19
Surrey / Re: Maria Smith - Removal orders and Workhouse Admission Mint St 1859
« on: Wednesday 12 October 16 04:40 BST (UK) »
I have had a look at LMA, records of removal orders for Bermondsey seem to start in 1862 which is unfortunate.
Show Posts
This section allows you to view all posts made by this member. Note that you can only see posts made in areas you currently have access to.
20
Surrey / Re: Maria Smith - Removal orders and Workhouse Admission Mint St 1859
« on: Saturday 08 October 16 11:50 BST (UK) »
There is a Edwin Smith who died 10/4/1859 in Manchester, St John the Evangelist listed Jun Qtr 1859 (8d 200) but he is only 17 years old.
If Edwin Smith died 1858/59 and the year of birth is accurate according to the censuses he would have been about 36 years old, so the death listed in Lancs BMD could be a possibility.
If Edwin Smith died 1858/59 and the year of birth is accurate according to the censuses he would have been about 36 years old, so the death listed in Lancs BMD could be a possibility.
21
Surrey / Re: Maria Smith - Removal orders and Workhouse Admission Mint St 1859
« on: Saturday 08 October 16 11:41 BST (UK) »
Apologies...I haven't worked on this side of the tree for a while, this was incorrect information that I didn't get around to changing previously, I probably should have picked it up with a marriage 30 years after the birth of a child! The 1881 census I have for Maria Ward lists her a widow, so William Ward must have died before then. It is quite possible that Maria and William never married.
Yes the baptism records for 4 of the children are on the same day do not mention that Edwin is deceased, bit unusual.
The birth place for Edwin in the 1851 census states London. The 1841 census lists him living in the parish of St George the Martyr Southwark, Surrey, but not born in the County. I have him with a birth year of approx 1824?
If I could find the removal orders for Maria it may shed some more light on the situation??
Yes the baptism records for 4 of the children are on the same day do not mention that Edwin is deceased, bit unusual.
The birth place for Edwin in the 1851 census states London. The 1841 census lists him living in the parish of St George the Martyr Southwark, Surrey, but not born in the County. I have him with a birth year of approx 1824?
If I could find the removal orders for Maria it may shed some more light on the situation??
22
Surrey / Maria Smith - Removal orders and Workhouse Admission Mint St 1859
« on: Saturday 08 October 16 07:26 BST (UK) »
Hi,
After some general thoughts and help.....
One of of my ancestors Maria Smith (born approx 1828) was admitted to the St Georges Workhouse, Mint St on 21/7/1859. She has her children with her - Lavinia Sarah aged 13, Elizabeth aged 10, Caroline aged 9, Emily aged 8, Alfred aged 6, Edwin aged 5, Susan aged 2 and Frederick aged 1 month.
The records states that they were subject to poor removal order St Mary Bermondsey, Widow of Edwin Smith Soap Maker Manchester. How long after the death of a spouse did families normally get removed? I can't find any removal order record, which I'm assuming there would be, perhaps I've been looking to long and can't see the forest for the trees!
I'm assuming Edwin Smith died somewhere in Lancashire if the workhouse mentioned Manchester (Manchester wouldn't be a birth place?) Fredrick's baptism record lists Edwin is the Father, so if this is correct, Edwin would have died after September 1858.
In 1851 the family (including Edwin Smith) is listed as living at 21 Pitt St, St George the Martyr, Southwark.
Maria Smith re-marries William Ward (another shoemaker) in 1894 with children born to this relationship - Matilda Maria in 1863 and Priscilla in 1866 (both in the parish of Bermondsey)
Thanks Mel
After some general thoughts and help.....
One of of my ancestors Maria Smith (born approx 1828) was admitted to the St Georges Workhouse, Mint St on 21/7/1859. She has her children with her - Lavinia Sarah aged 13, Elizabeth aged 10, Caroline aged 9, Emily aged 8, Alfred aged 6, Edwin aged 5, Susan aged 2 and Frederick aged 1 month.
The records states that they were subject to poor removal order St Mary Bermondsey, Widow of Edwin Smith Soap Maker Manchester. How long after the death of a spouse did families normally get removed? I can't find any removal order record, which I'm assuming there would be, perhaps I've been looking to long and can't see the forest for the trees!
I'm assuming Edwin Smith died somewhere in Lancashire if the workhouse mentioned Manchester (Manchester wouldn't be a birth place?) Fredrick's baptism record lists Edwin is the Father, so if this is correct, Edwin would have died after September 1858.
In 1851 the family (including Edwin Smith) is listed as living at 21 Pitt St, St George the Martyr, Southwark.
Maria Smith re-marries William Ward (another shoemaker) in 1894 with children born to this relationship - Matilda Maria in 1863 and Priscilla in 1866 (both in the parish of Bermondsey)
Thanks Mel
23
Kent / Re: Where is New Court Gravesend?
« on: Wednesday 05 October 16 06:30 BST (UK) »
This is fabulous, i didn't know this side by side map even existed.
24
Kent / Re: Where is New Court Gravesend?
« on: Wednesday 05 October 16 02:24 BST (UK) »
Thanks. The street immediately listed on the census after New Court is Princes St and immediately before is new court is West st. There are a couple of cottages listed in between New Court and West st (? Planes and Ditchburn's). The area covered (from my understanding of reading) is... to the west of high street, to the south of west street as far as new court, to the north of west st as far as western side of bank??, the east and west of new court, the east of princes st and the north side of New Road from Princes St to High St.
25
Kent / Where is New Court Gravesend?
« on: Wednesday 05 October 16 01:04 BST (UK) »
Hi,
I have an ancestor listed on the 1851 census as living in New court Gravesend. I haven't been able to find much information about the location of this address except..... from newspaper articles that it is at the north end of Red Lion Passage, West St, Gravesend. I have found West St on google maps, but nothing else when searching. I get the impression it wasn't an overly nice area to live. Can anyone shed some light on the location?
Thanks Mel
I have an ancestor listed on the 1851 census as living in New court Gravesend. I haven't been able to find much information about the location of this address except..... from newspaper articles that it is at the north end of Red Lion Passage, West St, Gravesend. I have found West St on google maps, but nothing else when searching. I get the impression it wasn't an overly nice area to live. Can anyone shed some light on the location?
Thanks Mel
26
London & Middlesex Lookup Requests / Re: Charles Pratt death 1871
« on: Thursday 08 September 16 23:40 BST (UK) »
The death certificate lists Charles death date as the 25th Oct 1871 which correlates with workhouse records, however the occupation is listed as Tailor, perhaps the informant gave the wrong information?
The informant is H M Simmonds - 66 Camberwell Rd Walworth. I have found him on the 1881 census and it lists him as a Doctor.
The informant is H M Simmonds - 66 Camberwell Rd Walworth. I have found him on the 1881 census and it lists him as a Doctor.
27
London & Middlesex Lookup Requests / Re: Charles Pratt death 1871
« on: Thursday 08 September 16 02:18 BST (UK) »
The death certificate for Charles Pratt states his occupation as tailor. As he died in the workhouse there are no other clues to link him to this family. I'm thinking it would be unusual for a son to come from a family of 'hawkers/travellers' that were not well off and probably couldn't read/write to then become a tailor? - I'm assuming some level of reading/education would have been needed for this job - any thoughts?