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Topics - Lubricated

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Ancestral Family Tree DNA Testing / Styles and Stiles researchers and DNA
« on: Tuesday 16 March 21 14:19 GMT (UK)  »
I’m brick walled with my STYLES / STILES research in Essex. This is my Paternal ancestry line. My last definite ancestor was Samuel Stiles who married Sarah Pearce in Writtle in 1743.  I don’t even know if Samuel was born in Essex but if he was, I have found 3 possible baptism candidates and I've not been able to determine if one of them is the right one. There could well be more candidates whose baptism records haven’t survived; as one involved in transcribing Essex ecclesiastical records, I am well aware there are many gaps, particularly 1700-1750.

So, I am now looking at DNA. I’ve had the FTDNA Big Y test. From my Y DNA I have a definite match with a family group resident in Millbrook, Bedfordshire 1600-1620ish. They might be direct ancestors or they might just be cousins. I’ve also had Autosomal DNA tests done with both FTDNA and Ancestry.

I would love to hear from anyone who knows they are a descendant from any Styles or Stiles line and who has had a DNA test done. Whether we find we match or we don’t match, just knowing this will surely be some progress for both of us. I promise all replies will be answered.

Lubricated

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The Common Room / Same Couple - Two Weddings within 4 Months & 11 Miles of each other. Why?
« on: Saturday 31 January 15 14:51 GMT (UK)  »
I have come across two weddings ceremonies which took place between the same couple in two Anglican Churches within 11 miles and 4 months of each other.  Can anyone offer any reason as to why this happened?

For some reason I get the feeling they were probably forced to undergo the second ceremony but I cannot find any reason why. Nor can I find any logical reason why they should want to do so.

William Reed and Sophia Seaman were first married in Withyham Parish Church, Sussex, on 18 February 1833 (Register No. 258). William Reed signed, but looks childish as if practised specially for the occasion, Sophia Seaman X. Witnesses Thos. Elphick (Signed) and Harriet Cridall X.

On 25th June 1833 they married again in Buxted Parish Church, Sussex (Register No. 217). This time the bride is recorded as Sophia Seymour, both bride and groom signed with an X. Witnesses were the same Thos. Elphick (Signed) and an Esther Daws X.

By Horse and Cart there's less than 11 Miles between the Churches.

I have been studying the Seaman/Seymour name in East Sussex and have ample proof they are completely interchangeable, together with a multitude of other variants, even within the same family group. Both marriages were by Banns. Both bride and groom came from very poor agricultural labouring families. I have not found any evidence to suggest they were separate couples with identical or very similar names; I’ve only ever found the one valid Sophia Seaman or Seymour, etc.

To add to the puzzle, Ellen Seymour, daughter of Sophia Seymour a single woman, was baptised in Buxted on 2 Jun 1833. I don’t know when she was born, it might have been before the first marriage in February that year. She appears in the 1841 Census under the name of Reed but that’s not an uncommon thing. She is definitely the daughter of the Sophia who married William Reed.

From research I’ve learnt that a marriage can be treated as “voidable” and thus cancelled if contested by one party in court, and one justifiable ground is the woman being pregnant by another man at the time of the marriage.  But I’m struggling with this being the case here; first I doubt there was enough money for a court case, second I doubt there was enough time, and third why go through all that process only to get married again?

So I’m back to wondering whether the local Rector at Buxted had some influence in requiring a second marriage ceremony.  Why was the first child baptised Seymour and not Reed ? I’ve no evidence that Ellen was the child of William Reed. Is there something in the church laws at that time that might have had some impact on this state of affairs?

I’m baffled – and intrigued. Any solutions anyone?

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Ancestral Family Tree DNA Testing / DNA - Brick Wall - Elphick
« on: Monday 05 January 15 10:55 GMT (UK)  »
Most of us have brick walls.  I was lucky to solve one of mine and then have the solution confirmed later via the use of Y DNA testing. 

I am currently researching Seaman, Seamer, and Seymour in East Sussex, England.  One line leads to a marriage with a Thomas Elphick. They had a son, Thomas Elphick, who along with his wife Esther, was charged with the murder of an illegitimate child of his daughter.

Thomas and Esther were found “Not Guilty” on the direction of the Judge, but an unfortunate consequence for Thomas was that the body of his mother was exhumed and a second inquest held. His mother had died quite suddenly the year before and,  following the charge of murder of his grandchild, rumours started that he might have murdered his mother.  The second inquest determined his mother had died "from the administration of arsenous acid by persons unknown."

This all happened in 1848. I have not been able to find a single trace of this family, Thomas, Esther nor their 5 children, since 1848.  They have simply disappeared.

In my own tree my Great Grandfather changed his name from Styles to Thomas. He walked out on his first wife. 5 years later he bigamously married my Great Grandmother.

I can’t help but feel that the most likely explanation for this Elphick family’s disappearance is that they moved away and changed their name, and quite possibly their ages and places of birth. A complete new identity.

Which of course would create a brick wall for any descendant working backwards.

So if anyone out there has had a Y DNA check which suggests their Paternal line is “Elphick” and this name is completely unknown to them contact me for more information.

If any moderator feels this is more appropriate to another board please don’t hesitate to move it.  I’m a newbie to Rootschat and I don’t want to get into trouble with multiple postings!

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The Common Room / E-Petition 62779, BMDs England & Wales - Help needed URGENTLY
« on: Friday 02 January 15 10:58 GMT (UK)  »
This is not a new subject for Rootschat but it needs our help URGENTLY.

Currently there are only 8523 signatures out of the 100,000 required for a UK Parliamentary debate, and the Petition closes 25 Mar 2015.

The Petition is to free up access to BMD data for England & Wales from 1837. If you are a British Citizen please, please, sign up if you have not already done so - and ask your friends and family and their friends to do the same. Promote it on Facebook and Bulletin Boards. Unless it gets publicised it will fail. I've only just heard about it today - which demonstrates the need for publicity!

https://submissions.epetitions.direct.gov.uk/petitions/62779

Thanks


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Essex Lookup Requests / Gibbons & Marriages
« on: Monday 23 July 12 21:56 BST (UK)  »
Hello

This is my first posting, so if I understand "the rules" I can't PM Essexbird2004 at this time (need to make 3 posts?). I'm worried I might transgress a few other rules - my apologies if I do. Anyway...

The Takeley Local History Site has a transcript of a will of John Gibbons, 1739. Property/Land is left to 4 named people. 2 are defined as daughters and 1 as a son. The one I'm really interested in is the 4th, relationship undefined.  I've searched the Takeley on-line registers, and the various sites from the Utah people and a couple of other commercial sites, but I can't get any hits on these marriages.  If anyone has any info on them I would be very grateful:

Mary Camp, daughter, wife of Philip Camp = Mary Gibbons marriage to Philip Camp

Susannah Clarke, daughter, wife of Francis Clarke = Susannah Gibbons marriage to Francis Clarke

Elizabeth Stiles, wife of John Stiles... after her death to Samuel Stiles and Thomas Stiles her children .. equally. This is the one without a relationship but it seems reasonable to assume it might be his daughter, so I'm looking for a marriage between Elizabeth Gibbons and John Stiles (or Styles)

Thanks

Lubricated

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