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Messages - RufyGH

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Carlow / Re: James Hopkins Born 1879 County Carlow - Hopkins Family Tree
« on: Thursday 13 June 19 21:29 BST (UK)  »
I have some more information about Nicholas Hopkins, cooper of Tullow, James' father that I pieced together when reconstructing all the Hopkins families around Clonegal.  I used the St. Fiaac's parish registers (see http://issuu.com/churchofireland/docs/clonegal_ferns) to trace all the baptisms, marriages and burials for Hopkins in the area and found the following evidence for Nicholas Hopkins [1826-1913]

Nicholas was baptised under his mother's maiden name on 27 AUG 1826 a week before his parents, Benjamin Hopkins of Garryhasten and Mary White married on 3 SEP 1826. 

Nicholas was also linked to his father by a shared profession - cooper - and also by the fact that I believe one of Nicholas's daughters (with wife Margaret McWilliams), Mary Jane Hopkins born in Tullow 1858, died (probably whilst visiting her grandparents at Garryhasten) in 1861 as she was buried in St. Fiaac's graveyard in Clonegal. 

Nicholas appeared to have moved to the parish of Tullow away from his Garryhasten siblings.  There may have been other Hopkins family connections in this area as the name is prevalent in the parish registers and there was another man - James Hopkins - working as a cooper in Tullowbeg.  It is possible that the Nicholas Hopkins I've found in Tullow could have been a sibling of this man, but for the time being, I'm persuaded by the other evidence I've found that there is a good connection between this man and the Garryhasten Hopkins.

Nicholas also appeared to have been a prolific sire - fathering 17 children with 2 different wives (1. Jane Gregg and 2. Margaret McWilliams) between the ages of 28 and 65(!) given his presumed 1826 birthdate.  However, later evidence for him (censuses and presumed death certificate) has his birthdate wandering quite alarmingly over nearly a 20 year period!
- 1901 census has him aged 60 and ba 1841 in Co. Wexford - this record corroborates him being a widower and cooper living at the Course, Tullow with 2 of his children by 2nd wife, Margaret.
- 1911 census has him aged 89 and ba 1822 in Co, Carlow, yet still living at the Course and as a widower cooper with his youngest daughter, Barbara.
- 1913 death candidate has him aged 76 and ba 1837, widower cooper dying in Tullow.

It could of course be 2 different men named Nicholas Hopkins who happened to be coopers in the Tullow area but I think the other corroborating evidence makes it more likely it is one and the same man.

Given I think he was the son of Benjamin Hopkins and Mary White of Garryhasten, I have also gone back a few more generations as follows (full citations recorded but some of the evidence is circumstantial e.g. shared graves, as the records for St. Fiaac's only date from 1792.)

I think that his father Benjamin Hopkins [1801-1884] was the son of Robert Hopkins [1762-1839] and his wife Jane (no marriage found yet.)  Benjamin was one of 7 siblings, two of whom had Gough as their middle name so this is perhaps a clue to their mother's maiden name - I haven't proved this yet?  Benjamin, like his son, also married twice - secondly to Margaret Doyle in 1842.  He had 3 sons with Mary White and 7 further children with Margaret Doyle.

Robert Hopkins was the son of Nicholas Hopkins [?-1787] and his wife, Sarah Brown [1735-1802] and was buried with them in St. Fiaac's churchyard.  I descend from Robert's presumed sister, Susannah Hopkins [1773-1844] who married a William Hopkins [1768-1809]  According to William's will, he had 2 brothers, Benjamin and Edward Hopkins both of Ballard Co. Wicklow, so perhaps she married a cousin?

2
Wicklow / Re: Jones and Sharp of Baltinglass/Hackettstown
« on: Saturday 07 January 17 17:43 GMT (UK)  »
Hi Sally,

I've responded to your private message this morning, so do get in touch as I think we have more information for you.

Regards

Ruth

3
Wicklow / Re: Jones and Sharp of Baltinglass/Hackettstown
« on: Sunday 10 February 13 16:40 GMT (UK)  »
Hi Charlie,

Thanks very much for the new photo - as the graves are all side by side with the same name, can we confidently assume a family connection do you think?

The Kilkenny link you found is very interesting as Robert Patton Jones's wife, Eliza(beth) Empson was the daughter of a Joseph Empson of Kilkenny and they married in what I assume is her parish church, St. Mary's, Kilkenny in 1852.  Joseph appears to have been a very significant landlord in Kilkenny according to Griffiths Valuations of the time and assuming there are not mutiple Joseph Empson's - it does appear to be a relatively uncommon name.

I've got some estate sale papers that I downloaded from FindMyPast Ireland that mention several generations of Jones's in this part of Carlow which I'll have a go at transcribing and interpreting or do you have this information already - your brother GSJ mentioned land papers he had in an earlier post.

Thanks

4
Wicklow / Re: Jones and Sharp of Baltinglass/Hackettstown
« on: Thursday 07 February 13 14:49 GMT (UK)  »
Hi Charlie,

I posted the following reply to your post on the 3rd but it never got through, so posting it again...

Thank you very much for sharing the fruits of your labours in the long grass! Here's what I can add to the inscriptions;

Robert Patton Jones married Eliza Empson in 1852 so the Shepard F Jones sharing the grave with Robert's father could be their son (ba1859?)  This would fit a gap between children I know of from a handwritten family tree I inherited from my father but this Shepard doesn't appear on it? Not always completely accurate I know (there are other discrepancies on it.)  Only ordering the death certificate would solve the mystery I suppose, as his death is registered in Shillelagh in 1876. 

The other occupant of the grave is Ellen Anne Jones - both her Aug 1881 burial record and that of Robert P Jones are online via http://churchrecords.irishgenealogy.ie  Her estimated birth year of 1864/5 could make her a daughter of Robert & Eliza but again she doesn't appear on the family tree but there is a baptism for a daughter named Martha in May 1865? (see FamilySearch.org for named parents.)  I couldn't find a reliable entry in the death indexes for her though that matched with an August burial?

I can't add anything to what you found on the other 2 headstones, but the name Disney did crop up in a message to me from GSJ and he definitely has land records linked to Newtown Saunders - so he may see this and reply too.

The Francis Jones may have been a contemporary/relation of Shepard Jones senior as that name appears above his in a list of Carlow voters in 1837 (see http:://www.igp-web/Carlow) and I found someone named Francis Jones listed as a cloth dealer there in Pigot's 1824 directory.

The only online parish records I could find for Hacketstown only go back as far as 1878 it appears - any ideas if earlier ones exist in Carlow archives?

I'm sure that there are definite links between all these Jones's but as ever with such a common surname it's so difficult to be sure unless you reconstruct all the families!

Do let me know if you find any more!

RE: Headstone pictures - thank you very much, these are all ancestors of mine, so lovely to see them.

I'll need to have a bit more of a think about the Dora Jones you found as the one I found was for 1873 (see earlier posts)

Thanks

5
Carlow / Re: St Fiaac's Church, Clonegal
« on: Sunday 03 February 13 15:54 GMT (UK)  »
Hi Richard,

You'll find transcribed parish registers for St. Fiaacs from 1792-1903 at http://issuu.com/churchofireland/docs/clonegal_ferns and there are also transcribed headstones at http://www.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~irlcar2/Clonegal_Churchyard.htm

Enjoy!

6
Wicklow / Re: Jones and Sharp of Baltinglass/Hackettstown
« on: Wednesday 26 December 12 16:38 GMT (UK)  »
Hi Glen,

As you can see from my earlier posts I am also interested in Sheppard Jones of Woodside, Co. Carlow and I've done a bit more research & would be interested to see this fits in with your research.

According to my ancestor Robert Patton Jones' 1852 wedding record his father was Sheppard Jones of Woodside.  Robert's death record in 1878 has him born about 1819 but I have not found a baptism yet.  Therefore I concluded that the Sheppard Jones listed in the 1823/26 tithe records for 3 Hacketstown townlands and the S. Jones, Esq. of Woodside listed in Samuel Lewis's 1837 Topographical Index was his father.  As stated in my earlier post there used to be an uncorroborated record on the old IGI for a Sheppard Jones marrying a Dorothea Smith in 1805 but this has since been removed in the new version of the site.

However, I did find a death announcement in the Freeman's Journal in 1873 for a Dora Jones, widow of a Sheppard Jones of Newtown-Saunders, Baltinglass aged 95 so ba1778?  This also suggests husband Sheppard died sometime before 1873.  I think he is still listed in Griffiths' Valuation for both Woodside and Newtown-Saunders townlands in 1852 and then his son Robert is listed as the principal farmer at Woodside in 1876 landowwners records, so I think this all fits but I would have to find a death record for Sheppard to be sure.  Who is the Sheppard Jones you find born to John in 1814 that you have as a candidate for the Griffiths records?

Mind you it's not as uncommon a name as you might have thought - I also found a Shephard Jones married to a Dorothea Anne whose daughter Mary Ellen birth is registered in Baltinglass in January 1865 and a Shepherd Jones, widower, marrying a Matilda Nicholson in Monkstown, Dublin in August 1865?  Same man?!  No death record for a Dorothea Jones but this is just at the start of civil registration so might not have been recorded?  These Sheppard Jones's would have to have been born sometime in the 1840's or before?

I too also found a record of a John Jones of Woodside for Hacketstown Graveyard that seemed to suggest he died in his 99th(!) year in 1830 making him born about 1731?  Sheppard's grandfather perhaps?

Can you tell me a bit more about your Sheppard Jones=Dorothea marriage and their children please to see if it fits with any of my research ideas?

Thanks

7
Wicklow / Re: Jones and Sharp of Baltinglass/Hackettstown
« on: Friday 27 May 11 10:48 BST (UK)  »
Ok - hopefully this counts as my 3rd post and I can now send messages!

8
Wicklow / Re: Jones and Sharp of Baltinglass/Hackettstown
« on: Thursday 26 May 11 14:48 BST (UK)  »
Hi cumminswr,

How interesting to hear from someone new after posting this message nearly 3 years ago! 
I have done quite a bit more research since then and if your wife is a grand-daughter of Eva Jane Jones, I have at least 5 candidates for whom she could be courtesy of a hand written family tree from the 1950's probably via my grandmother Dorothy Grant Jones, Eva's sister!   My Aunt Millicent is still alive and remembers so much - perhaps your wife knows her or met her?
Thank you for the information regarding the burial place of (the original) PopPop and GranGran, I did not know this.  Did your wife know that Agnes Eva Allen was Scottish?  I have traced her line back to the end of the 18th century in Scotland.  The Jones line in Ireland is proving much more difficult of course.  Do you know anything more about the Jones' of Woodside?  Did Robert Patton Jones have siblings and I wonder where his middle name comes from?  The Empsons were from Kilkenny.
Would love to correspond further, but unfortunately we cannot use the personal message facility yet (sorry RoryT!)

9
Wicklow / Re: Jones and Sharp of Baltinglass/Hackettstown
« on: Tuesday 05 August 08 16:04 BST (UK)  »
Hi RoryT,

I'm descended from the Jones of Woodside, Hacketstown and being based in England, I'm struggling to get further back than Great-Grands, so your post is really intriguing and I hope you might be able to help me.  Here's what I know so far - does it link to any of your finds?

My great-grandfather was William Empson Jones of Woodside, Hacketstown who married Agnes Eva Allan in Greenock in 1883 (I've got much further back on her line.) 

William's father was Robert P Jones, farmer (deceased at the time of the wedding) - "P" possibly Patton or Patten, sadly doesn't look like Peppard on the marriage entry.  William's mother was an Empson. 

Robert P Jones is listed as the landowner of Woodside in 1876. 

Griffiths Valuations 1848-1864 lists a Sheppard Jones as the landowner of Woodside - Robert's father / uncle / older brother perhaps? 

IGI has a record of a Shepherd Jones born (abt. 1780) marrying a Dorothea Smith born (abt. 1784) in 1805, all in Kildare, but I can't corroborate this anywhere else.

Do you recognise any of these names?

Thanks

RufyGH

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