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Messages - Sorleyboy

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Lancashire Lookup Requests / Re: William John Yates
« on: Wednesday 01 April 15 00:47 BST (UK)  »
CONTINUED from previous . . .

Robert's Marriage Cert. states that his father, John Yates [now deceased] was a 'Railway Official'. This runs counter to his occupation of Groom whilst living in Bury and perhaps Wootton, but does recall his occupation in earlier years when he was a Carter in Church Street, Atherton (1851 & 61) and later a Railway Carter whilst in Salford c.1866 - but perhaps hardly an 'Official' unless at some time in the late 1870's he worked at the station at Ulceby or thereabouts? . . . [it would be interesting to compare the entries on William John Yates marriage certificate]!

From the year 1901, two Wedding 'Compliments' cards survive: possibly distributed with pieces of Wedding Cake given to Frances Yates. One of the cards relates to the wedding of Arthur Cave (step-son of William John Yates) to Maud A Howitt, dated 14th October 1901.

Robert Yates and Eleanor at some time before the publication of 1904/5 Ward's Trade Directory had set up business in the corner shop at 22 Park Street, Darlington. . .  The family obviously kept in contact with William John Yates, now the proprietor of a butchery business, as a young Minnie Yates could remember. . .  "there would be basins of blood [In the abattoir]? at No.17 [sic] Trinity Street - you put your hands in to scoop out the nerves using your fingers" (pers com. Minnie Pearson, formerly Yates c. 1970's).

By 1911 Robert was stated in the Census as 'Traveller for Auction Marts': surviving receipts suggest cutlery & fancy goods etc may have been part of the stock. Eleanor is assisting in the (Grocers) business; Eleanor was probably running the shop, whilst Robert was on the road.

Perhaps before the Great War, William John Yates was for a time living with his twin brother at 22 Park Street. But on 28th April 1915 William died in Darlington, age 42 and is buried at West Cemetery, Plot P62 - 139.

Frances will probably have left Wootton after her sister Dinah’s death in 1918 to stay with her son Robert Yates, at 22 Park Street, Darlington.

Frances Yates died about a year later on 26th September 1919 in Darlington. She passed on Dinah West's sampler to Robert's Yates' daughter Minnie who, before her own demise in 1981, gave this in turn to her son Terence Pearson of 60 High Street, Norton-on-Tees, where it remains (2013). The two 'Compliments' cards were passed to Robert Yates' other daughter Hilda Patricia and are now in my possession.

At some time during the Depression of the late 20's, Robert approached a man begging in the streets of Darlington. Fetching a box of brushes and polish he set the man up to provide a shoe-shine service. A few years later that same man, now smart and well dressed, accosted Robert in the town and recalled the incident from years before, thanking Robert for his generosity, which had seemingly led to a successful business venture (pers. com. Minnie Pearson, formerly Yates c. 1970's).

Robert died about 30th September 1933 in Darlington, Age 60" . . .

Good luck with your research . . . Enjoy! - and remember . . . 'Nullius in Verba'


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Lancashire Lookup Requests / Re: William John Yates
« on: Wednesday 01 April 15 00:45 BST (UK)  »
Corinne . . . I've included some relevant? anecdotal Yates and West history passed down to me - and conjectured other aspects that may relate directly and indirectly to your Great Grandfather. . . all this is lifted straight from my 'Ancestry' notes

. . . "Robert West [my great grandfather] was born just after midnight 14th November 1872 at 8 Townside Fields, Bury (South), Lancashire, and had an identical twin brother William John, born before midnight 13th November. In their youth the twins were each known as 'Billy-Bob' when seen in company together (pers. com. Minnie Pearson, formerly Yates. c.1979). An older sibling John William, born November 1866  at Well Meadow Buildings in Salford, died, age 4 in Bury, a short while after the 1871 Census.

It is conjectured that some time after this date the Yates family moved back to Frances' former home of Wootton in Lincolnshire, with their two surviving sons. It seems that John Yates continued as a Groom, finding employment at Wootton Hall (pers. comm. Minnie Pearson, formerly Yates c.1979). John died however, sometime before the 1881 Census.

1881 Fanny Yates, 47, widow, born Wootton, is at Wooton Village in a Cottage (Schd. 36) opposite 'Pond Side,' with her 2 sons William J. and Robert West, both 8, born in Bury Lancashire; Fanny's  sister Dinah West, 42 from Thornton, Deaf & dumb from birth is also at home.

In 1891 Frances Yates, 55, born Wootton is still in Wootton, living in 3 rooms of a cottage in the Village main street (Sch.106). She lives with her sister Dinah West, 52, born Thornton, Deaf & dumb from birth; both sisters are laundresses. They live next to the Nag's Head Inn.

Robert cannot be found in the 1891 Census [above] for Wootton nor Thornton Curtis nor Lincolnshire: at ~20 years of age he may have been 'on the road' with a travelling business, the like of which he appears to have built for himself before his marriage in 1899. His father John had for many years been a Carter and presumably with much experience to pass on to his son.

In 1899 Robert West -Yates married Eleanor Holloway of Ardsley, W.Yorks. He is evidently an Auctioneer, Manager and traveller in Lincolnshire at this time. With his brother William's future interest in the butchery trade in Gainsborough (q.v.), Robert may have been dealing with livestock. Certainly by the early 1900's the Yates family with their caravans have travelled as far as the River Tyne.

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Lancashire Lookup Requests / Re: William John Yates
« on: Tuesday 31 March 15 14:47 BST (UK)  »
Corinne - good day

I think the most scholarly thing to do is for you to let me know who you are in relation to William John Yates and in particular the information that you have regarding his birth and birthplace . . . I do get the impression from the 2008 queries that you were probably headed in the right direction, but need to avoid duplication of information exchange, or sending you irrelevant data.

I will assume that you eventually purchased William's birth certificate (Townside Fields, Bury) but need to know how you've progressed with the marriage of his mother and father John and Frances - and what conclusion you have drawn with the removal of the Yates family from Bury to Wootton.

My grandma Minnie Pearson (formerly Yates), when a child in the early 1900's used to visit the abattoir in (or near) Trinity Street, Gainsborough with her father Robert (William J's twin brother), helping with the processing of slaughtered cattle. In his later years William lived for a time with his sibling in Darlington at the Yates' shop at 22 Park Street, which I assume you may (or not) have deduced from William's Death Certificate?

I look forward to sharing information with you Corinne . . . Best regards, Anthony Pearson

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Lancashire Lookup Requests / Re: William John Yates
« on: Monday 30 March 15 22:20 BST (UK)  »
John William Yates of Bury and Gainsborough . . .

'Codge'? . . .7 Years too late with request for help re: the above . . .

My great 2x G/Grandmother was the Frances (Fanny) Yates referred to in the initial query of 2008. Let me know (assuming you are still out there) if you require information on the West / Yates family of Wootton, Lincolnshire.

Regards, Anthony Pearson

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