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Messages - Jamesharrislondonuk

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1
Essex / Re: Harris Family - Barkingside, Essex
« on: Wednesday 20 January 16 00:24 GMT (UK)  »
Hi Steve,

Yep totally agree the Harris family is not an easy one to trace!

I'll pm you my details very kind of you to offer...and of course always ready to reciprocate with my spreadsheet of information too (although mine I think isn't as big)

I haven't got close to finishing transposing all my Harris research into ivyonline.co.uk yet - but that's where I put my research so that anyone can see it.

Once again thanks very much

Thanks

James

2
London and Middlesex / Re: The Chamberlain Family - London
« on: Wednesday 06 January 16 17:18 GMT (UK)  »
Hi all, thanks for the continued interest.

Ray, my spreadsheet log I use has become corrupted - I will re-validate the existing information.

The Shorncliffe information is really useful. 

I've pursued the George Chamberlain route in the past and found that the details didn't fit, although with Annie or Ann Chamberlain the details are enticing.  From the oral family history I have Annie was the eldest sibling but this could be incorrect.  If I remember correctly I traced the George Chamberlain back in the census material and found that the chamberlain surname was originally spelt as Chambers.  Either way the George route didn't seem to fit at the time but I will review again to see if I've missed something.

Annie chamberlains birth details are a mystery particularly when she doesn't appear in the 1881 census.  My guess at the time was that Elizabeth was pregnant with her whilst the census was taken. 

Will get back when I've done some more digging

Huge thanks once again :)

3
Essex / Re: Harris Family - Barkingside, Essex
« on: Wednesday 06 January 16 09:17 GMT (UK)  »
Thanks Findem, really useful information.  Harris is a well used surname which does make finding the right connections difficult work which is the nature of the game.  Your Harris' are reasonably local to mine so there may well be a connection somewhere.  Obviously would welcome as much help as I can get and of course where my research might provide anything to you I would be very happy to share - all my research is free to see on my website www.ivyonline.co.uk.

Once again thanks for getting in touch

James

4
London and Middlesex / Re: The Chamberlain Family - London
« on: Wednesday 06 January 16 08:51 GMT (UK)  »
Thanks Daisy, Mabel, Ray & Jennifer your guys are really good!

The Grace Cleaver marriage to Arthur Chamberlain was a tempting connection to pursue which has helped me to rule out some loose ends with Arthur.  In the end the Arthur that married Grace Cleaver turned out to be a well known public figure and Chartered Accountant. He appeared as a boarder in Brighton as an Accountants Clerk in the 1881 census.  In the same 1881 census my Arthur John Chamberlain is living with Elizabeth Chamberlain.  He is listed as a private in the queens hussars and Elizabeth is stated as coming from Dublin Ireland.  All interesting stuff as a lot of the details between the 2 Arthur's match up.  I'm now thinking that the Death certificate for Arthur in Islington could be his, however it puts his age as 37 at death meaning he would have been born 10 years earlier in 1847 - this could have been an error made back then.

I'd love to know more details about the marriage of a Arthur Richard Chamberlain to Elizabeth Cal set or Colbert in 1877 in Dublin.  I haven't been able to fall be the record as yet and am keen to rule it in or out.  Elizabeth is a really key bit of information.  Arthur joined the Hussars in 1879 and left before 1881 when they went from Home duty to the Boer War.  That puts Arthur in Ireland 2 years before he seemingly joined the Hussars.
All interesting stuff - thanks so much to you all for you help it has been absolutely invaluable

James

5
Essex / Re: Harris Family - Barkingside, Essex
« on: Thursday 31 December 15 14:38 GMT (UK)  »
Thanks very much for that  :)

How are you accessing the Baptism info if you don't mind me asking?

James  :)

6
London and Middlesex / Re: The Chamberlain Family - London
« on: Thursday 31 December 15 14:27 GMT (UK)  »
Annie Chamberlain
-   Born quarter 1 1881 (Q1 1881 Vol 3a pg414 - Edmonton, Hertfordshire, Middlesex, Essex)
-   Married Ernest William Pimm 17/12/1904 (Q4 1904 Vol 3a pg905 - Edmonton, Hertfordshire, Middlesex, Essex)
-   Died 18/10/1964

Annie and Ernest’s daughters:
-   Ethel Marguerite Pimm (married Bert O’Hare)
-   Cissie Elizabeth Pimm (married Emil Dotter Morgan)
-   May Louise (married Cecil Roger Evans)


Business Directory - Dressmaking shop
1937 to 1938 Mrs A Pimm owned a costumier business with Iris G Oram located at  57 Windmill Hill, Enfield

Electoral Register
1939 57B Windmill Hill, Enfield (Annie Pimm and May Louise Pimm)
1945 to 1956 57B Windmill Hill, Enfield (Annie Pimm and May Louise Pimm)

It appears that after Ernest’s death the business was run by someone else and Annie and May lived at the address probably above the shop...(It’s an assumption)



I’ve got a little bit more information in my notes somewhere which i’ll add here and on www.ivyonline.co.uk.

Ray and JJ once again thanks so much for your help with this  :)

7
London and Middlesex / Re: The Chamberlain Family - London
« on: Thursday 31 December 15 14:25 GMT (UK)  »
Horace Colbert Chamberlain
-   Born to Arthur John Chamberlain and Elizabeth Colbert, 25/3/1884 (Q2 1884 Vol 3a pg286 - Edmonton, Middlesex)
-   Married Jane Hagger 14/06/1915 (Q2 1915 Vol 1c pg350 - Bethnal Green, Greater London, Middlesex)
-   Died 15/05/1942 (Q2 1942 Vol 4a pg190 - Essex SW)


Military Service
British Army WWI medal rolls index card 1914 – 1920
Regiment or corps: Duke of Cornwalls Light Infantry Labour Corps
Regiment #: 34321, 93114
Theatres/Campaigns were Havre (22/11/1915 to 9/11/1916). France (10/11/1916 to ?).
British War Medal.  Victory Medal
Lc/Cpl - 13th Duke of Cornwall's Labour Corps. Or Duke of Cornwalls Light Infantry, Labour Corps  Unit 156.  COY A,C,I 611/17 - Regimental # 34321, 93114. Victory = LC/101B56 Page5681
Attestation Address: 44, 3 Colts Lane, Bethnal Green
Demob Address: 24, Tent Street, Bethnal Green

Census appearances
1891 (5th April) Census:
Horace ‘J’ Chamberlain, aged about 7, born in New Beckenham Kent.
Living with Mother Elizabeth Chamberlain aged about 31, Widow and Head of the house – Occupation ‘Ironer’.  Born Isle of Wight Hampshire
Ecclesiastical Parish St Anns, Civil Parish Tottenham
(Class: RG12; Piece: 1073; Folio 17; Page 28;)

1901 and 1911 to follow....

8
London and Middlesex / Re: The Chamberlain Family - London
« on: Thursday 31 December 15 14:24 GMT (UK)  »
Facts i’ve gathered so far...

Arthur John Chamberlain
-   Born to John Chamberlain and Jane Tew, 4/9/1857 (Q4 1857 Vol 1c pg110 - Shoreditch, London, Middlesex)
-   Death is unclear.  Arthur doesn’t appear in any further Census returns after 1881 and there is a Death Certificate record the 2nd quarter of 1891 (Q2 1891 Vol 1b pg193 - Islington, Greater London, Middlesex).  The Assumption is that if this is his death certificate he must have died before April 5th 1891 when the census was taken.
-   In the census returns Arthur was born in London but his father John was born Willey, Warwickshire (Clifton upon Dunsmore)

Military Service
7th Hussar's
Regiment #: 1498
Theatres/Campaigns were Newbridge, Cahir
7th Hussar's From:1879 To:1881.  Newbridge & Cahir.  'War Office: Muster Books and Paylists WO 16/1213 7th Hussars.  7th Hussars Calvary & Footguards War Office Muster Books & Pay Lists. Date Range: 1879 - 1881


Census appearances

1861 (7th April) Census:
Arthur J Chamberlain aged 3 born around 1858, Son
Father John born in Leicester, Willey and Mother Jane
Born Shorditch, Middlesex, England
Civ Parish Middlesex, County London, Reg district Islington, Sub reg district Islington East
Ed/Institution or vessel 47
Household Schedule 154
Arthur lived with his father, mother and 2 other siblings (Ellen J and George E), as well as 2 boarders who were Tailors
The main Occupation of the household was Tailor and dressmaker

1871 (2nd April) Census:
Arthur J Chamberlain age 13 born around 1858, Son
Father John and Mother Jane
Born Shorditch, Middlesex, England
Civ Parish Islington St Peter, County London, Reg district Islington, Sub reg district Islington East
Ed/Institution or vessel 5b
Household Schedule 539
Arthur lived with his father, mother and 2 other siblings (Ellen J and George E)
The main Occupation of the household was Tailor and dressmaker
(Class: RG10; Piece: 279; Folio: 80; Page: 32; GSU roll: 824920)

1881 (3rd April) Census:
Arthur Chamberlain aged 24 born around 1857 in  Tottenham, Middlesex, England..  Head of household, Spouse Elizabeth (status married) aged 22 born around 1859 in Dublin Ireland.
Occupation Private in 7th Hussars
Registration district Elham, Sub Reg District Folkstone, Ed/Institution or vessel 12
Civil Parish Cheriton, County Kent Street address ‘Chapel Street’.
(Class: RG11; Piece: 1093; Folio: 51; Page: 26; Line:  ; GSU roll: 1341257)

9
London and Middlesex / Re: The Chamberlain Family - London
« on: Thursday 31 December 15 14:23 GMT (UK)  »
Oral history – Summary of main points
- There was a family mystery over Horace Colbert Chamberlain's origins
- The 'general' family view was that he was born into a well-to-do family
- His father was in the Queens Hussar's and in early childhood they lived a military life.
- He was apparently born in the barracks in ‘Famoye’ Ireland
- At some point his father died (in the army) and his mother remarried someone in the military.
- Horace's step father was understood as being strict and brutal which led to Horace running away from home at the age of 16.  Horace recalled having to always clean his step father’s riding boots.
- Apparently he used-up his inheritance before meeting Jane Hagger his future wife
- Horace married Jane Hagger in the East End, living close to a number of the wider Hagger family members
- Horace worked on the railways as Carman (my father, Horace’s grandson still has his railway whistle somewhere)
- Horace had moved from a well-to-do standard of living to a very poor life and it was apparently viewed not so well with the Chamberlain family
- My grandmother reported visiting the dressmakers shop in North London several times in her childhood to visit her Aunt Annie (assuming this is Annie Pimm nee Chamberlain) and vaguely remembered one of the sisters.
- Annie apparently was known as ‘Press’ by the children (the name could have been misunderstood by me when taking notes) and lived Brentwood.
- She remembered her Aunt as being quite austere and their home and shop being the height of luxury and a considerably higher standard of living than theirs.
- She recalled being told that Aunt Annie was well educated and attended a finishing school in Paris
- One recollection was the detail regarding the Ceremonial military Helmets designed and made by Ernest William Pimm Annie’s husband.  He was apparently well known internationally for he’s products and produced those ‘spiked’ helmets worn by the Kaiser of Germany.
- Horace played a part in the 1st World War but he never mentioned a word or talked about it with his family.
- Horace was quite an austere but loving father and insisted on educating his children and instilling manners at all cost. 
- There was a hierarchy of respect with Horace’s children with the eldest son having his own room in an already small house in the East End.  The other children slept in the same bed 
- Annie his sister was apparently quite upset at Horace’s funeral as she thought he should be placed in the family grave

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