RootsChat.Com

It's hard, really hit and miss, to find any records that far back in Ireland. It helps if you know a parish.

If you've done DNA testing, there's a Mannion by DNA Facebook group that might be useful. Or even one of the generic Galway groups on there. (Mannion being the common Irish spelling of the name.)

Good luck!

Hi Joe,

You're right ... I had no specific question; I was simply throwing out a net. Stranorlar is, or was, a small town, and I've never found any relatives connected with that Boyle family -- I know there were Boyles living in Stranorlar during that period, but I have inadequate data for distinguishing them. I figured it was reasonable simply to send out a call to possible fellow descendants, lest one have heard of Owen or of Patrick and have gone searching. For all I know, Owen may have had nearly a dozen siblings, many of whom might have emigrated to the US.

A call in the night.

That, I suppose, will have faded away by dawn.

Hi Alan,

This is where a time machine would come in handy. I could zoom back there and invite all the local Foremans to tea and sort them out. Pin them down. Grill them.

I saw those listings some years ago (though I'm grateful that you've brought them back to my attention, because I have better ways of sifting through them now). Foreman was a somewhat common name in the area, and so was William, but ... that doesn't mean that the William(s) you've listed are irrelevant.

How to know?

For one thing, given that Shilbottle is closer (I think) to Felton and Warkworth, why would the baptisms have been held in Alnwick? Family connections, I assume. Or, perhaps 1769 preceded the presence of a Dissenters' church in Shilbottle? That might be true; again, I don't know.

My Foremans were definitely weavers, or at any rate William Foreman/Forman (Jane's likely father) was listed here and there as a "stocking weaver" or "hosier."

But if he re-married in Perth, had he travelled from Perth to Shilbottle to marry Jane? Or had he brought Jane to Shilbottle?? Or were all of those weavers travelers???

A time machine, or a good family Bible, or a sheaf of old correspondence is needed here.

Patricia

That's how life seems to work, isn't it? It's all patterns and synchronicities (if only I could find the thread!). Yep, probably cousins (probably never prove it though, sigh).

Off to dreamland now .... maybe to the ancient dales of the Coquet. That sounds peaceful!

Hi Craclyn -- That was a surprisingly speedy reply to a desultory posting (I periodically give up and then later revive this research for short spurts of time). Thanks!

Chris and I are both descended, along different lines, from Jane Foreman Bell, and we've each done plenty of research, though we haven't corresponded in about six years. I live in the US, but I know he visited Alnwick & Shilbottle and did some thorough research on-site, including at the Durham archives and the churches in the Alnwick/Shilbottle area, that I was unable to do. It was he who discovered the birth and death in infancy of the otherwise unknown first daughter "baby Jane," whose short existence threw a proverbial wrench into the naming pattern we'd previously been working with. But Jane (the mother) Foreman's family was definitely Nonconformist and we've found no birth record anywhere for her. (And now I'll stop writing "we" and take responsibility for my own research.)

I have in my possession a copy of a photo of Jane as an old woman. Her granddaughter wrote on the back of it sometime during the late 1800s: "Mrs. Robert Bell of Alnwick, Northumberland, England, Jane Foreman -- Born at Shilbottle near Alnwick 1778 -- Died at Alnwick March 3, 1866, aged 88 years. Photo taken at 84 years."

The death date is correct so I assume that the birth data is also correct, or close enough. (Others believe she was born in 1780.)

That same granddaughter received a letter from a sibling in 1886 noting that "Grandmother Bell was known as the bonny lass of Coquet-side, so she must have been born there I presume; where she was married I do not know. Her father & mother being dead before I was born. Dr. Foreman was grandmother’s brother, it seems to me he had something to do with some West India Island, but I forget what...."

Other family mentions in that 1886 letter are accurate, so again I'm assuming that the quote above is as well. Aside from her 1802 marriage certificate, the 1841-1861 census listings, and her 1866 death certificate, that's it for records.

Since then the few clues I've been pursuing are the "doctor brother" and the witnesses to Jane's marriage (William Foreman and Thomas Johnson). I'm fairly certain that I've identified the doctor brother, who was indeed the son of a William Foreman but by a second marriage of William's in 1781 in Perth (they moved from there to Glasgow). Just enough time for William to meet and marry a new wife after the apparent death of Jane's mother sometime between 1778 and 1781. Either William senior -- or a brother named William -- could have been witness to Jane's wedding in 1802. But ... I have no idea what the Thomas Johnson connection is unless Jane's mother was a Jane or Eleanor Johnson, or had a maternal grandmother named Johnson. I haven't found a candidate yet. (Hmm, I see you have Johnsons listed as an area of interest!)

As for the Groat Market Meeting House baptisms, 1776 seems too early for Jane, and there is no Thomas among her children or grandchildren, so it doesn't ring true. But thank you for pointing to that possibility.

(Note: the candidate "doctor brother" was born in Glasgow in 1794 and was later president of the Swedenborgian church there. How's that for Nonconformist?!)

Patricia