I lose track of him altogether.  The family were involved with travelling shows so can be pretty transient at times, Cornelius snr is a regular in the papers usually being charged with being drunk or failing to quit licenced premises.  Many migrated to Lincoln in the 1880's  and my maternal family are largely in Lincoln from about 1830 and at Wragby earlier than that.  Both families had addresses on Hungate or Hungate Court but slightly different times.



A couple of days after this 280 cM match came up I had another match on MH taken by 'P' who on paper is my full maternal 1c but we only share 343cM, not enough for a full cousin match.  His nephew 'D' and grand nephew 'A' have also tested (matches to me at 319 and 280 respectively), as they are all MH tests I can see how much they share with each other;
P & D share 1537cM
P & A share 855cM
D & A share  3534cM
I would suggest that those amounts are all safely in the 'full' relative bracket so there's nothing dubious in their immediate family.  None of them have any matches within the Wesseldine group
P, D A and myself  only seem to have shared matches through one ancestor; my maternal grandmother and my feeling is my mother is therefore an NPE. My mother (the youngest of 9), was born in 1924 in Lincoln.

I hadn't found the Cockerill/Dobbs marriage so that's a bonus.

20
Lincolnshire / One man, two men or three different men?
« on: Saturday 18 May 24 11:19 BST (UK)  »
I've had yet another mystery dna match come up that links to a group of matches who are descendants of the same couple, this new match is on MH and the biggest so far at around 280cM, predicted as first cousin to my mother (who I now believe was an NPE birth).
The grandfather of the match is the problem, he uses two names during his life, Charles Dobbs and Sidney Ratcliffe, my match is in her 80's, made her tree private a few days ago though when public it didn't show her grandfather and she hasn't replied to messages.



There is no birth or baptism of a Charles Dobbs in 1879/80 or an 1881 census return that fits. He just appears out of nowhere in 1891 in Lincoln as a son of Christopher Dobbs and Sarah Ann Dobbs nee Wes(s)eldine (though they didn't marry until the late 1880's and Christopher died in 1892). Based on that 1891 census Charles Dobbs was born in 1880 at Horncastle in Lincs.

There is a birth cert, baptism and 1881 census for an illegitimate Cornelius Wes(s)eldine dob Feb 28th 1879 at Horncastle in Lincs, son of Sarah Ann We(s)seldine but nothing after that date. It's as if Cornelius vanishes and Charles then appears. By 1901 Charles Dobbs seems to change his name to Sidney/Sydney Ratcliffe as found on his marriage and military records, he continued to use the name for the remainder of his life.

It seems reasonable to assume Sidney/Charles are the same person but is he really the Cornelius Wes(s)eldine b1879?


As a side note Christopher died in 1892 but Sarah had children in the late 1890's naming him as the father.


21
Ancestral Family Tree DNA Testing / Re: Ancestry Compare DNA Communities
« on: Wednesday 15 May 24 14:24 BST (UK)  »
Limited value at best in my experience as it's based on where people are living (or claim to be), based on their profile information.  I have matches covering three generations of a family as far apart as Aberdeen, Kent and Cornwall, it's only by building their trees I know they are related and were all born in Sheffield from around 1950-2005. 
That's not to say it is entirely useless but it would take a lot of luck to find a family line with multiple testers who have adequate profile information, accurate trees and haven't moved far for many generations.

22
I have a twist in the tale with one dna match, they have an illegitimate ancestor and constantly change their tree to indicate different parents (and not names in any other trees either!), when I view him as a match he suddenly has 'no tree' and the message option is greyed out. If I do a member search for him he appears and there is his public tree linked to his profile. He had a shock when he visited my tree today though as there's the birth cert of his direct ancestor showing the mother and no father noted.

I sometimes wonder if he's tried to block me for some reason or if it's a deliberate ploy to throw me off as many other matches in the group chopped off chunks of their trees  which showed the link to the largest match of all. 


On the plus side a new low match quickly replied to confirm which side of his tree I match on so there's a new lead to follow,  it may not seem much but it saves wading through unconnected lines jut to reach a dead end. I wish more would just reply to the same request when I make it and take up the offer of help if they are unsure how to work out which parent is which.
   

23
Ancestral Family Tree DNA Testing / Re: Mystery Match - Pointers Please
« on: Monday 29 April 24 13:32 BST (UK)  »


I've got the problem of having no living relatives above me now.  My mum's line had died out, she was a single child to a single child but I have had DNA matches with older generations in that family.  My dad and his siblings are all passed now and I've got matches to his mothers families and his dad's mothers side but the direct male line is known on paper but not confirmed by DNA.  They were notorious for affairs so I'd like to sort that one out some how. ;D

Very much like my scenario, nobody from a generation above and my generation range from 57-79 years of age. I'm giving up on a lot of close relatives as they just copy from any old tree and ignore their dna results and the information in my tree and messages to them. I'm sure if I made a 2nd account and a fictitious tree showing a link to Cleopatra they would copy it and message me in a day bragging about the link. 

24
Ancestral Family Tree DNA Testing / Re: Mystery Match - Pointers Please
« on: Sunday 28 April 24 20:56 BST (UK)  »
One match can change everything, I have a batch of maternal matches that on paper are 1c1r and 1c2r , they all fit in the overlap range of half and full relatives but none match a mystery group of 40 linked matches I have. Out of the blue a result from a paper trail 1c appeared but the cM amount is nowhere near high enough for a 1c and is yet more evidence of a close NPE in my pedigree line. It's actually the 3rd NPE in my tree (now both parents and one grandparent now proved, a 2nd grandparent yet to be resolved).
 



25
The downside is that many fall for the marketing thinking they will get an instant tree so the pool of genuine researchers isn't as large as the test numbers indicate.
On top of that the  issue of the 'copy regardless' is ever present. I couldn't make it any clearer on my tree or through 3 acknowledged messages that my great grandmother though married fell pregnant to another man (hence a pile of matches on the Isle of Wight where the father finished up), but my closest matches just copy other trees based on a household in the 1891 and 1901 census so have the wrong ancestors. They may as well skip the dna test for all the notice they take of the results and just go with the majority of tree  just as they do anyway.

I think a further issue is that low response rates to messages just drives the research to working out links to matches further underground to the point where lone research is the default starting point and can remain the prefered method.

26
Ancestral Family Tree DNA Testing / Re: DNA Query
« on: Monday 25 March 24 14:44 GMT (UK)  »
I find the MyHeritage 'terms' a bit odd (i.e giving relationships to you parents rather than you in some cases)

Richard

The general opinion being that many people would have no idea what a 'removed' cousin is but understand parent's cousin. I too find it confusing describing my relationship to someone through a third party.  The default setting/assumption of a full relationship is also a huge drawback to those of us who primarily have half relatives, it's just another step in the initial check of any match having to manually select the half relative options whereas Ancestry throw them up just by clicking the shared cM value.
.

27
Ancestral Family Tree DNA Testing / Re: DNA Query
« on: Sunday 24 March 24 22:51 GMT (UK)  »
I find the MH relationship predictions to be all over the place. I have a maternal 1c, 1c1r and 1c2r (all descendants of one of my uncles), the predicted relationships  are 2c, 1c and 1c respectively.  Yep, the closest of all with the highest dna share is predicted as the most distant of the three.


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