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Messages - Gerry_Dalton

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1
Good afternoon JJ, Polarbear, Barleyfield and all
Have been waiting for my cousin to get back to me with more information on Mike Brown.  I now have copies of Mike and Minnie's 2 oldest daughters birth certificates.  They were both born in Queenstown, Tasmania and both certificates give Mike Brown's place of birth as Kansas City USA (that is exactly what it says - no state just city and country) and both certificates calculate his year of birth to be about 1875.  His daughters were born in Tasmania in 1914 and 1916. 
It is still not known when the family left Tasmania but the are living in a suburb of Sydney, New South Wales in 1924 when their 3rd daughter was born.
Regarding the family story that the Brown's were Irish Catholic.  As we have seen Mike Brown and Minnie Wilson religion is recorded as Presbyterian on their marriage certificate and St Andrew's Vancouver is a Presbyterian church. Minnie Wilson was apparently not a church goer. 
Anyway today I read a very interesting article on change of religion by Australian genealogist and author Carol Baxter and this is the link to her newsletter:
 http://www.carolbaxter.com/newsletters/2014/History-Detective-2014-8-Sep.pdf
It is an interesting and thought provoking article.
Hope this post finds everyone well and enjoying life.  Cheerio for now  Gerri Dalton

2
G’day all and thanks once more for input from JJ, PolarBear and Barleyfields – lovely image of Wansboro Park, beside Shannon, Athlone. 
JJ: I did add all the info sent to me from St Mary’s church, Athlone.  No sponsors were included –the info added to the previous post was a copy of the correspondence I received.
I have called my cousins again and asked if they can add any further information about the family and they could only repeat all the stories that I have added previously. They said  that they thought Mike Brown had 2 younger sisters and a younger brother who’s name may have been William.  They think one of the sisters was Mary Margaret and the other was known as Aggie (Agnes Helen or Helen Agnes maybe) They say these names because their mother told them she was named after one of Mike Browns sisters.  My cousins were also told that Mike and Minnie’s second daughter Agnes Helen Brown was named after another of Mike Browns sisters.
I asked again about the letters and photos from Mike Browns family and they again told me that most things were lost when the family house was flooded in the early 1950’s.
It seems Minnie never met Mike Browns family and it is unclear if she ever corresponded with them.  I did, however, find out that Minnie did live with my cousins and their parent at the time the home was flooded and that could explain why so much information was lost. Minnie and Mike Brown had been living with one of their other daughter at the time of Mike’s death.
My cousins are not happy with the news that St Andrew’s Vancouver is a Presbyterian Church….they had always thought Mike and Minnie were married in a Catholic Church. However they have accepted that sufficient evidence has been found  to support the fact that Rev Angus C Cameron MA was indeed a minister at St. Andrew’s Presbyterian Church, Vancouver in 1913 when they were married there.
And another thought I had was this will also partially explain somewhat why the Scotsman Ralph  Swanston was one of the witnesses to their marriage – they may have went to the same men’s bible group or met at the church.
In the 1900 census JJ sent link to William Brown, the lumbar merchant, says he was born in New York and his parents were from Ireland.  Being born in NY was supported in the Bio on Walter Brown but not that he came from Ireland.  And as already pointed out these Browns were Presbyterian.   Walter E Brown also achieved a great status in his lifetime and I would also imagine that would have been a story to pass down in the family too but it was not.  Have sent my cousins the link to Walter E Brown bio and will have to wait for their comments.  Maybe it will jog a memory?? That is if Walter E Brown is part of the Mike Brown tree.
I am still wondering about the Michael Brown on the 1900 and 1910 census in Whiting, Jackson and all the bios not quite lining up about the Browns….what a shame there was no mention of JP Brown in Atchison in these stories. However the 1910 census does say this Michael Brown migrated in 1839 – he would have been 9 years old so who did Michael Brown go to Nth America with?
Over the next few days I will look again at all the evidence and see if anything lines up.  Will re-read all the bio’s and look anything else that may shed some light on Mike Brown. 
Other things are urgently demanding most my time – but living family must come first.
Cheerio for now  G

3
Good afternoon everyone.  Had a few things going on here that keep me away from the computer and been monopolizing on my time however living family must come first!
Thanks again JJ, PolarBear and Barleyfields for all your amazing input.  I have not quite completed digesting all the information sent over the past few days and hope things are quiet here tonight and I can look at it all again and do some more digesting.
I have committed a big faux pas  :o....by not following up on basic information  ::)
Mike and Minnie's marriage certificate has been bothering me.  I took for granted that St Andrew's Vancouver BC was a Catholic Church but WHY were the religions noted as Pres.  My dear cousins said the Presbyterian had to be an error on behalf of the registry.  No Error St Andrew's church is Presbyterian.
I got searching for St Andrews and found the attachment that refers to Rev A.C. Cameron MA taking over the Mens Bible Classes from the retiring Mr Dunn.
Rev A.C. Cameron was the Reverend noted as the reverend who married Mike Brown and Minnie Wilson
I have attached page 22 and cover page from the historical publication about St Andrews "St. Andrew's Church, Presbyterian, Vancouver, B.C. : twenty-fifth anniversary, 1888-1913"  is they title of my source document.
I have just left a message for my dear old cousins that Mike and Minnie were not wed in a Catholic Church as they so fervently believed. The old dears will be in shock but the evidence was there all along.
Computer freedom for now is short lived....as family needs are calling.  Cheerio for now Gerri

4
This is the information I received from St Mary's parish Athlone
John Brown/Mary Dalton          Address: Coosan, Athlone, Co. Westmeath, Ireland

Children:   1.   Bridget   born 19th Nov 1826
       2.   William   born         July 1839
      3.   Thomas   born 12th May 1842
      4   Margaret   born 23rd Sept 1846



Michael Browne/Elizabeth Wansboro.        Address: Coosan, Athlone, Co.
                                                                                     Westmeath., Ireland.

Children:           1.      Thomas    born 3rd Jan 1858
                        2.      Mary   born 11th Sept 1863
                        3.      Michael   born June 1867   
                        4.      Patrick   born 11th Feb 1872 (Mother was recorded as     
                                                                                             Catherine Wansboro)

Maybe I have just had a lightbulb moment but in my last post I made a comment about Elizabeth maybe died and Michael married a Catherine as shown in the 1875 Kansas census....ummmm.
Well looking at the info from St Mary's I pasted above MAYBE I am correct and MAYBE Michael Brown had a second wife Catherine who could have been the sister(or rellie) of Michael's first wife Elizabeth.
Now to try to find death or marriage in Athlone, Westmeath....but that will have to wait till tomorrow and I am in need of sleep.
Thanks to JJ and Polarbear for giving me information that has helped to think outside the square... ;D
But even if this lightbulb moment has some substance it still does not explain why Granddad Mike Brown does not show up on any census


                         

5
I am about over the Browns....correction to my previous post........William Brown had the wife Martha Wallis nee Gilmore not Michael.

I got too many Browns running around my head!  :D

And those Browns are not so easy to find in any census!
1 Mar 1875 Kansas census had:
Michael age 43 farmer born Ireland
Catherine age 38 housekeeper born Ireland
William age 18 farmer born Penn
They all lived in NY before moving to Kansas

If Catherine is Michael Brown's wife then Michael Brown senior has either remarried or this is not the Brown family we are looking for.....well that is if granddad Mike Brown told the truth about his parents names on his marriage cert as Mike Brown and Lizzie Wainsborough (sic)!  I am guessing finding a death anywhere (Ireland or USA) for an Elizabeth (Lizzie) Brown would be near impossible. I have not had any success yet.

I need a cup of tea.  I am interested in what JJ and Polarbear think and Barleyfield with that amazing info on graves from Ireland? 

Cheerio for now  G


6
The Mike Brown sitting all dressed up in a very interesting looking room does not say this is a person working on a chicken ranch.  I agree.  I am passing on information I got from my family. 
Family stories say Mike Brown left home age about 13 or 14 and went off to make his fortune.  He went to work at a chicken ranch in Montana and that is where this photo was suppose to have been taken.  This does not appear to be the photo of a youth and to me looks more like a man at least in his 20s'
What an interesting room he is photographed in.  I feel there must be some further clues in that photo. :-\
The facts and family stories do not all line up - I do agree. 
However just as I was about to think all the family stories were fiction I did read on pages 519 and 520 in the publication " The History of Atchison County, Kansas" by Sheffield 
https://archive.org/stream/historyofatchiso01inga#page/518/mode/2up
Walter E Brown b 1887 Whiting Jackson Ks. Parents William E Brown and Martha Willis Gilmore (Penn).  Then it says William E Brown's father was Irishman Michael Brown. 
It further says William E Brown went Kansas with his parents in 1872.. and ....according to this book William E Brown's father is Michael Brown.  Anyway the book further says these Brown's settled in Brown Co. Kansas.  So now it's time to look for William E Brown along with his mother Martha and father Michael in Brown County Kansas....next census would be 1880 or go back to 1870 and look for Michael, Martha and William in Penn in the 1870 census.
I am wondering if my cousins granddad Mike Brown's mother Elizabeth/Lizzy Wainsborough (or however it is spelt) died and granddad Browns father Michael Brown remarried...that does seem possible.
As JJ said not everything adds up.
And family stories say that Granddad Mike Brown was very fond of his sisters.  I got thinking and called my cousins to ask if granny Minnie ever met Mike Browns family....and they do not think her did. 
So now I have to also wonder why and why did he not take his bride to meet his beloved sisters....and why can't we find those beloved sisters.
However my cousin did call me back and told me that granddad Mike Brown did write to his family  and they wrote back but all the letters were destroyed when my cousins family home in Qld got flooded some years ago (in the 1940's or 1950's). 
I'm going to look for Michael Brown and his wife Martha and son William E Brown in the 1870 Penn census.
Chat soon  G

7
Good arvo everyone
My limited Latin agrees that the name Gulielmus translates to William.
Family story says Mike Brown has a brother William and William is suppose to be Mike Brown's middle name (or at least that's what his wife Minnie said on his death certificate)

I just got the info from St Mary's Athlone yesterday....I did not have it before so I could not mention it and  I had not ought to thmention that I had emailed to a church in hope of finding more info.  I only emailed St Mary's when the Athlone and Glassan Browns showed up with the Brown & Wandsbro as parents and wondered why some of the children were missing.
I was so happy to get a reply...its the first Irish church I have emailed to that has replied to me  :o  even though the info was the same as already mentioned on this post with the further info from the church regarding which years the records are missing.
It was JJ and Polarbear who found the Glassan Westmeath records.  I got lucky to be able to find the Catholic Church of St Marys and would never have found that without JJ and PolarBears help.
Cheers   G

8
Thanks Barleyfield for the headstone inscriptions
I contacted St Marys parish at Athlone and they sent me a list of baptism of Browns round the period we are searching and some very interesting info about the records which may be useful to other researchers:
"St. Mary’s Parish there are no records for the years 1827 to 1833 or for the year 1836. There are single entries for the years 1834, 1835, 1837 and 1838.  There are no records for 1859 to 1862 or for 1866.  The building of the new St Mary’s from 1859 to 1862  can explain why those records went missing but there is no trace of records for  the other years at all."
Cheerio for now
Gerri
Down Under on a gloriously sunny winters morning
 
 

9
Westmeath / Re: Brown family from Athlone
« on: Saturday 09 August 14 23:24 BST (UK)  »
Good morning
I forgot to mention that I have contacted St Mary's at Athlone and have received back information on Brown families in the parish baptism register plus the following useful information:

"At St. Mary’s Parish there are no records for the years 1827 to 1833 or for the year 1836.  There are single entries for the years 1834, 1835, 1837 and 1838.  There are no records for 1859 to 1862 or for 1866.  The building of the new St Mary’s from 1859 to 1862  can explain why those records went missing but there is no trace of records for  the other years at all."

Hope this info is of use to other researchers

Cheerio for now
Gerri
Down Under




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