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Messages - Leanne888

Pages: [1] 2
1
New Zealand Completed Requests / Re: Taupo, Taranaki, Bay Of Plenty Whakapapa *COMPLETED*
« on: Wednesday 04 January 12 01:17 GMT (UK)  »
I did see that programme. I thoroughly enjoyed it too.

Yes I have debated over registering for quite a while and the online form looks simple enough. Might just have to do it now. Thanks for the extra motivation :)

Quote from: althea on Tuesday 03 January 12 21:43 GMT (UK)
They are Whakatohoe and NgaPuhi..not related

My interest is from the Thames Connection and Nicholls from a history perspective

If you are a descendant, the degree doesn't matter
I recently got my sons registered to the Northland iwi..its a very simple process..most have online registrations or send you the forms
Its a great way to get foot in the door and I know in their case, at this stage I didn't know the hapu and they found it out for me

so quite normal and they would only welcome you
did you see the Missing pieces programme on NZ newsreader
Discovering his maori connection, very interesting
http://tvnz.co.nz/the-missing-piece/themissingpiece-s1-e1-video-4502825


2
New Zealand Completed Requests / Re: Taupo, Taranaki, Bay Of Plenty Whakapapa *COMPLETED*
« on: Tuesday 03 January 12 20:59 GMT (UK)  »
I'm not registerd - I would like to be, but I'm only 1/64th maori, so I wonder if they will think that's odd?

Re: Gate Pa.... my GGG Grandfather Richard Hartley Cartman fought in the Battle of Gate Pa, and then married the niece (Susan Huhana Nicholls) of chief Te Moananui, who he would have fought against, some years later.

Are your sons descended from one of the Nicholls siblings, just out of interest?



Quote from: althea on Tuesday 03 January 12 08:37 GMT (UK)
Are you registered with the iwi?
Some emails to the surrounding Katikati and Matakana Maraes..should help finalise the connections
I know what you mean about the land lots..my sons are just the same..with lots of ownershipnspread out over a quite large area

Yours is complicated more -  those land ownership and sales disputes show that confusion existed between maori owners and the crown alike..no doubt heightened by the changes that seem to kept happening in the iwi itself..past affiliations to other areas etc.

Look forward to what you find out..keep us posted
Bye
althea

PS. I find it extra interesting as my Earl's & Cornes setlled on some of the land in question following the Gate Pa battles.  The Katikati Historical Society/Museum may know more of the history


3
New Zealand Completed Requests / Re: Taupo, Taranaki, Bay Of Plenty Whakapapa *COMPLETED*
« on: Tuesday 03 January 12 06:13 GMT (UK)  »
ok thanks.

I've driven past the Rereatukahia Marae. I traced most of the maori land that my GG grandmother Belle Steadman was a trustee of. There are blocks of land at Whakamarama and Rereatukahia (between Tauranga and Katikati, across from Matakana Island) and also on Matakana Island. I have visited all but the Matakana Island blocks.

I thought that the main marae would be Kutaroa (not mentioned on the Ngaiterangi website, but it's a small marae near Opureora Marae) or Opureora on Matakana Island - because there's a block of land still in 2 of Belle's granddaughter's names... and because Te Whakaawa is buried at Te Ahi Puhipuhi, which is the Kutaroa Cemetery on Matakana Island and is actually part of the block of land that Belle's granddaughters are trustees of. But I've also heard mention of a Te Aroha marae being the main marae with respect to Susan and her mother Te Whakaawa.

I see that the custodian of Opureora Marae is (*). The Kuka's/Ngarae's were cousins of the Nicholls family.

I won't rest til we get to the bottom of it all ha ha.




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4
New Zealand Completed Requests / Re: Taupo, Taranaki, Bay Of Plenty Whakapapa *COMPLETED*
« on: Tuesday 03 January 12 05:51 GMT (UK)  »
What is Sooty's pages? Excuse my ignorance ;)

I just found this link that says Ngatimura is a hapu of Ngaitamahariwa and refers to Te Moananui. So confusing.   http://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/cgi-bin/paperspast?a=d&d=BOPT18840207.2.11&l=mi&e=-------10--1----2--

Yes, I should email someone from the ngaiterangi website direct. Thanks for that.

Quote from: althea on Tuesday 03 January 12 05:29 GMT (UK)
far from an authority but we are talking 1600s that this main movement took place
then later the subtribes develop as numbers increase/merges increase

actually christine of Sooty's pages would be an excellent person to email as a specialist in many areas including the coastal areas on that coast
Bye
Althea

Heres the main iwi page
http://www.ngaiterangi.org.nz/
would be worthwhile emailing them and asking them direct

5
New Zealand Completed Requests / Re: Taupo, Taranaki, Bay Of Plenty Whakapapa *COMPLETED*
« on: Tuesday 03 January 12 04:47 GMT (UK)  »
So true Althea.

I just stumbled upon this census link and it lists Ngatimura as a hapu/subtribe of Ngaiterangi... http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~sooty/maoricensus1881.html

Perhaps some Ngatimura traveled up to Tauranga from Tuhoe, and more or less merged with Ngaiterangi?

Quote from: althea on Tuesday 03 January 12 02:35 GMT (UK)
Yes that's how I'm reading it..we forget that quite a few tribes moved about 100s of years ago as settlement areas/battle occured....here is the history from that Matakana marae site

6
New Zealand Completed Requests / Re: Taupo, Taranaki, Bay Of Plenty Whakapapa *COMPLETED*
« on: Tuesday 03 January 12 02:00 GMT (UK)  »
Oops, just realised I referred to Ani as Ani Ngarae - her married name was Ani Kuka in case I was confusing anyone ;)

Quote from: Leanne888 on Tuesday 03 January 12 01:53 GMT (UK)
Thanks for that. I'm finding lots of articles on land secretly sold by Te Moananui.

Ngaiterangi  with Ngati Tauaiti as the hapu looks like it's correct as per WG Nicholls obituary, handwritten notes passed down to me and also I found a bunch of information on Susan Nicholls' first cousin Ani Ngarae. Ani and Susan's mothers were sisters - and it says she is Ngaiterangi - Ngati Tauaiti.

Check out page 317 of this link: http://www.waitangi-tribunal.govt.nz/scripts/reports/reports/215/2BBA26FD-7387-42CB-9716-F33598334C2E.pdf (says Ngarae is Te Moananui's sister - and we know Te Whakaawa was Te Moananui's eldest sister, so they are all siblings).

Here's the info on Ani Ngarae (who also features in the Land Caution article on Rereatukahia and on behalf of Ngatimura): http://www.library.tauranga.govt.nz/Default.aspx?TabID=1787&SkinSrc=[G]Skins/Library2011/PrintTemplate&ContainerSrc=[G]Containers/Library2011/Standard&dnnprintmode=true

Just checking out your Ngatimura link now :)


Quote from: althea on Monday 02 January 12 22:39 GMT (UK)
Have got that book, will have a look

The best book on Hauraki tribes is
"Te Takoto o Te Whenua O Hauraki - Hauraki Landmarks"
by Taimoana Turua and Charles Royal

Included are details of Katikati and the tribal connection, early tribal intermarriages forming a link..but many battles

I think that Susan was definitely Ngati Mura
So very much the Katikati base and close Matakana connections..when you look at  amap you can see how close they were then connected..if nothingelse physically to the Te Aroha maori and the MARUTUAHU confederation of tribes..of which Ngati Maru are part
there were lots of passage backwards and forwards and the odd battle

7
New Zealand Completed Requests / Re: Taupo, Taranaki, Bay Of Plenty Whakapapa *COMPLETED*
« on: Tuesday 03 January 12 01:58 GMT (UK)  »
Great stuff. I've now seen Te Moananui referred to as Ngaiterangi and now Ngatimura. Same with Ani Ngarae. So it would appear they were Ngaiterangi AND Ngatimura. Is that the impression you're getting?

I'm just wondering how a Tuhoe tribe found it's way up to the Hauraki/Tauranga Moana region. Must hunt out a book on the subject :)

Quote from: althea on Tuesday 03 January 12 01:35 GMT (UK)
1884
http://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/cgi-bin/paperspast?a=d&cl=search&d=BOPT18840318.2.8&srpos=7&e=-------10--1-byDA---2ngatimura--
some great court cases over the land Ngatimura and Te Moananui claims over ownership of Matakana
great lineage descriptions and how they all intertwine
ye
althea

8
New Zealand Completed Requests / Re: Taupo, Taranaki, Bay Of Plenty Whakapapa *COMPLETED*
« on: Tuesday 03 January 12 01:53 GMT (UK)  »
Thanks for that. I'm finding lots of articles on land secretly sold by Te Moananui.

Ngaiterangi  with Ngati Tauaiti as the hapu looks like it's correct as per WG Nicholls obituary, handwritten notes passed down to me and also I found a bunch of information on Susan Nicholls' first cousin Ani Ngarae. Ani and Susan's mothers were sisters - and it says she is Ngaiterangi - Ngati Tauaiti.

Check out page 317 of this link: http://www.waitangi-tribunal.govt.nz/scripts/reports/reports/215/2BBA26FD-7387-42CB-9716-F33598334C2E.pdf (says Ngarae is Te Moananui's sister - and we know Te Whakaawa was Te Moananui's eldest sister, so they are all siblings).

Here's the info on Ani Ngarae (who also features in the Land Caution article on Rereatukahia and on behalf of Ngatimura): http://www.library.tauranga.govt.nz/Default.aspx?TabID=1787&SkinSrc=[G]Skins/Library2011/PrintTemplate&ContainerSrc=[G]Containers/Library2011/Standard&dnnprintmode=true

Just checking out your Ngatimura link now :)


Quote from: althea on Monday 02 January 12 22:39 GMT (UK)
Have got that book, will have a look

The best book on Hauraki tribes is
"Te Takoto o Te Whenua O Hauraki - Hauraki Landmarks"
by Taimoana Turua and Charles Royal

Included are details of Katikati and the tribal connection, early tribal intermarriages forming a link..but many battles

I think that Susan was definitely Ngati Mura
So very much the Katikati base and close Matakana connections..when you look at  amap you can see how close they were then connected..if nothingelse physically to the Te Aroha maori and the MARUTUAHU confederation of tribes..of which Ngati Maru are part
there were lots of passage backwards and forwards and the odd battle

9
New Zealand Completed Requests / Re: Taupo, Taranaki, Bay Of Plenty Whakapapa *COMPLETED*
« on: Monday 02 January 12 22:08 GMT (UK)  »
Hi Althea

Only from what I've found on the net, the Ngati Maru (Hauraki) rohe extends from Warkworth and Great Barrier Island, to as far south as Katikati -  and I can't tell if it quite includes Matakana Island or not - but it's very close to including Matakana Island if it doesn't. I have know idea how official this map is though.

I found an excerpt from a book that features William Grey Nicholls' (son of William and Te Whakaawa Nicholls) wife Rihitoto Mataia and there's quite alot of talk about Ngati Maru - but then that might be her tribe, and not necessarily relate to the Nicholls'. Here's the link:

http://books.google.co.nz/books?id=_bFIjBgnPUYC&pg=PA53&lpg=PA53&dq=rihitoto+mataia&source=bl&ots=k2nMMYXren&sig=37zVz82PgVL_SmBFggiak4tRkIg&hl=en&sa=X&ei=iigCT638EaWWiQfC5ISlAQ&ved=0CB0Q6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=rihitoto%20mataia&f=false

The plot thickens ;) Enjoying brainstorming with you.

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