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Messages - BallyaltikilliganG

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19
Ireland / Re: Margaret Barrons
« on: Sunday 18 April 21 10:47 BST (UK)  »
I thought this is a chance to find the few possible locations in Ireland.  John
Grenham ‘s website started my search well, https://www.johngrenham.com giving several catholic marriages new records and he lists alternative spellings as  Barrens and Barrins
I then tried using one source Tithe Applotment Books 1823-1837
to locate the possible place james Barrons might have come from
1.Tithe Applotment Books 1823-1837 Part 1 in the 26 counties
http://titheapplotmentbooks.nationalarchives.ie/search/tab/index.jsp 
Barren has 53 entries
Barron has 243 entries
Barrin non entries
Barrens   Henry      Crumlin   Kilmore   Monaghan   1825
Barrens   Thomas   Denover   Moynalty   Meath   1827
Barrens   Thos      Denover   Moynalty   Meath   1827
Barrens   Thomas   Shanearn   Moynalty   Meath   1827
Barrens         Baltrasna   Moynalty   Meath   1827
Barrens   Patrick      Shelbagin   St James and Dunbrody   Wexford1833
Barrins    none
Barrons         Shanakill   St Patrick's   Limerick, Clare   1825
2. Tithe Applotment Books 1823-1837 Part 2 in the 6 counties originals in PRONI, Belfast
my index of the Irish Gemealogy Hub listing by parish see http://www.irishgenealogyhub.com/
Barren, Charles-Townland: Derrahollow Year: 1832-Belleek-Fermanagh
Barren, Dr. Townland: Edenderry Year: 1828-Seapatrick-Down
Barren, James-T: Unagh Y: 1827-Lissan-Derry & Lissan
Barren, James-T: Unagh Y: 1827-Lissan-Tyrone
Barrens, Henry-Townland: Derryarnish Year: 1834-Aghagallon-Antrim
Barrens, John-Townland: Moyntaghs Year: 1834-Aghagallon-Antrim
Barrens, Robt.-Townland: Ballycavin Year: 1834-Aghagallon-Antrim
Barrens, Widow Townland: Deerpark Year: 1834--Glenavy-Antrim
Barrens, William-Townland: Derryarnish Year: 1834-Aghagallon-Antrim
Barrin/Barrins no entries
Barron, Andw.-- Townland: Divernagh (Whaley) Year: 1835-Killevy-Armagh
Barron, Andw.-- Townland: Divernagh (Whaley) Year: 1835-Killyman-Armagh
Barron, Charles-- Townland: Divernagh (Whaley) Year: 1835-Killevy-Armagh
Barron, Charles-- Townland: Divernagh (Whaley) Year: 1835-Killyman-Armagh
Barron, Chas.-- Townland: Divernagh (Whaley) Year: 1835-Killevy-Armagh
Barron, Chas.-- Townland: Divernagh (Whaley) Year: 1835-Killyman-Armagh
Barron, J. Counselor-Townland: Kinghill Year: 1834- Clonduff-Down
Barron, James-- Townland: Divernagh (Whaley) Year: 1835-Killevy-Armagh
Barron, James-- Townland: Divernagh (Whaley) Year: 1835-Killyman-Armagh
Barron, James-T: Stughanbeg Y: 1826-Tullyniskan-Tyrone
Barron, James-Townland: Carmavey Year: 1827-Killead-Antrim
Barron, Jas., Jr.-Townland: Loughmorne Year: 1816-Carrickfergus-Antrim
Barron, Jno.-Townland: Loughmorne Year: 1816-Carrickfergus-Antrim
Barron, John-Townland: Ballylinney Year: 1835- Ballylinny-Antrim
Barron, John-Townland: Ballylinny Year: 1835- Carnmoney-Antrim
Barron, John-Townland: Carneil Year: 1830-Raloo-Antrim
Barron, John-Townland: Carneil Year: 1830-Ramoan-Antrim
Barron, John-Townland: Ednigo Year: 1834-Dromore-Down
Barron, John-Townland: Lisnaward Year: 1834-Dromore-Down
Barron, John-Townland: Loughmorne Year: 1816-Carrickfergus-Antrim
Barron, John-Townland: Monkstown Year: 1835- Carnmoney-Antrim
Barron, John-Townland: Slunmerow Year: 1816-Carrickfergus-Antrim
Barron, John-Townland: Toneylisderritt Year: 1834-Cleenish-Fermanagh
to be continued

20
Down / Re: Tullyorior, Banbridge
« on: Tuesday 13 April 21 19:56 BST (UK)  »
I couldn’t resist a factual reply to include the Tithe Applotment books my past favourite census sbstitute, in case something is useful on Tullyorier or some of the last names mentioned,
1796  Flax Growers
https://www.failteromhat.com/flax/down.php
there are over 40 entries for Garvaghy no entry for Shaw, they do include
Byrne             Edward               Garvaghy                        Down
Byrne             Valentine            Garvaghy                        Down
1834 Tithe Applotment books
http://www.irishgenealogyhub.com/down/tithe-applotment-books/garvaghy-parish.php
these are just one liners name and size of land or value of building or both. originals in PRONI  to have 8 entries in one townland. 
Down
Byrne, Art.-Townland: Tullyorier Year: 1834-Garvaghy-Down
Byrne, Bernard-Townland: Tullyorier Year: 1834-Garvaghy-Down
Byrne, Danl.-Townland: Tullyorier Year: 1834-Garvaghy-Down
Byrne, Edward-Townland: Tullyorier Year: 1834-Garvaghy-Down
Byrne, Felix-Townland: Tullyorier Year: 1834-Garvaghy-Down
Byrne, Henery-Townland: Tullyorier Year: 1834-Garvaghy-Down
Byrne, Hugh-Townland: Tullyorier Year: 1834-Garvaghy-Down
Byrne, Ilica-Townland: Tullyorier Year: 1834-Garvaghy-Down
Byrne, James-Townland: Corbally Year: 1834-Garvaghy-Down
Byrne, Jno.-Townland: Tullyorier Year: 1834-Garvaghy-Down
Byrne, John-Townland: Corbally Year: 1834-Garvaghy-Down
Byrne, Patt.-Townland: Kilkinamurry Year: 1834-Garvaghy-Down
Byrne, Patt.-Townland: Tullyorier Year: 1834-Garvaghy-Down
Byrne, Widow Townland: Tullyorier Year: 1834-Garvaghy-Down
Maclory, Hugh Townland: Tullyorier Year: 1834
Maclory, Manus Townland: Tullyorier Year: 1834
McClory, Hugh Townland: Tullyorier Year: 1834
McClory, Pat. Townland: Tullyorier Year: 1834
McShane none found
McShean, Hugh-Townland: Tullyorier Year: 1834-Garvaghy-Down
McShean, Rodger-Townland: Tullyorier Year: 1834-Garvaghy-Down
Shaw, Hugh Townland: Carnew Year: 1834
Shaw, John Townland: Enogh Year: 1834
Shaw, Mark Townland: Tullyorier Year: 1834
Shaw, Mathew Townland: Tullyorier Year: 1834
Shaw, Matt. Townland: Tullyorier Year: 1834
Shaw, Michl. Townland: Tullyorier Year: 1834
Shaw, Mick. Townland: Tullyorier Year: 1834
Shaw, Thomas Townland: Tullyorier Year: 1834
Shaw, Thos. Townland: Tullyorier Year: 1834
Shaw, Widow Townland: Tullyorier Year: 1834
Griffiths valuation
 using quick index https://www.failteromhat.com/griffiths.php I didn’t have time to check other last names
Shaw, Anne L: Tullyorior
Shaw, Edward L: Tullyorior
Shaw, Elizabeth L: Carnew
Shaw, John L: Tullinisky
Shaw, John, Jr. L: Tullyorior
Shaw, John, Sr. L: Tullyorior
Shaw, Michael L: Killaney
Shaw, Michael L: Tullyorior N: Irish
Shaw, Michl. L: Tullyorior N: English
Shaw, Wm. L: Kilkinamurry N: and Another f
details including boundaries of homesteads see http://www.askaboutireland.ie/griffith-valuation/
eg Anne Shaw in 1863 in tullyorior has map ref 16 ABA in townland, has 5 acres and house valued at ten shillings pa
while looking up the reference I I realized there is a place named Shawstown the buildings are at the southern end of map ref 20B with blgs marked a&b, also in 19a its ~400ft from the river Bann. the properties starting with map area 16 are not visible to me there isa square block of blank space soory ran out of time
Ros Davies great Co down website has
Shawstown   Garvaghy   .   a house cluster in Tullyorior townland ; 5km SE of Banbridge; the last Shaw died in 1939   old b/w map G7; PNNI V6 p 207

hoping something of interest to you all and I can look up anything for mickwally with his kind offer, then I find out im patronizing him, he knows far more than I including garvaghy and Annaclone have shared blurry borders in the past. I noticed many of my listing had the same last name in Annaclone but ignored in my haste. then also AussieGaz research,  I must slowup & read everything sent already before jumping to answer
Good luck to you all onwards

21
Down / Re: RAINEY/ROBB - 1888 - Ballymacarrett
« on: Sunday 11 April 21 11:48 BST (UK)  »
Hi Margaret ACS, useing Aghadoweys source civil marriages i looked further back in time.  It would be worthwhile checking out https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1850/09384/5398916.pdf to give you a flavour
a Robert Rainey aged 22, so b ~ 1828 a xxxxx , of xxxxx ? Road,  son of xxxxxx Rainey,  so bbb 1812 a bleacher, m 29 June 1850  Registry office Belfast Mary XXXX aged 23, so b ~ 1827 of xxxxxx St  dau of Francis xxxxx a labourer. both used their marks to sign.   Witnesses a xxxxx Rainey and a Margaret xxxxx
could be a mixed marriage, its my first experience of a registry office marriage after many years of useing this wonderful source.
you need to check it out yourself agreeing to their simple condition.you can also buy official copies

to connect this information to your Robert might be by checking numerous street directories or finding burials etc Do you want more help?


22
Ireland / Re: Impossible Date And Out-Of-Sequence Numbering on 1870 Marriage
« on: Saturday 10 April 21 21:22 BST (UK)  »
thank you Maggsie, i'm still learning age 85

23
Ireland / Re: Impossible Date And Out-Of-Sequence Numbering on 1870 Marriage
« on: Friday 09 April 21 17:22 BST (UK)  »
of course you are correct,  the leap years around were 1868, 1872,.  That first entry for Miles Doyle is numbered as no 62
the next entry  No 60 or 66 is for 1st March John Forrestal marriage, the last entry is Patrick Sinnott marriage numbered 64.  At the bottom of the page this was a true copy of only two of the marriages marriages certified by John kennedy Superintendent registrar. The transcriber uses a developed style of exaggerating certain letter with a flourish scroll version  for chosen letters like P or d,
the page number stamp 7033 the next page 7034 dealing with January is by a different more accurate transcriber ,where there are year dates for every marriage,and no fancy scrolls.
I think a look at the real original if extanct would solve the problem of the transcriber. Perhaps  you have already reported it to ie  management.
well reported here, thank you.

24
Ireland / Re: Patrick Gilligan
« on: Friday 09 April 21 16:13 BST (UK)  »
http://titheapplotmentbooks.nationalarchives.ie/search/tab/results.jsp?surname=gilligan&firstname=&county=King%27s&townland=&parish=&search=Search&sort=&pageSize=&pager.offset=10

Gilligan   Patt      Lampcloone & Derrycarney   Gallen   King's   1823
Gilligan   Thomas   Lampcloone & Derrycarney   Gallen   King's   1823
Gilligan   Peter      Lampcloone & Derrycarney   Gallen   King's   1823
Gilligan   Peter      Lompcloone   Gallen   King's   1823


Connor   William   Lumcloon   Gallen   King's   1823
Guinan         Lumcloon   Gallen   King's   1823
Guinan   Mark      Lumcloon   Gallen   King's   1823
Fitzsimmons   Thomas   Lumcloon   Gallen   King's   1823
Kenny            Lumcloon   Gallen   King's   1823
Temple   John      Lumcloon   Gallen   King's   1823

from griffiths valuation quick index is https://www.failteromhat.com/post1845.php
Gilligan   Patrick   Derrycarney   Gallen   Offaly
Gilligan   James      Noggusboy   Gallen   Offaly
Gilligan   James      Lumcloon   Gallen   Offaly
Gilligan   Denis      Noggusboy   Gallen   Offaly
Guinan   Peter      Attinkee   Gallen   Offaly
Guinan   Michael   Coolreagh or Cloghan Hill   Gallen   Offaly
Guinan   Thomas   Tn of Cloghan,(Creggan)   Gallen   Offaly
Guinan   Thomas   Stonestown   Gallen   Offaly
Guinan   Valentine   Minus Island   Gallen   Offaly
Guinan   Valentine   Clononybeg   Gallen   Offaly
Guinan   Martin   Lumcloon   Gallen   Offaly
Guinan   Laurence   Lumcloon   Gallen   Offaly
Guinan   John      Coolreagh or Cloghan Hill   Gallen   Offaly
Guinan   Daniel      Lumcloon   Gallen   Offaly
Guinan   John      Lumcloon   Gallen   Offaly
Guinan   John      Stonestown   Gallen   Offaly
Guinan   Lack      Stonestown   Gallen   Offaly
Guinan   Daniel      Creggan and Glosterboy   Gallen   Offaly

using askaboutireland just for Gilligan gives much more detail inc boundary map of property, somtimes leading to present dat street scene of the old homestead area on current google and satelite views etc.
http://www.askaboutireland.ie/griffith-valuation/
GILLIGAN   PATRICK   King's County (Offaly)   GALLEN
GILLIGAN   PATRICK   King's County (Offaly)   GALLEN
GILLIGAN   JAMES      King's County (Offaly)   GALLEN
GILLIGAN   DENIS      King's County (Offaly)   GALLEN
GILLIGAN   JAMES      King's County (Offaly)   GALLEN
GILLIGAN   DENIS      King's County (Offaly)   GALLEN
GILLIGAN   JAMES      King's County (Offaly)   GALLEN
GILLIGAN   DENIS      King's County (Offaly)   GALLEN            
GILLIGAN   JAMES      King's County (Offaly)   GALLEN   
looking one up , on this website  the first James is in Lumcloon
GILLIGAN   JAMES   King's County (Offaly)   GALLEN
it has a map ref 33 and is a small farm of 10 acres and house valued at 15 shillings pa but I cant find it on the provided map for Lumcloon which is strange.  in can find properties up to 27 and then nothing so im missing less than ten map references. A first experience on this wonderful website since I stated using it.   I had thought seeing the actual homestead area on google maps would especially interest you both   

So instead of leaving you happily
I ask for help

25
Down / Re: JOHN STURGEON, Kilkeel, 1920
« on: Friday 09 April 21 13:05 BST (UK)  »
Using your material I jigged it around for my purposes and added bits
George Sturgeon a whitesmith in Castlewellan in 1897, a blacksmith  in kilkeel 1899 m 10 Oct 1897 St Malachy's RC Church, Castlewellan  Mary aka as Minnie Fleming at marriage b? d 1910 Kilkeel,  already a widow at the age of 33 [How do you know this ?surely shows when george died?] ; Witness was Mary A Fleming .see https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1897/10469/5812494.pdf  I have not found a death record for his father George.
children

JOHN Patrick STURGEON 8 Mar 1899 Kilkeel see https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1899/02055/1786202.pdf
d 6 Aug 1920 at Forster Green Hospital  Belfast [was mainly TB and chest]  at the age of 22 after service with the Royal Marines. His parents George Sturgeon and Mary Fleming were married in St Malachy's RC Church, Castlewellan on 10 Oct 1897. His mother Mary died in 1910 in Kilkeel, already a widow at the age of 33; I have not found a death record for his father George.
John Sturgeon's Pension Card gives his address as Bridge St, Kilkeel and his next-of-kin as his grandmother, Mary Ann Fleming.
Does anyone know where John Sturgeon is buried?

moved to Belfast by 1901 Census
38 in Friendly Street (Cromac, Antrim)
Sturgeon   George   24   Male   Head of Family   R Catholic   Co Down   Black Smith   Read and write   -   Married   -
Sturgeon   Mary   23   Female   Wife   R Catholic   Co Down   -   Cannot read   -   Married   
children
Sturgeon   Mary Ann   4   Female   Daughter   R Catholic   Belfast City   -   Cannot read   -   Not Married   -
Sturgeon   John   2   Male   Son   R Catholic   Belfast City   -   Cannot read   -   Not Married   -
Sturgeon   Mary   23   Female   Wife   R Catholic   Co Down   -   Cannot read   -   Married   -
I normally don’t quote the two civil entries  found  I leave it for you to look up . My transcription are a guide only which need checking, the same source will ask you to use the corrected material agreeing to their request but also can supply you formal copies for a small fee
MILITARY WISE
https://www.forces-war-records.co.uk/namesearch/?FirstName=john&Surname=Sturgeon&RecordType=NotSelected&RecordDateStartYear=1700&RecordDateEndYear=2021&Step=1&ReceivedGallantryAward=False
John   Sturgeon   Po.19158   Private   1918   Royal Marines   
John   Sturgeon   PO/19158   Private   1918   Royal Marine Light Infantry   
J   Sturgeon   Deal/12433(S)   Private   1918   Royal Marine Labour Corps   
you need to join, read their invitations, I have been a past member, its excellent
I didn’t find George Sturgeon’s death record
good luck onwards

26
Down / Re: Bridget O'Hare - county Down Ireland
« on: Wednesday 07 April 21 20:48 BST (UK)  »
Could the missing link be  in Griffiths Valuation of Ireland
O'Hara   Matthew   Clownagh   Drumcree   Armagh
O'Hara   Edward   Corcrain Tw of Portadown Moffett's Row   Drumcree   Armagh
I found this in https://www.failteromhat.com/post1845.php
then looked Matthew in
http://www.askaboutireland.ie/griffith-valuation/index.xml?action=doNameSearch&Submit.x=51&Submit.y=7&Submit=Submit&familyname=O%27Hara&firstname=matthew&baronyname=&countyname=ARMAGH&unionname=&parishname=DRUMCREE
the printed version detail listing of 1864 connects his location to be map reference 10 in the townland  of Clownagh in Drumcree civil parish . seems to be small farmer with 3 acres and house valued at £1 ten shill.pa

using a modern google map find  the west side of Portadown move down south a short distance to find the junction of  Northway the A3 Rd and Brownstown Rd, travel 500 ft southwards on the Brownstown Rdis roughly where the homestead was in  1864  having found a connection to this townland

moving back in time
http://www.irishgenealogyhub.com/armagh/tithe-applotments/drumcree-parish.php
O'Hara, Arthur-- Townland : Clounagh Year : 1828-Drumcree-Armagh
O'Hara, S.-- Townland : Ballymakone Year : 1828-Drumcree-Armagh
O'Hara, William-- Townland : Clounagh Year : 1828-Drumcree-Armagh
so Arthur and William might relatives names  in marriages etc of their children
running out of steam

27
Down / Re: Trying to locate an address
« on: Wednesday 07 April 21 19:12 BST (UK)  »
Kiltaglassan, you first reply was a winner, excellent work BallyaltikilliganG

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