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Messages - EJ

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1
Looking for the marriage of Thomas PINNEL(L), a Principal inhabitant of Gloucester City in 1791, and renowned land surveyor with property in Gloucester City.

Born about 1750 in Slimbridge, he is believed to have daughters, Ann and Mary (mentioned in a dispute over property).  Mary married John PRICE, an upholsterer in the City.

I guess Thomas would have married around 1770/1780.

Assistance much appreciated.

EJ

2
Flintshire Lookup Requests / Re: CONNAH'S QUAY - BAPTISM LOOKUP
« on: Friday 06 July 12 09:05 BST (UK)  »
William and others, thank you for your input which I really appreciate. 
If you will bear with me, I'll list the information I have and perhaps you can help me decide where to start looking for various certificates.

In the time honoured way of family historians, I will start by working backwards and apologise in advance for the length of this note:

1881 Charles GRIFFITHS married Matilda WILLIAMS on 21 June 1881 in Acton, Cheshire.  His age was given as 24, hers as 22.  The marriage record was corrected by the Curate on 23 Dec 1881 to include the name "William" after Charles.  Charles'  place of residence was Hawarden (Flintshire), and his father was John GRIFFITHS, Ship broker.  Matilda came from Acton and her father was Daniel WILLIAMS, farmer.  Witnesses were Thomas ELLIS and Fanny WILLIAMS.

Family lore told of Charles drowning young (confirmed by maritime record as a "supposed drowning" whilst Master of the Accrington Lass in November 1882, aged 24). 

His father, John GRIFFITHS was very involved with the Sabbath School at Connah's Quay run by the New Methodist Connexion.

Censuses
I found John GRIFFITHS in 1881 at Nine Houses, Shotton
John GRIFFITHS (60) Ship broker's clerk, b Shrewsbury, Shropshire
Elizabeth GRIFFITHS (63) b Shotton, Flint
Elizabeth ELLIS (12) g/dau b Hawarden

John died in 1897 as his Probate record indicated he lived at Nine Houses, and was a Shipper at the time of his death.

His widow, Elizabeth, appears in 1901 census (aged 73), still at Nine Houses, together with her g/dau Elizabeth ELLIS (22) and Charles ELLIS (10 months), gt/grandson.

In 1911 Elizabeth is still at Nine Houses (84), together with her g/dau Elizabeth ROBERTS (nee ELLIS) (32), widow, Charles ROBERTS (prev ELLIS) (10), Mary ROBERTS (7), , Thomas John ROBERTS (5)
Elizabeth died in 1916 and probate was granted to Thomas ELLIS (plumber).

However, in 1871 the only John GRIFFITHS I can find in Nine Houses is
John GRIFFITHS (40) b Shrewsbury, Shropshire, butcher and local preacher.
Mary (38) b Shotton together with Charles William (14), Caroline (12), John (9), Thomas (7)

1861 Nine Houses
John GRIFFITHS (29) butcher b Shrewsbury, Shropshire
Mary (28), Mary E (7), Charles W (4), Caroline (2)
Stephen HEWITT (24) lodger

The birth certificate I have received for Charles William GRIFFITHS
Born: 18 Nov 1856 Shotton, Hawarden.
 Father, John GRIFFITHS,  Guard on Railway
Mother: Mary formerly HEWITT
Registration: Great Boughton
Subdistrict - Hawarden
Counties: Chester & Flint

Questions:
1.  Do you think I have the right family for Charles William GRIFFITHS?

2.  I am puzzled by John GRIFFITHS' occupations:  1856 guard on railway, 1861, 1871 butcher, 1881 commercial clerk, 1891 Ship broker's clerk, Shipper.  However, being the local preacher does seem to fit with the family stories.

3.  I was also puzzled as to the change in the names and slight change in ages of John GRIFFITHS' wife but have had an "Aha" moment whilst writing all this out!
a) Mary must have died between 1871 and 1881 (which registration area would I look for her death?)
b) Then John remarried to Elizabeth HEWITT late in 1872 (reg Holywell) - perhaps she was Mary's sister, which seems to be borne out by Carole W's suggestion of an 1852 marriage in Lancashire (Manchester) to Mary HEWITT.

Thank you all for your patience!

Lizzie

3
Flintshire Lookup Requests / Re: CONNAH'S QUAY - BAPTISM LOOKUP
« on: Thursday 05 July 12 00:27 BST (UK)  »
My thanks to both of you for such quick responses :)

I should have mentioned that I had already sent off for a b/c for a Charles William GRIFFITHS (reg Gt Boughton, Cheshire).  He was born 18 Nov 1856 at Shotton and gave his father as John GRIFFITHS - Guard on Railway and his mother as Mary GRIFFITHS (nee HEWITT).  That b/c ties in with the IGI baptismal record too.

However, my gut feeling is that this is NOT the Charles I am looking for and suspect his would have been a Holywell registered birth, possibly without the William.

Thanks again

Lizzie

4
Flintshire Lookup Requests / CONNAH'S QUAY - BAPTISM LOOKUP
« on: Wednesday 04 July 12 12:21 BST (UK)  »
Looking for the baptismal record of Charles GRIFFITHS b abt 1857 in Connah's Quay.   He may also have been named Charles William GRIFFITHS as a correction was made to his marriage certificate in 1881 adding the William.
His father was John GRIFFITHS who was involved with the New Methodist Connexion in Connah's Quay.  His mother was either Mary or Elizabeth (or perhaps Mary Elizabeth or vice versa). 

He may also have a sister, Mary Elizabeth b about 1854 in Connah's Quay.

The family is believed to have lived at Nine Houses, Shotton.

Grateful for any help.

Lizzie

5
Wales / Re: Evan Celyn ROWLANDS (b c 1905)
« on: Thursday 03 February 11 04:18 GMT (UK)  »
I have only just come across your note but Evan Celyn ROWLANDS (1903-1970) is part of my ROWLANDS family.

His parents were Robert Evans ROWLANDS (1863-1928) b Bangor, CAE and Margaret OWEN (c1881-?).

Grandparents: Owen Robert ROWLANDS (1834-1920) b Llanrug/Llanddeiniolen, CAE and Margaret HUGHES (1833-1918) b Penmon, Anglesey

Siblings: Owen Celyn ROWLANDS (1903-1970)
               Ellis C ROWLANDS (1914-?)

Further information is available on my Public Tree on Ancestry (HUMPHREYS/ASHTON/ROWLANDS)

Let me know if I can help further.

Regards
EJ

6
Hi Gillg

I should probably have mentioned that I was told the 1799 Berkeley marriage for William POWELL was in the Bishop's Transcripts. 

Can only imagine how tiring it is to look at microfiche copies of docs that may have had tea spilt on them, mice chewing them, or just plain old tattered!

Thanks again for your persistence.

EJ

7
Hello all

Thanks for your interest in my query.  I was talking about Gloucester City, not just  Gloucestershire.

We are sure that the Powell's came from Gloucestershire and I believe there is a record of a 1799 Berkeley marriage for William POWELL but his bride's name is illegible  :(  I also believe that the Slimbridge marriages for 1788-1800 are missing and its highly likely that Elizabeth was from that area.

However, it might be worth checking the Bristol RO.  Unfortunately the name William POWELL seems to be almost as common as John SMITH  :)

Thanks in advance
EJ

8
Hello All

Elizabeth POWELL (nee UNKNOWN) died 18 Dec 1838 aged 58 so born abt 1780.  She married William POWELL  abt 1798/9 and their first child was born 1799 in Berkeley.  Several of their childrens' births/deaths are listed in Berkeley in Scribes Alcove.

I'm rashly assuming that William was about the same age as Elizabeth when they married, though its possible it was a 2nd mge for him.  He was still listed in Pigot's TD in 1831 as "Tailor of Berkeley" and as "Shopkeeper of Berkely" in Thomas PINNELL's will of 1823 for which William was Executor.

Elizabeth is also mentioned in the will as Thomas PINNELL's niece.  He was a wealthy gentleman and well known land surveyor of Gloucester City, living in the area of St Nicolas.

There was a protracted dispute over TP's will but perhaps the POWELL's came into some money and moved to Gloucester at some stage?

The POWELL lot are very elusive!

Regards
EJ

9
Hello Gillg

Thanks for your thorough checking.  Yes, I did get Elizabeth's death from FBMD and a death cert (and verified the servant who reported it as living with Caroline POWELL in 1841).

Little Emily who died in 1833 is William's dau.

Could I trouble you to check the Glos Burial Index for Gloucester City for Wm or Elizabeth's burials please?

Many thanks again
EJ

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