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Messages - Evenmoresmiths

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Australia / Re: Alfred Cecil Arbuthnott born in Ceylon - settled in Australia
« on: Friday 09 April 21 10:49 BST (UK)  »
That tree belongs to my sister in law.  She had a little dabble quite some time ago using Ancestry.  However, some of the information on the tree is incorrect.  The birth date is quoted is the one the family used for all of Joyce's life.  However, I recently found information to dispute the date.  Once, again, if she was born in Victoria, it was not as Edna Joyce or Joy.  The marriage date is correct, and I am sitting beside one of the products of that marriage as I type.  You have just confirmed what I vaguely remembered about Banns being 3 consecutive Sundays.  I want to look at passenger lists for coastal sailings because Alfred would have had to sail from Mackay to Melbourne.  I believe Find My Past has the rights to that information.  I will look at the link you sent relating to C of E.  Thank you

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Australia / Re: Alfred Cecil Arbuthnott born in Ceylon - settled in Australia
« on: Friday 09 April 21 08:02 BST (UK)  »
Hi, thanks for the ideas.  I have tried all of your suggestions several times, searching various ways. I even tried going through every female born the the birth dates we know about.  No joy whatsoever. I have the marriage certificate which states Edna Joyce was 21 when she married, and her Dad did agree to the marriage. However, I have also found lots of anomalies with the information provided by dear old Dad.  I believe her Dad was very good at hiding the real deal.  I also tried to find her baptism certificate.  Found out from the relevant Anglican Diocese, coincidentally where I used to work, that the records from the period I was interested in were not kept by the Diocese but by the priest who would have done the baptism. He entered the details in a book which he kept and took with him to his next posting, so stymied again.  Waiting on a response from Anglican Diocese of Melbourne about the marriage records and whether Banns were read etc.  Might jag something there.

3
Australia / Re: Alfred Cecil Arbuthnott born in Ceylon - settled in Australia
« on: Thursday 08 April 21 12:06 BST (UK)  »
No children listed on the marriage certificate, and absolutely no known reason for the marriage to have been solemnized in Melbourne. Long way to go when you are already living west of Mackay in Queensland. Her family as in her children are reasonably sure Edna Joyce was born in 1919 or 1920.  Because of an event that happened to Joyce later in life, an earlier birthdate is not really feasible.  I also have photos taken in 1926 so its almost certain she could not have been born before 1919 or 1920.

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Australia / Re: Alfred Cecil Arbuthnott born in Ceylon - settled in Australia
« on: Thursday 08 April 21 08:39 BST (UK)  »
That is the $50,000 question.  She had no birth certificate.  She does not exist in BDM's for Qld, NSW, or Vic as Edna Joyce. Nor can I find her on UK Free BMD. I have 2 possible birth dates which have not panned out.  This is why I think she was either adopted or an unwanted child from another part of the family in the UK.  I have done a lot research looking for possibilities, so far, without success. She may have been Alfred Cecil Smith's daughter but I don't believe Sarah Amelia Patterson Harwood Smith is her birth mother.  Never the less, Joyce loved Sarah.  I saw another post about the corruption of Arbuthnott.  Some typist had a bad day when Sarah Amelia's death certificate was produced.  She is listed as Sarah Amelia Arbuthews Smith, which is a typo as far as I can tell. 

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Australia / Re: Alfred Cecil Arbuthnott born in Ceylon - settled in Australia
« on: Thursday 08 April 21 07:54 BST (UK)  »
Thank yo
Quote from: maddys52 on Thursday 08 April 21 02:52 BST (UK)
Quote from: maddys52 on Tuesday 06 April 21 03:32 BST (UK)

http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article169781131
Wife and daughter travelling to England for marriage of wife's sister Joyce in 1929.


The marriage was between Robert A SAMMONS and Aileen L J WEBB (registered at Kensington June qtr 1929). An engagement notice reads:
"Mr. R. A Sammons and Miss Webb
The engagement is announced between Robert A Sammons , M.B., Ch.B., of Kingswood, Bristol, and Joy, only daughter of Captain and Mrs. Clement Webb, Fernwood, Ashford, Middlesex."
Tuesday,  Oct. 2, 1928, The Times

Clement WEBB married Annie Florence PATTERSON registered at Shardlow, Derby in March qtr 1907 (their son Charles Fortescue WEBB mmn PATTERSON was born Derby Jun qtr 1908 - an engagement notice for him similar to that above appears in the Times on Thursday,  Sept. 26, 1935.)

So Alfred's wife, Sarah Amelia PATTERSON, was not the sister of the Aileen Joy WEBB, but possible an Aunt.  :
Thank you for this.  Aileen Lucy Joyce Webb is Annie Florence Patterson's daughter.  I knew about them.  Any information is good information for me.  So now I just have to find where Sarah and Alfred's daughter (my mother in law RIP) came from.  May have been adopted or an intra family adoption.  That is the mystery.

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Australia / Alfred Cecil Arbuthnott born in Ceylon - settled in Australia
« on: Monday 05 April 21 07:23 BST (UK)  »
Hi,

I am looking for direct relatives of a Scottish family called Smith who migrated to Ceylon in the 1800's to grow first tea and then coffee. John Arbuthnott Smith and Augusta Mary Isabel Griffin married in Ceylon in 1878. Alfred Cecil Arbuthnott Smith was the second of seven children all born in Ceylon.  He moved to Queensland, Australia. One other brother, Charles Owen, came to Australia with him or followed him.  Not sure which. Alfred pops up in Queensland in 1913 where he goes on to marry and have one child, a daughter. The daughter may or may not have been a product of the marriage and that is my mystery to solve.  The daughter grew up, married, and went on to become my mother in law. The rest of the family left Ceylon probably after the father died in 1894.  Augusta died in 1900. So now I am seeking anyone who may be related to this family and hold information, photographs, letters about the family, but particularly, Alfred and his daughter. Any contributions welcomed.

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Other Countries / Re: Births in Colombo 1879-1897
« on: Saturday 20 February 21 04:26 GMT (UK)  »
Hey,  I am new to this site.  Just discovered the 2011 posts of yetanothersmith,medge169, and Barrie Green regarding the John Arbuthnott Smith family.  My husband is the grandson of Alfred Cecil Arbuthnott Smith.  His mother was Edna Joyce. 
I was hoping for an exchange of information.  I am looking for Edna Joyce's origins.  In her lifetime she was never able to determine if her parents were her natural parents or she was an inter family adoption, or adopted through the usual channels.
Looking forward to making contact.
Liz from Australia

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