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Topics - Dulciebun

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Person sought:
Charles Denney, birth registered 1912 Manchester, mother Denney, illegitimate birth, he was given his mother's surname.

I have a few solid facts but need more details.

Charles Denney's mother was Katie Denney, she never married. She had another illegitimate son, John Benjamin Lewis, in 1922. Katie was born and raised in Birkenhead and only went to Manchester for a short period in order to 'conceal' the birth.

Family stories say that young Charles (Charlie) Denney was informally 'adopted out' of the family in 1922 or shortly after, when John Benjamin came along, since Katie couldn't care for both children. Charlie disappeared from the family circle and nobody currently knows what happened to him.

An Ancestry member has posted up details of a Charles Denny [no 'e'], born Manchester 1912, baptised Birkenhead 1916, who married in Dublin in the 1940s and died in Dublin in (I think) the 1980s. This seems to be a good match for Charlie (even though the spelling of the surname is slightly different), but I can't contact the Ancestry member because the account hasn't been used for some years and they don't log in.

1. How might I try to verify that this Charles Denny [no 'e'] who died in Dublin is the same person as the Charles Denney I seek?
2. Can anyone check church baptisms in Birkenhead to search for a Charles Denney bapt. 1916 (where there might be a father's name logged in the register)?
3. Any other suggestions?

Thank you, I'm grateful :-)

Family History Beginners Board / SHEPHERDSON, assistance with searching please
« on: Friday 07 June 19 09:06 BST (UK)  »
Seeking evidence of the following SHEPHERDSON family on the 1851 census (is a serious transcription/spelling error preventing me from finding them?)

Christopher Shepherdson, age '35' on 1841 census, born Yorkshire, stone mason;
Mary Shepherdson (nee Sedgwick, 1st marriage was to Spurr), age '40' on 1841 census, born Sheffield;

  and the children of this couple, all born Sheffield:

Benjamin Shepherdson bapt. 1826 Sheffield
Emma Shepherdson c. 1827
William Shepherdson c. 1832 - 1874
Christopher Shepherdson c. 1835
Mary Shepherdson bapt. 1838 Sheffield.

Further details: son William Shepherdson (got married 1853 in Manchester to Sarah) is findable in Manchester on the 1861, a stone mason.

In 1841 the family is together in Wath upon Dearne (Swinton), north of Sheffield.

The spellings of the surname are fluid e.g. I've seen Shepardson, Shepheardson, Sheppardson, and William's 1853 marriage is wrongly recorded as Sheffordson.

BUT: What happened to the father & mother Christopher + Mary Shepherdson?
Is the whole family still together somewhere in 1851?
Did the parents go to Manchester along with the children, or did they stay in Sheffield? I can't find any evidence of this couple after 1841.

Thank you for your sharp eyes.

Look up requested, please... parish registers, Shrewsbury.

Seeking further details of marriage entry for JOHN GARDNER and ELIZABETH TILL in St Chad's Church Shrewsbury, 9 Nov 1818.

1. Is John Gardner's father named in the marriage record?
2. It's been suggested that John Gardner came from Tewkesbury, Glos, but I can't find any confirmation - please can you assist?

Thank you, Dulciebun

HELP please (look-up, suggestions), with SPURR in Sheffield, late 1700s, early- mid 1800s.

Can you find any additional records which relate to these SPURR lads:

1. Robert SPURR, baptised Sheffield Cathedral 1797 parents Thomas + Mary SPURR.
Best guess/best fit is that this Robert SPURR married Mary Sedgwick, Sheffield 1816.
Baby Ann SPURR baptised Sheffield Cathedral 1817, parents Robert SPURR + Mary, who are presumably the above couple.
Then I can find nothing more.
What happened to Robert?

2. Samuel SPURR. Born circa 1803/4 (see censuses 1841/51/61, Sheffield Park, Granville Street).
I'm wanting proof that Samuel Spurr is a younger brother of Robert Spurr (above) with parents Thomas + Mary SPURR.

There is a baptism for Samuel SPURR in Sheffield Cathedral 1803, parents 'John + Mary' SPURR: could 'Thomas' have been mis-transcribed as 'John'? because otherwise this is a good fit for Samuel.

On the censuses 1841 - 61 Samuel SPURR lives with Mary (wife).
Possible Sheffield Cathedral marriage 1825 - but what is Mary's maiden name?

And I can't find any baptismal records for Samuel + Mary SPURR's children i.e. Henry, Ann, Sarah, Frances (Fanny), all born Sheffield, ages 20, 15, 10, 3 respectively on the 1841.

Samuel SPURR (b.1803/4) lives next door to Charles SPURR (b.1805/6) for decades. [Sheffield Park, Granville Street.] What is the relationship here? Are they brothers?

Where is the baptism record for Charles & Mary Spurr's daughter Emma SPURR born c. 1837?

Where did this Charles SPURR get married? His wife's name ought to be Mary WARD but I can't find a wedding anywhere.

Which church were Charles & Samuel SPURR using?
Are there any Sheffield churches which have lost all their records from this period?

Other (later) addresses for these Spurrs include South Street Sheffield, Talbot Terrace - all in Sheffield Park.

Lots of mysteries here! Please help me fill in the gaps.
Thank you.


Please help me find records for the first marriage for WILLIAM HINKS.

Born & baptised Leicestershire 1800 (village of Enderby, between Leicester and Hinckley).
   Father Richard Hinks, mother Rebecca.
William Hinks remarried in Nuneaton as a widower in 1846. Spouse Eleanor Handley.
   Always a Carpenter/joiner, wherever mentioned.
He moved to Cubbington (south of Coventry). Easy to find on later censuses.
   He had just the one son with Eleanor i.e. James Hinks born c.1850, James went to Aston, shoemaker.

What I need:
Evidence of WILLIAM HINKS' first marriage. When, where, which spouse?
And especially: evidence of birth of William Hinks' daughter CAROLINE HINKS circa 1827.
(I can't locate either of them on 1841 census nor any birth for Caroline.)

I've ruled out William Hinks + Hannah Argyle, banns 1821 Nuneaton, marriage Birmingham 1822 (anyone know why the banns were a year before the marriage?) He's a maltster, not my man.

All suggestions welcome, thank you very much. Please amend any of my details here if incorrect.


Please suggest possible reasons why a family is using a different (false?) surname on the census while living away from their home base.

My ancestor Henry SPUR(R) married Caroline HINKS (poss. Hincks) in Nuneaton, Warks in 1846.

The 1851 census shows them living in Manchester, Henry is a stone mason, they have one small son William Henry - but their surname is SHEPPARD. However, they have baptised their son as SPURR.

The 1861 census shows Caroline a widow, with sons William Henry, Christopher, and baby daughter Elizabeth. Caroline gives her surname as SHEPHERD. (She couldn't write, so must have spoken her name, and the spelling is variable). But Christopher and Elizabeth have also been baptised as SPURR.

Caroline, a widow, returns to her home area (presumably Warks/Leics borders) and remarries in 1864 as SPURR. (She becomes Oswin).

      Why is this family using a different (false) name for census purposes? Is Henry Spurr hiding from something? (criminal proceedings?)

      Caroline re-states the different surname (Shepherd) in Manchester just after Henry's death in early 1861, but reverts to her married name Spurr when re-marrying. Was it 'safe' to state the Spurr, now Henry had gone?

     I can't crack this, and I can't find the correct Henry Spur/r or Caroline Hinks (Hincks) on the 1841 census nor any suitable birth for either of them.

Extra details, potential clues:
    in 1846 Henry Spur(r) gave his father's name as Robert Spur, carpenter.
    In 1846 Caroline Hinks (Hincks) gave her father's name as William Hinks, carpenter.
    In 1851 "Henry Sheppard's" birth place is given as Sheffield.
    Caroline's birthplace is given as Leicester, then Coventry, then Leicester.
    Caroline's second marriage is in Coventry.
    In 1864 Caroline Spurr gave her father's name as William Hinks, joiner.
    In 1879 Elizabeth Spurr, daughter of Henry + Caroline, gave her father's name as WILLIAM Henry Spurr, stonemason. But both of her older brothers stated 'Henry Spurr' on their wedding details. Was he a William?

     Caroline and her new husband set up home in Aston, Birmingham, and remain there. Why did they go there, in particular?

     Where does the SHEPPARD/SHEPHERD come from, and for what reason or purpose were they using it?

Very grateful for all suggestions. I could be mistaken in any of the above details and if I am, please tell me. Thank you.


Regarding the place-name THREEPWOOD. I know of an area called Threepwood in the west of Scotland UK. I also know that Scottish and other settlers took place names with them when settling in new lands.

Is there a THREEPWOOD anywhere in New Zealand, please? If so, where is it, and who conveyed the name to NZ? And what is the area currently like, and who lives there now? (Surnames, nationalities of residents etc, would be very useful).

Thank you. x

Antrim / McTIMLEY, McTIMONEY, help with Irish/Antrim records, please
« on: Thursday 07 December 17 19:24 GMT (UK)  »
Please help me find the background of my Irish ancestor JOHN McTIMONEY

The romantic & dramatic family legend says he had to flee from Ireland to England, and change his name.
I rather think he came over to England for financial reasons and, since he could not sign his name on his marriage certificate (and must have had quite an accent), nobody knew quite how to spell it.

His history remains a mystery. Can you shed any light?

McTIMONEY seems a made-up name. All the McTIMONEYS I can find, stem from this one man.

John's marriage certificate (1874, McTIMLEY, not McTimoney) states that his father is/was James McTIMLEY, a butcher, presumably in Northern Ireland.

The censuses state that John was born in Belfast.
He was definitely an accomplished shoe-maker.

John's DOB, according to the censuses, seems to be about 1834, however my mother remembered him from her childhood and he seemed to her an old man, with a shock of white hair, older than 66 when he died.

Some years ago a researcher believed she had found him recorded as a cobbler in Northampton (Trade Directory? Northampton had a big boot & shoe industry), but I cannot now locate the record.

Where was John in 1841? and 1851? and 1861? (After that he was in Birmingham).
When did he come over to England (or Scotland?), and how?
Who was James McTimley, butcher? And who was John's mother?

And why and how did the name change to McTimoney, which it has remained?

Thank you for all suggestions. :-)

Searching for death or re-marriage record for Rosetta COPE nee CRANMER, born 1851. No sightings after 1881.

Born 20.3. 1851 as Rosetta CRANMER, baptised 1859 as Rose CRANMER.
Rose CRANMER married Henry COPE in 1872, Hackney/Woolwich/Greenwich area.

1881 census shows Rose COPE (wife, aged 30) in a property on her own, in Walthamstow. Husband Henry Cope is with his brother, elsewhere.
1882 Rose COPE has a son, Frank Henry COPE.
Then nothing.

1891 Henry COPE says he's a widower (he has little Frank with him), and he remarries in 1893.

Looks like Frank Henry Cope was Rose Cope's first child after 9 years of marriage, she'd have been 31, it would have been dangerous in the 1880s - the child lived, but did she survive?

I can't find any credible Death record for a Rose or Rosetta Cope in the 1880s in this area (Middlesex/Essex).
Are there any Nonconformist registers we can consult?
Rose Cranmer/Cope came from a Scottish/Irish family and could have been Presbyterian.

If not, are there any Missing Person registers, from the 1880s?

Rose COPE disappears from sight after the birth of the child in 1882, which is very puzzling, since her husband lives till 1902 and her mother Esther CRANMER is in service close by and lives to 1894.
Henry COPE, widower, remarries a servant-girl who worked with Esther Cranmer, and whose family (Aylett) is a neighbour to the Copes, as if this girl had been chosen (or invited?) to replace a lost wife.

Other possible scenario is that Henry COPE began a liaison with the girl who became his second wife, and Rose COPE objected and left (and remarried)?

Suggestions please, for lines of enquiry. Many thanks.

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